Cocked or Uncocked?

[SodaAnt]

I have two MF camera systems, RB67 and Hasselblad 501CM. Should these cameras be stored with the shutter cocked and the mirror in the down position, or shutter uncocked and mirror up?

 

[neilt3]

Start a poll .
I bet you get 50:50 split on the response .

Such as my Bronica cameras ( SQ-Ai , ETRSi etc ) , require you to cock the shutter to remove the lens and so on .
My Kiev 88 always has it's shutter cocked . The Mamiya TLR's are typically un-cocked , unless there's film in the camera , in which case I always wind on to protect the exposed negative .

 

[Pieter12]

I have two MF camera systems, RB67 and Hasselblad 501CM. Should these cameras be stored with the shutter cocked and the mirror in the down position, or shutter uncocked and mirror up?

Not sure about leaving the shutter cocked on a Hasselblad, although that is what I do. The manual states to exercise the shutter if the camera or lens has been sitting unused for a long period of time, by running it through all the speeds with the magazine removed.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Hasselblad has published many times that their cameras and lenses have been designed to be stored in the cocked position.

For other cameras check with the manufacturer or RTFM.

 

[Alan9940]

My Hasselblad 500C/M and associated lenses are stored in the cocked position. All other cameras and LF lenses are stored uncocked.

 

[SodaAnt]

Hasselblad has published many times that their cameras and lenses have been designed to be stored in the cocked position.

For other cameras check with the manufacturer or RTFM.

Thanks for the info on the Hassy.

As far as the RB67 TFM goes, it does have a section on storage, but doesn't mention whether the camera should be stored cocked or uncocked.

 

[SodaAnt]

How about storing film backs? I assume they should be stored with the darkslide out (assuming they aren't loaded with film) to prevent compression of the felt?

 

[MattKing]

I have two MF camera systems, RB67 and Hasselblad 501CM. Should these cameras be stored with the shutter cocked and the mirror in the down position, or shutter uncocked and mirror up?

What sort of storage duration are you considering?
Just use or exercise them at least every few months.

 

[Sirius Glass]

What sort of storage duration are you considering?
Just use or exercise them at least every few months.

My Hasselblad repairman said that all lenses with shutters, not just Hasselblad, should be fired 10 to 15 times at 1 second every three months. Also moving the iris full open to full close would be advised.

 

[SodaAnt]

Here's another question related to storage. I recently acquired this Hasselblad 501CM that was made in 2000, but had been stored almost since that time. Here's what the rear shutter (is that what it's called?) looks like. Is this a concern?

 

[eli griggs]

Looks like mildew to me.

 

[SodaAnt]

Looks like mildew to me.

The camera was stored in a room with the humidity around 30%. I don’t think it’s mildew.

I looked at a bunch of eBay listings for the 501CM from Japanese sellers. In the majority of them, the auxiliary shutter looked just like mine. I suspect this is a common thing with these cameras.

Perhaps one of the Hasselblad experts on here can give an opinion.

 

[Edgy01]

What you see in that image is the special Hasselblad coating failing with time. I use Aerospace 303 to treat those surfaces and any further degradation ends. It’s a sort of poor palpa coating that was supposed to reduce reflections in the mirror box area. I have yet to see any late Hasselblad NOT have that issue.

From a mechanical engineering perspective, the only time a spring suffers from wear is during its use—storage in either extended or contracted position, does nothing to increase ‘wear.’

 

[SodaAnt]

What you see in that image is the special Hasselblad coating failing with time. I use Aerospace 303 to treat those surfaces and any further degradation ends. It’s a sort of poor palpa coating that was supposed to reduce reflections in the mirror box area. I have yet to see any late Hasselblad NOT have that issue.

Interesting. How do you apply the Aerospace 303 and how much do you use? Is it a one-time treatment, or does it require additional applications?

From a mechanical engineering perspective, the only time a spring suffers from wear is during its use—storage in either extended or contracted position, does nothing to increase ‘wear.’

Thanks. I'm an EE, not an ME, so I didn't know that. I'll file it away for future reference.

 

[Philippe-Georges]

Almost all the German (and by extension European) made photographic camera systems using springs are, at their cocked position, only burdened (is this the correct expression?) for +/- 80% of their capacity, and can be safely stored cocked (and some should be so).
This goes for Leitz-, Zeiss Ikon-, Voigtländer-, Linhof-, Hasselblad-, Compur- and Prontor- shutter systems, and alike.
Regardless it be focal- or central shutters.
And yes, running mechanical shutters regularly is good (just like your muscles).

The famous camera repairman Will van Manen told me so.

I don't know about the Japan and USA made cameras/shutters.

 

[Edgy01]

When I use Aerospace 303 on the internal non-reflective surfaces of my Hasselblad cameras all I am doing is trying to slow down the degradation of the palpas surfaces. I take everything off that is removable, like lenses, focusing screens, etc., and then do it with the mirror locked up, and then with the mirror down. I use q-tip wetted with the 303 but don’t go crazy with the stuff. Ultimately, I think the palpas stuff is drying out so all I want to do is refresh it a tiny bit. I think they most important surfaces are on the shutter both on the side facing the film backs, and the side facing the body. I’m not a Hasselblad repairman, by any means, but it seems to help. Perhaps a real repairman can jump in And say “oh, no!” Of course, it does not attract dust or any other bad stuff.

dan

 

[BMbikerider]

Start a poll .
I bet you get 50:50 split on the response .

Such as my Bronica cameras ( SQ-Ai , ETRSi etc ) , require you to cock the shutter to remove the lens and so on .
My Kiev 88 always has it's shutter cocked . The Mamiya TLR's are typically un-cocked , unless there's film in the camera , in which case I always wind on to protect the exposed negative .

But with the Mamiya TLR after winding on and decide you are not going to take another picture, you can always fire the shutter and re-cock it without winding on.
I don't understand the need to protect the film frame which has been exposed. The lens will do that, or if you remove the lens then the blanking plate fitted to the body covers the film chamber

It is a known and proven fact that anything mechanical which has a spring constantly under tension will, over time weaken the spring and the precise adjustment will drift away from the optimum.
With electronic shutters, most that I am aware of, do not rely upon springs but on electrical current to work therefor there should be no difference if you leave an electrical shutter cocked or otherwise.

My Nikon F2a and FT3 both mechanical cameras are always left un cocked, while my AF models with electronic shutters are left either way and have suffered no ill affects.

 

[Ian C]

See page 11 under the heading “Removing the Lens” in the Mamiya RB67 manual. It advises the user to store the lens uncocked. It makes no mention of the mirror. It seems to me that if it’s good practice to store the lens with its shutter spring relaxed, then logically, the same principle applies to the spring that powers the mirror and light baffle.

https://www.cameramanuals.org/mamiya_pdf/mamiya_rb67_professional.pdf

Also, see page 41 in the RZ67 Pro II manual under “Storage.” It advises the user to store the RZ67 Pro II with the mirror and lens shutters with their springs uncocked.

https://www.mr-alvandi.com/downloads/camera-and-accessorys-manuals/mamiya-rz67-proII-manual.pdf

This advice is from the engineers of the company that designed and manufactured these cameras and lenses.

 

[neilt3]

But with the Mamiya TLR after winding on and decide you are not going to take another picture, you can always fire the shutter and re-cock it without winding on.
I don't understand the need to protect the film frame which has been exposed. The lens will do that, or if you remove the lens then the blanking plate fitted to the body covers the film chamber

I have five Mamiya TLRs, one of them has a faulty mechanism that prevents you removing a lens if the baffle isn't down .
So to prevent a mishap , I wind the film on so only an unexposed piece of film is in place .
So no big deal if I took the lens off without checking .
Also without the interlock , it's possible you could release the retaining spring while taking the camera out of a bag and release the lens .
No big deal to wind on .

Regards the Kiev 88, you need to wind the film on to cock the shutter before you adjust the shutter speed to prevent damage .It also needs winding on to reset the mirror , so why not have it wound on while your walking around , ready to use ?

When I'm done using a camera for a while ( I've a fair few to work my way through!) I'll release the shutters and so on before returning them to the shelf before selecting the next camera to be used .

 

[BMbikerider]

I have five Mamiya TLRs, one of them has a faulty mechanism that prevents you removing a lens if the baffle isn't down .
So to prevent a mishap , I wind the film on so only an unexposed piece of film is in place .
So no big deal if I took the lens off without checking .
Also without the interlock , it's possible you could release the retaining spring while taking the camera out of a bag and release the lens .

You did not mention the fact that one of your cameras was faulty which is what I based my answer on. We cannot respond accurately if we do not have all the information!

Do you not have the lens caps so should you 'inadvertently' release the shutter no damage would be done?

It is still bad practise to leave a spring tensioned. With my two Nikons they also get a regular firing of the shutters if they are not used for a month or so even when left uncocked.

 

[snusmumriken]

It is still bad practise to leave a spring tensioned.

More than a million Rollei 35 cameras would gainsay this, because you can't stow the lens away unless the shutter is cocked. When Amateur Photographer reviewed the original version early on, they raised the issue, but were assured by Rollei that any self-respecting spring would be fine if stored cocked. Obviously we don't know how many of these cameras are still functioning, but they seem to be very commonly available in FWO.

The advice to exercise the mechanism is surely to do with the lubricant, isn't it?

 

[Pieter12]

Any camera with a winder will advance to the next frame and cock the shutter. So leaving the shutter cocked is pretty much standard that way.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Any camera with a winder will advance to the next frame and cock the shutter. So leaving the shutter cocked is pretty much standard that way.

+1

 

[BMbikerider]

Any camera with a winder will advance to the next frame and cock the shutter. So leaving the shutter cocked is pretty much standard that way.

Yes but they are nearly always equipped with electronic shutters so it makes very little difference makes very little difference, they are not so nearly like to stress the mechanism. Look at my entry at reply no 17 paragraph three.

 

[Pieter12]

Yes but they are nearly always equipped with electronic shutters so it makes very little difference makes very little difference, they are not so nearly like to stress the mechanism. Look at my entry at reply no 17 paragraph three.

The F3 can be equipped with a winder that will leave the shutter cocked. And most earlier cameras that came with or could be equipped with motor drives would be the same. On the other hand, my Leica M5 turns on the meter cell when advanced, so I always leave it uncocked.