Color issues with C41 development. Inconsistent results

[perrodelsur]

Sadly it seems the website where I got it from is dead.

https://web.archive.org/web/2017070...way-to-color-correct-c-41-negative-film-scans Here's a link to the web archive.

I got the PS actions and Ill try it with test negatives using the phone camera, just to compare with my scans.

I dont want to be a bother, but:
- Would you consider 10 seconds of agitation too much? Since you use the same method as I do, I can use your timing as a reference (instructions usually come for inversion method)
- From the comparison Scanza scanner its probably the culprint of the redcast, lab scans colors look perfect, would you agree?

 

[Cholentpot]

I got the PS actions and Ill try it with test negatives using the phone camera, just to compare with my scans.

I dont want to be a bother, but:
- Would you consider 10 seconds of agitation too much? Since you use the same method as I do, I can use your timing as a reference (instructions usually come for inversion method)
- From the comparison Scanza scanner its probably the culprint of the redcast, lab scans colors look perfect, would you agree?

Honestly I'm not a stickler for perfect agitation. A twist here or there has really made no difference. Nor do a few dozen seconds on either side. I tend to err on over development. I agitate every 30 seconds for 5-10 seconds. Not to rough or gentle.

As for the Scanza, is it scanning straight to JPEG and inverting? I never used a machine like that. I use a DSLR. While my scanning solution is complicated and really gobbles up space on my computer it seems pretty accurate.

As an aside, the past few years I really struggled with getting my negatives developed with correct color. I only started shooting with fresh film recently so I always attributed problems to the film. I'm going to be developing all my summer photos in the next few months and I'll see how my methods hold up.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Another possible solution with your Scanza: you might try downloading the trial version of Vuescan. It replaces the built-in scanner software for pretty nearly every scanner sold in the past thirty years, and does a better job than the scanner maker's software in most cases -- as well as not requiring an OS driver (it works directly with the hardware). If you like it, it's inexpensive (8-10 rolls of film equivalent) to buy and get full features.

If Vuescan Trial gives you good color, then you can be more confident that the problem is the Scanza software, and not your development or the Scanza hardware.

 

[mklw1954]

You are bringing the chemicals to the proper temperature but if your tank/reels/film are at a lower temperature, the developer temperature decreases when added to the tank. I bring the tank/reels/film to the developer temperature before starting development. I use a small insulated cooler; when the cooler water temperature remains constant at the developer temperature you know the tank/rels/film are at the right temperature and when you add the chemicals their temperature won't change. This also helps maintain the proper temperature of the tank between agitations.

 

[perrodelsur]

Hello people!

Im sorry I took so long to post the update. I took in all suggestions and did a lot of testing and found the issue:

The scanner! (Kodak Scanza)

It was randomly messing with the color of all my pictures, mainly with Magenta and Cyan. I got a Epson V600 and the difference is massive, Im a lot more confident on my development process.

Again I want to thank everybody that contributed, Im giving free scans and roll developments in Panama for everybody in this thread! (for real haha)

This are original scans no color correction, no edits nor lightroom:

 

[koraks]

Looks good! That scanner was a good investment.

 

[Donald Qualls]

So you upgraded from a Yugo to a reasonably current Ford. Makes a big difference, sure enough. For most of us, once you learn how to get the most out of that V600, it'll do everything needed. Longer term, getting height adjustable negative carriers (to optimize scanner focus) and/or a fluid mount adapter (to eliminate artifacts relative to media/air and glass/air surfaces near the plane of focus, and ensure genuinely flat negatives), and possibly upgrading your scanning software, will get additional (much smaller) increments of quality.

Since I shoot 4x5 as well as smaller formats, what I want to do can't be managed with a V600 (scanning light window in the lid is too narrow), but if 120 is as big as you go, that V600 should serve you well. Fortunately, I can get what I need with my (roundly ten year old) Perfection 4870 and a set of 4900 negative carriers modified to fit. A V750 (LED scan light, no warm up time, 4x5 capable) is on my list of things to shop for if Congress ever coughs up another Economic Impact Payment. Along with a wide angle for my RB67, and/or an M645 kit. The Lottery board has been slacking...

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hello people!

Im sorry I took so long to post the update. I took in all suggestions and did a lot of testing and found the issue:

The scanner! (Kodak Scanza)

It was randomly messing with the color of all my pictures, mainly with Magenta and Cyan. I got a Epson V600 and the difference is massive, Im a lot more confident on my development process.

Again I want to thank everybody that contributed, Im giving free scans and roll developments in Panama for everybody in this thread! (for real haha)

This are original scans no color correction, no edits nor lightroom:
View attachment 260981 View attachment 260982 View attachment 260980

It seems that many film development problems are really scanner problems.

 

[MattKing]

So you upgraded from a Yugo to a reasonably current Ford.

I do wonder if those "Yugo" scanners could be improved with better processors and software.
Much like contact proof sheets, I think there is a real value in something that provides relatively quick, relatively good quality lower resolution scans.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Knowing what I know now, after having tried to save my 1998 vintage scanner (vs. having to spend money to get another one ten or so years newer) I'd start by downloading the free trial of Vuescan. It gives you direct control of a lot of stuff that's "automatic" (as in: "You don't need to adjust this, we just assume you won't know how anyway.") in the manufacturer's scanning software with lower-end scanners. If you find (as you probably will) that Vuescan does a better job than your scanner's original software, you can buy it (costs about like two C-41 kits or 8-10 rolls of Kodak film) without needing to get a CD or reinstall, and free upgrades (most of which seem to be support for more and more off-the-wall scanner hardware, much of which lacks even vaguely current drivers or never had drivers, for instance for Linux).

That Scanza is almost certainly capable of giving correct color with software that doesn't make unwarranted assumptions. That said, the V600 is surely a better scanner, overall, with capability for medium format as well as third party support for things like 110 and 126 film (which won't work in the factory carriers), but even the V600 is likely to improve with use of Vuescan, once you go through its learning curve.

 

[mohmad khatab]

Hi, notables.
I extend my respect and appreciation to the author of the post. This is a respectable man and I totally agree with him about not tampering with the image with Photoshop or any similar app.
Of course, the respected professors answered your inquiry with many explanations.
- But I want to give you brotherly advice. I don’t know if you will accept it or not ,,
- I advise you that you should use a bleaching solution prior to using (Belix) for at least three minutes, trust me ,, the results will improve significantly.
You can use an inexpensive bleach solution such as copper sulfate with ammonium chloride, 25 of each type with half a liter of water.
Happy Merry Christmas