Choosing my first camera

[Chan Tran]

The Leica M6 is in a separate league of among the cameras mentioned. It's a great camera but it's much more expensive than the rest and it's a rangefinder which can be better or worse depending your preference.
I would recommend the Nikon FM, FM2(n). They are reliable and there are a lot of lenses to choose from.

 

[John Koehrer]

And for another two cents worth. Eliminate the Leica, Rollei, most if not all compact, pocketable cameras. They're not as versatile as
an SLR but are more compact and lighter.

The Pentax K 1000 was one of the most popular cameras for high school basic photography classes when they were introduced.
The battery is only for the meter.. The ME, ME super, MX and LX was sold at the same time as the K1000and were smaller and lighter.
ME is fully automatic, ME Super is Auto with manual controls, MX us full manual battery for meter only and the LX is the full system(pro) camera.
MX and LX are out of you budget. The rest are maybe's dependent on local sales fluctuations like church, boot, retail or personal sales.

The Olympus Om-1 and OM-2 are the same size. The 2 is battery dependant where the 1 is not. I don't think you can buy an OM3 or 4 anywhere near your budget.

Canon AE-1 probably did the most to popularize 35mm camera sales when it came out but I think most people used it in automatic rather
than manually. The drawback to the AE-1 is the fact that using the meter in manual was awkward because you took your light reading
and took the camera down from your eye to set the controls. The AE-1p gave several auto modes and a convenient manual mode.
They're all battery dependent and larger & heavier than Olympus and Pentax.

Minolta SRt 100, 101, and 102 are all full manual, battery is only for meter. The battery was discontinued long ago but there are workarounds.
Heavier and larger than OM's and Pentax M cameras

XD-7 and XD-11 give manual and automatic features and are nice cameras
The XE-5 and XE-7 give manual and auto settings.
The shutters are electronically controlled and battery dependent.
ALL of the X cameras are battery dependent. XE and XD are larger than Pentax and Olympus

To make it clear as mud, The Pentax K1000 is larger & heavier not battery dependent, LX, ME, MESuper, are all battery dependendent
Canon A series ARE ALL battery dependent.

Olympus and Pentax are the smallest and lightest of the list. Clear yet?

 

[Sirius Glass]

I did very well for decades with Minolta slrs, SR-7, SRT101, SRT102, SRT201, ... 570, X700.

Welcome to APUG Photrio!!

 

[joelbolden]

There is no single best for your purpose; any one of several smaller, lighter, SLRs from a reputable manufacturer will do.

Having said that, some Pentax and Olympus models from the late 1980s are a bit smaller and lighter than most Nikons and Canons from the same era.

The Pentax MX was the all-mechanical version of the Pentax ME Super. The MX is about the same size as the ME Super, but a few grams heavier. Being a mechanical camera, the MX will work without a battery; I don't believe the ME Super will work with a dead battery, tho it might work at 1/125th second shutter speed, only? I've used both, and I prefer the MX because it works more like what I was used to - but the ME Super offers automatic exposure, it that is important to you. (Auto exposure requires "A" series lenses.) Fortunately, batteries last a long time in these cameras (unless you forget to turn off the meter when you are not using them), and they are quite small, so carrying spares is not a hassle.

Personally, I have carried Pentax MX bodies and Pentax lenses on bicycle trips totalling about 6,000-7,000 miles - never had any problems with them.

My advice for anyone who wants to buy a classic, film-era SLR for a big adventure would be to have a CLA (clean, lube, and adjust) done by a reputable service person before you leave.

I have 14 film cameras equally divided between Pentax and Minolta that range anywhere from basic (MX, SRT201) to advanced Dynax 7, Pentax Z-1, Z-1P) and the one I use the most is the MX. It does have a battery powered LED style meter which is simple to learn, but it doesn't require one. When I bike I wear a chest harness that holds it in place. The advice to have any of the older analog cameras CLA'd is not only good advice, but a necessity if you're contemplating multi-day treks. I do have an ME Super, but for some reason I rarely use it; relying on the MX or XD-7/11. The XD-11 is a great camera, but they tend to be a bit delicate; the MX is built like a small tank.

 

[Paul Howell]

Underrated and off people's radar is the Pentax ZM a manual version of the autofocus P30. Will work with Pentax k and AF K in manual mode. Very light with built in motor advance. Other thought is a MInolta 7000. Although an autofocus camera it can in manual meter mode with the AF turned off, many sharp lens and runs on AAA batteries.

 

[runswithsizzers]

Maggie, Will you be making one-day trips on your bicycle, or do you plan on cycle touring for multi-day trips? Will you be riding on hard-surface roads, or some gravel/dirt roads, too?

Honestly, I would not switch to a film camera just before a long distance trip. You will want to start out with short rolls of film and see the processed results as quickly as possible while you are learning how to shoot film. With a digital camera you can check your results immediately, and learn as you go, but with film it may be days or weeks before you can see how things are going.

I don't know how different your Australian version of eBay is from what I use in the USA, but personally, I never mess with bidding on auction items. Too time consuming, and it's too easy to pay too much. I only look at "Buy It Now" offers, and if I think it's a fair price, I'll buy it; simple. Using eBay has the advantage of being able to select gear from from a wide range of sellers all over the country (and in other countries, too), so your local high-demand conditions are not a factor. On the other hand, if you have a local used camera dealer, it is a huge advantage to be able to see and handle the camera before you buy it, and, hopefully, they will take it back if it doesn't work. Those advantages make it worth paying more.

 

[MaggieSz]

@CMoore yes you are right that all the SLR are quite heavy, and might not be a huge difference, but there always is. I just know that I want my first camera to be non plastic, classic SLR.

I should also say, that I'm doing only short trips on my bike at the moment, as winter is coming to Australia. I'm planning to go for a big trip maybe in December, so hopefully until then I will learn something, maybe even get second camera, like half frame Olympus Trip or similar.
I am a PhD student and one of my research method is ethnography. I am taking a lot of pictures of the streets and buildings mainly. I think good old SLR would definitely be useful for my project too. So I would like to use it as every day camera too, not just for travelling purposes.

@ciniframe Yes I considered the costs, but it's only around 20$ here to get it send in digital format, and then I can print out my favourite ones; so it's not too bad, every couple of months or so.

Thanks everyone, I have a lot to learn!

 

[MaggieSz]

And for another two cents worth. Eliminate the Leica, Rollei, most if not all compact, pocketable cameras. They're not as versatile as
an SLR but are more compact and lighter.

The Pentax K 1000 was one of the most popular cameras for high school basic photography classes when they were introduced.
The battery is only for the meter.. The ME, ME super, MX and LX was sold at the same time as the K1000and were smaller and lighter.
ME is fully automatic, ME Super is Auto with manual controls, MX us full manual battery for meter only and the LX is the full system(pro) camera.
MX and LX are out of you budget. The rest are maybe's dependent on local sales fluctuations like church, boot, retail or personal sales.

The Olympus Om-1 and OM-2 are the same size. The 2 is battery dependant where the 1 is not. I don't think you can buy an OM3 or 4 anywhere near your budget.

Canon AE-1 probably did the most to popularize 35mm camera sales when it came out but I think most people used it in automatic rather
than manually. The drawback to the AE-1 is the fact that using the meter in manual was awkward because you took your light reading
and took the camera down from your eye to set the controls. The AE-1p gave several auto modes and a convenient manual mode.
They're all battery dependent and larger & heavier than Olympus and Pentax.

Minolta SRt 100, 101, and 102 are all full manual, battery is only for meter. The battery was discontinued long ago but there are workarounds.
Heavier and larger than OM's and Pentax M cameras

XD-7 and XD-11 give manual and automatic features and are nice cameras
The XE-5 and XE-7 give manual and auto settings.
The shutters are electronically controlled and battery dependent.
ALL of the X cameras are battery dependent. XE and XD are larger than Pentax and Olympus

To make it clear as mud, The Pentax K1000 is larger & heavier not battery dependent, LX, ME, MESuper, are all battery dependendent
Canon A series ARE ALL battery dependent.

Olympus and Pentax are the smallest and lightest of the list. Clear yet?

Thanks John. It couldn't be better explained!

@runswithsizzers I should also say, that I'm doing only short trips on my bike at the moment, as winter is coming to Australia. I'm planning to go for a big trip maybe in December, so hopefully until then I will learn something, maybe even get second camera, like half frame Olympus Trip or similar.
I am a PhD student and one of my research method is ethnography. I am taking a lot of pictures of the streets and buildings mainly. I think good old SLR would definitely be useful for my project too. So I would like to use it as every day camera too, not just for travelling purposes.
I won't be doing much off road/dirt roads trips. Good tip about bidding on e-bay too, haven't thought about it this way. Generally, most of the cameras are on auctions here though.
There are many Minoltas, so maybe I should look into them.
Basically I think Olympus Om-1 and 2, some Pentax Me, Me super and Minoltas will be my search focus for now.

Does anyone have an experience and can tell me how different are Minoltas SRT101, SRT102, SRT201 and XD-11, XG2 ?

 

[alanrockwood]

My suggestion is to opt for something a little less than vintage and buy a Canon Rebel T2 film camera. That's the US model designation. In Europe it is known as 300X, and in Japan it is known as Kiss 7. This is the last and best of the Canon Rebel film cameras. It is small, light, easy to use, and an excellent picture taker. It has automatic exposure control and automatic focus, though those features can be over-ridden easily if you want to shoot in manual mode.

As for lenses, the most practical choice, given your budget and application, would be a 28-90mm zoom lens. You can probably find this kit (camera body and lens) for around $50 to $100 US on ebay, though sometimes you may find them selling for more or less than that amount. If you are lucky you might find one with a 24-85mm or 28-105mm zoom lens within your budget, either of which would be a step up from the 28-90mm zoom lens.

If you want to choose a single focal length rather than a zoom lens then consider getting a 50mm f/1.8 Yongnuo lens. You can usually find these for around $50 US, brand new. The advantage is that the lens is faster than the zoom lenses (i.e. is capable of letting in more light), which allows you to shoot in dimmer light without slowing the shutter speed too much, and the pictures will be a little sharper with this lens rather than a zoom lens, provided you do your part of holding the camera steady. However, it doesn't zoom, so you may have to resort to "zooming with your feet" in a lot of cases.

Another option would be a Canon Rebel 2000. It's an earlier version of the Rebel film camera line than the T2. It's probably the most popular SLR film camera ever made, so they are very plentiful. It doesn't have quite as many features as the T2, but honestly, most of those features are ones you will probably never miss.

One advantage of the Canon Rebel film cameras is that they can use any lens that will fit on any of the other Canon cameras from the EOS series, including lenses that would go on a full-frame digital Canon SLR, from the humblest zoom or "nifty fifty" lens to monster Telephotos and zooms costing many thousands of dollars, and the beauty of this is that no one will know from looking at your pictures that you were using a humble Rebel camera rather than a top of the line Canon film SLR.

There are cameras from other makers that approximate what the I said above, but the advantage of the Canon line is the excellent compatibility between camera lenses and bodies across the EOS product line and the fact that Canon is the most SLR popular brand, so it will be easier for you to find a suitable kit for you to buy.

On the other hand, if you want to really go vintage then an Exakta SLR is an interesting choice, though not one that I recommend for you because it may be harder to find one in good shape. Slightly less vintage would be a Pentax Spotmatic or a Nikon F. Those were probably the most popular brands in the late 1960s to 1970s, with the Pentax focused on the high end amateur market and the Nikon F focused on the professional market. The Pentax K1000, which you have already mentioned, is another good choice. There were a lot of other good camera makers from that era as well, though except for Minolta or maybe Olympus I would be hard pressed to actually recommend them today for various reasons.

 

[Les Sarile]

Does anyone have an experience and can tell me how different are Minoltas SRT101, SRT102, SRT201 and XD-11, XG2 ?

Of those you mentioned, the XD-11, OM-2 and Pentax ME Super are good choices.

I have experience of most all the cameras mentioned here as I acquired them for purposes of my own research into SLR's dating back to 1957 beginning with the original Asahi Pentax. Here are most of what I have in 35mm showing their relative size differences. I would suggest making sure that the camera you get is fully functional or solid money back guarantee - a very important consideration due to their age.

I would suggest that you consider the age of these cameras. One reason is batteries used. Prior to 1972, most cameras used the discontinued mercury batteries. There are easy workarounds if you really want a camera designed with it. Another is that the older cameras tended to be larger and weigh more then their newer models. In this case they happen to have different lens mounts too.

One camera not mentioned here but worth additional consideration is the Ricoh XR-7 but I do't know the availability of it in your area. Here's an ad for it that outlines it's key features.

The XR-7 is very similar in size to the Pentax ME Super but has conventional controls - as opposed to the push button shutter speed control of the latter. However, it will not function at all when batteries die.

BTW, with very few exceptions, cameras with automatic aperture capabilities may offer 1 shutter speed (sync speed) when batteries die. The exceptions are Nikon FM3A, Canon New F-1 and Pentax LX. The FM3A has all shutter speeds available while the other two only have sync to top shutter speeds available.

Is any of those classic cameras specifically good at night photography?

I'm into night photography and make extra long exposures that usually last tens of minutes in duration. Here is one of the Hoover Dam that was taken using the Pentax LX on Kodak Ektar 100 in aperture priority mode lasting about 45 minutes.

Most all cameras with aperture priority can reliably autoexpose a scene lasting seconds. Few others can achieve minutes.

 

[John51]

The Olympus XA was designed as a quick fire point and shoot. There's a story about the designer, Maitani Yoshihisa, missing the moment in the time it took him to get his camera ready. (To do with a fire in a bath house iirc.)

You set the aperture to f 5.6 and the focus to 3M. Keep it in your pocket with the shutter cocked. No excuses for missing a shot. I've just processed a roll of HP5 shot like this. For posting images on the net, it's good enough, as are most 35mm cameras. If you want to have largish prints made, then get fancy and focus it. With the short focal length the rangefinder is redundant imo, using the scale focus is good enough and often quicker.

I know you want an slr even though it might not be the best for your travels so how about a 'stay at home' slr? Weight won't be such a problem and you can get a lighter camera for your travels.

 

[Paul Howell]

I use both a MInolta 201 and a X700. The 201 works well using hearing aid batteries, the view finder has read out for the selected shutter speed and F stop. The 700 was the top of the line once MInolta stopped production of the XK. Only draw back is that doest meter in manual meter mode, the user needs to meter in apature or program mode then set the camera to manual mode and set the shutter speed and F stop. The 700 can take either a power winder or motor drive, interchangeable focusing screens. Unlike the 201 the 700 is battery dependent but uses 2 modern 625s. I bought 3 bodies before I found a 201 with a working meter. . From the same peer group are the Konica T, T2. and T3. I have shot with my T3 in while, the 57 1.7 was of the sharpest made. If want a all machinical all manual camera the 201 or 101 in good working order is had to beat.

 

[Andrew O'Neill]

That's the first time I've ever heard anyone say that the K1000 was too heavy. If that is the case, then how about the Pentax AE-1? A tad smaller/lighter. Hard to beat the K1000 though for simplicity of use.

 

[baachitraka]

My suggestion is to opt for something a little less than vintage and buy a Canon Rebel T2 film camera. That's the US model designation. In Europe it is known as 300X, and in Japan it is known as Kiss 7. This is the last and best of the Canon Rebel film cameras. It is small, light, easy to use, and an excellent picture taker. It has automatic exposure control and automatic focus, though those features can be over-ridden easily if you want to shoot in manual mode.

As for lenses, the most practical choice, given your budget and application, would be a 28-90mm zoom lens. You can probably find this kit (camera body and lens) for around $50 to $100 US on ebay, though sometimes you may find them selling for more or less than that amount. If you are lucky you might find one with a 24-85mm or 28-105mm zoom lens within your budget, either of which would be a step up from the 28-90mm zoom lens.

If you want to choose a single focal length rather than a zoom lens then consider getting a 50mm f/1.8 Yongnuo lens. You can usually find these for around $50 US, brand new. The advantage is that the lens is faster than the zoom lenses (i.e. is capable of letting in more light), which allows you to shoot in dimmer light without slowing the shutter speed too much, and the pictures will be a little sharper with this lens rather than a zoom lens, provided you do your part of holding the camera steady. However, it doesn't zoom, so you may have to resort to "zooming with your feet" in a lot of cases.

Another option would be a Canon Rebel 2000. It's an earlier version of the Rebel film camera line than the T2. It's probably the most popular SLR film camera ever made, so they are very plentiful. It doesn't have quite as many features as the T2, but honestly, most of those features are ones you will probably never miss.

One advantage of the Canon Rebel film cameras is that they can use any lens that will fit on any of the other Canon cameras from the EOS series, including lenses that would go on a full-frame digital Canon SLR, from the humblest zoom or "nifty fifty" lens to monster Telephotos and zooms costing many thousands of dollars, and the beauty of this is that no one will know from looking at your pictures that you were using a humble Rebel camera rather than a top of the line Canon film SLR.

There are cameras from other makers that approximate what the I said above, but the advantage of the Canon line is the excellent compatibility between camera lenses and bodies across the EOS product line and the fact that Canon is the most SLR popular brand, so it will be easier for you to find a suitable kit for you to buy.

On the other hand, if you want to really go vintage then an Exakta SLR is an interesting choice, though not one that I recommend for you because it may be harder to find one in good shape. Slightly less vintage would be a Pentax Spotmatic or a Nikon F. Those were probably the most popular brands in the late 1960s to 1970s, with the Pentax focused on the high end amateur market and the Nikon F focused on the professional market. The Pentax K1000, which you have already mentioned, is another good choice. There were a lot of other good camera makers from that era as well, though except for Minolta or maybe Olympus I would be hard pressed to actually recommend them today for various reasons.

I have paid €5.50 for EOS 50E without any lens. There is EF 40mm pancake approximately for €100. If you find battery grip then you may need not worry about those expensive battery.

I started film photography with EOS 650 (bulky) since I had EF 50mm lens. But then pulled into mechanical cameras esp., OM et al.

 

[baachitraka]

If you become a serious shooter then most of the money goes to film + chemicals and not to mention papers. But its a pure joy.

 

[AgX]

Maggie, questions as yours typically stirr up a lot of hot air as fellows advise their pets...

Do not contemplate a lot, instead spend little money on something you can get locally and that you find attracted to.

If you want to contemplate, think whether you want something as an SLR with all its possibilities and lenses or something more simple and compact as a (range-)finder camera. If you go for a SLR you could contemplate on the availability of resp. lenses. On the other hand most cameras are that cheap that still a early change from one system to another would not be a big issue.

So, if you find a choice locally, go try out some models. If there is some that attracts you, try it and have it basically tested. Either by a knowledgable shop assistant or a maybe even a fellow from Apug. And then get it and start your journey. Maybe before that reading an old, used textbook on basic photography with a film camera. (Freeman, Langford etc.)

 

[MaggieSz]

Of those you mentioned, the XD-11, OM-2 and Pentax ME Super are good choices.

I have experience of most all the cameras mentioned here as I acquired them for purposes of my own research into SLR's dating back to 1957 beginning with the original Asahi Pentax. Here are most of what I have in 35mm showing their relative size differences. I would suggest making sure that the camera you get is fully functional or solid money back guarantee - a very important consideration due to their age.

I would suggest that you consider the age of these cameras. One reason is batteries used. Prior to 1972, most cameras used the discontinued mercury batteries. There are easy workarounds if you really want a camera designed with it. Another is that the older cameras tended to be larger and weigh more then their newer models. In this case they happen to have different lens mounts too.

One camera not mentioned here but worth additional consideration is the Ricoh XR-7 but I do't know the availability of it in your area. Here's an ad for it that outlines it's key features.

The XR-7 is very similar in size to the Pentax ME Super but has conventional controls - as opposed to the push button shutter speed control of the latter. However, it will not function at all when batteries die.

BTW, with very few exceptions, cameras with automatic aperture capabilities may offer 1 shutter speed (sync speed) when batteries die. The exceptions are Nikon FM3A, Canon New F-1 and Pentax LX. The FM3A has all shutter speeds available while the other two only have sync to top shutter speeds available.



I'm into night photography and make extra long exposures that usually last tens of minutes in duration. Here is one of the Hoover Dam that was taken using the Pentax LX on Kodak Ektar 100 in aperture priority mode lasting about 45 minutes.

Most all cameras with aperture priority can reliably autoexpose a scene lasting seconds. Few others can achieve minutes.

Wow that is an impressive collection!

@Paul Howell I also read somewhere that old Minoltas have lots of issues.

@AgX I think you've got the point. I realised the same thing. I will just pick one and see how I'm going. It is not like forever thing and I can always change camera. I think my long term goal will be to find a nice Nikon from F series, but I have to be patient and search for a bit. I sort of think that half frame cameras are cool too, but I still have time to my big trip in November/ December. I think I can definitely learn SLR now and use it in street photography for my uni project.
As for now I think I have the winner

 

[MaggieSz]

@baachitraka and @AgX I see that you're from Germany. What are your thoughts on old German Praktica from 70's-80's ?

 

[Sirius Glass]

Presently when I shoot 35mm I use a Nikon N75 for Koda-k Portra 400 [C41 color] and a Nikon F100 for Kodak Tri-X 400 [black & white] with interchangeable zoom AF lenses.

 

[MaggieSz]

So this is what I bought today locally (via fb market) for 100$ AUD. Pentax Program A, has been tested etc. Needs the batteries for flash. I will start with this one and see how I like it. If anyone else used it, let me know how you like it. Can always try something different, but gotta start somewhere!

Thanks everyone for your comments, I appreciate your help!

 

[Les Sarile]

Can always try something different, but gotta start somewhere!

My sentiments exactly!
Good luck and good light!

 

[AgX]

@baachitraka and @AgX I see that you're from Germany. What are your thoughts on old German Praktica from 70's-80's ?

I even use the Praktina from the 50s...
the first system camera.

You refer to the L-series, built from 1969-1989, which alone should be telling. The series contains a variety of models from pure mechanical to TTL-autoexposure, even switchable finders. However, Pentacon gave the models even after slight cosmetic changes a new designation, which is irritating for the uninitiated when chosing a model.
The pros are being common and cheap, no enigmatic buttons or features, a most universal lens mount and rather lightweight. And except for slow shutter speeds going even slower at samples unused for decades (a generic issue with all kinds of mechanical shutters), there are no typical quirks with that series.

A bit of chatter on mostly the L-series here:
https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/praktica-appreciation-thread.125384/

 

[baachitraka]

I have MTL5: Metal shutters, 1/125 flash sync, bit heavy (kind of brutalistic in design), film advance is not as smooth in comparison to OM-1, shutter release placement is unconventional (I prefer that way) and 45° split but not as bright as standard OM-1, loud, cheap and I really don't prefer it.

 

[Toyo]

View attachment 221701

So this is what I bought today locally (via fb market) for 100$ AUD. Pentax Program A, has been tested etc. Needs the batteries for flash. I will start with this one and see how I like it. If anyone else used it, let me know how you like it. Can always try something different, but gotta start somewhere!

Thanks everyone for your comments, I appreciate your help!

Great choice and you got it for a great price.
Pick up some cheap film and learn to use it so that you are really familiar with its functions and abilities.
Now that you have your camera and are/will be familiar with it, the next thing to consider - and the most important - is what film will you use in it.
Here in Oz - C41 colour negative film is the cheapest to have processed - even cheaper than monochrome - unless you are going to process the film yourself.
Colour slide film is expensive to have processed by comparison.
Colour negative film also has a wider dynamic range than colour slide film.
Have some great trips and experiences.
You go girl!

 

[abruzzi]

View attachment 221701

So this is what I bought today locally (via fb market) for 100$ AUD. Pentax Program A, has been tested etc. Needs the batteries for flash. I will start with this one and see how I like it. If anyone else used it, let me know how you like it. Can always try something different, but gotta start somewhere!

Thanks everyone for your comments, I appreciate your help!

Very nice. You won’t be able to use fully automated “program” mode because the lens you have doesn’t support it, but you can use aperture priority or full manual. If you add any lenses, look for the A series lenses. They have an A on the aperture dial just to the left of the largest aperture number (22 usually). When the lens is set to A, the camera will use the meter to set the aperture for you.