CatLABS X FILM 320 Pro now available in 35mm and 120

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CatLABS

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Mr. Hecht, I do wonder why it is rated at 320 but recommended to shoot at 200. Why not just rate it at 200?

Once i attended a lecture by Mary Ellen Mark, who for an eternity was derided by the fine art establishment for various reasons. I thought it was going to be an earth shattering and momentous event, a chance to meet a childhood hero in person and i had hoped to learn something i did not know, something that would change the course of my life. In fact, i had misplaced my copy of American Odyssey that i so wanted to have signed, in person that i rush ordered another copy when i could not find it in time for the lecture.
I guess the reason that Mark was so derided by the fine art world was her touch with journalism, editorials and even some corny schmalz that came out of her collaborations with her husband and streetwise/twins etc. Ironically, the same derision was pointed at Anny Leibowitz. It was hard not to consider these emotions and antics are were in no small part the reaction of a patriarchal world and industry towards two exceptionally talented and supremely successful female photographers, who never shied away from the fact they are strong women making waves in a male dominated environment.

The lecture went about as one would expect from this type of event, the usual introductions followed by the usual barrage of anecdotal behind the scene tidbits that by now ever person in the audience probably knew by heart. Some of the usual photos and stories. Then your typical Q&A, from young and old. The old asking what lessons for life are there in a life long dedicated pursuit of a single motivational goal (answer: there isent any), the young asking what room is there in the world for up and coming photographers and how they too could achieve such levels of success (the answer: there is no more room, that world has come and gone for good).
Then, there was some spread with cheese an drinks to mingle. I thought to myself, well, now is surely the chance to introduce myself, to have the book signed and to mention the life impact her work had on my career and life path.

To put this into context, about a decade earlier, i was already a working photojournalist for a daily newspaper covering spot news when i ran into another photographer, whom i have only ever heard of and saw the work of and whos ground breaking work i saw as a kid was one of the major driving forces that pushed towards photography and journalism. In passing i mentioned that it was his work and in particular one photo that had brought me to where i was. He immediately responded by saying "dont lay that responsibility on me, i dont want it". He ended up being a bit of an unpleasant person in general thought perhaps not a fair judgment as spot news in a flashpoint area that was constantly at the peak of the global news cycle makes people jaded and rough on the outside, its hard to survive otherwise. Still, i thought i had a met my childhood hero, he listened to my words and i learned something, not a bad exchange, even if not what i thought it would be like. We ended up working side by side on other occasions and it was hard to comprehend we were in fact, colleagues doing the same work at the same time.

So, armed with this past experience, i figured i shouldent expect too much from a 15 seconds conversation with Mary Ellen Mark and just add this to the book of experiences i can once tell some poor sucker about, hey, you know, i once met Mary Ellen Mark, or something like that. An indeed, a few minutes later, thats exactly what happened. We exchanged some pleasantries, had my book signed and the next person in line, anxiously waiting to tell Mark how much they admire her, inspired by her or ask massively open ended questions that a lifetime of therapy might not answer expecting to be wowzed out of their socks moved in.

For many years the main ad on the Kodak website for the "new Tri-X professional" film was promoted by none other than Mary Ellen Mark with some photo of buffalos or some such with a quote from Mark saying something like: i love Tri-X 400, its an amazing film especially when you shoot it at 250 ISO.
 

pentaxuser

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Now you are here, Catlabs can you give us any information about the electrical tape re[ported by one member on the cassettes he received and his discovery of a code for ISO of 1250 underneath?

Thanks

pentaxuser
 

AgX

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Sal, you seemingly got it right.
And the thread is getting entertaining.
 

pbromaghin

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Go not to the Elves for counsel, for they will say both no and yes.
 

cmacd123

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Well, it was Catlabs himself who entered this market-wise irrelevant forum. And he could expect that it would result in some banter, to which he added his part.
which is why that we don't get any direct posts from Film Ferrania or some of the other firms.
 

Paul Howell

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Good to know that ISO 200 is in the ball park. My Catlabs 200 just arrived. I have roll of Kodak double X in my Minolta 9, will shoot my test roll with Minolta 800si or Nikon F4, need to set up test scene.
 

Roger Cole

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That would only under expose Ilford Delta 3200 by 1/3 stop per ISO. :smile:
True - sort of. Delta 3200 is made for pushing.

My copy of the Film Developing cookbook that recently arrived has a section basically ranting against modern T and cubical grain films and dye sensitization, with some claims that are, let's say, completely contrary to my personal experience, and among the latter is the claim that HP5+ is actually better for pushing than Delta 3200. Nonsense. I can get a very good workable 3200 out of the D3200 (by developing per the times for 6400) and can't get anything near as good results from HP5+ at anywhere near the speed. At 800, sure - I'd rather push the HP5 than pull Delta even slightly. At 1600 it's maybe debatable. At 3200 no contest for me, and I've tried both. Note that I really like HP5+ and have pretty much made it my standard B&W film now since Kodak priced sheet film in the stratosphere and I want to standardize on the same film in 4x5 and 120, but not at 3200.

At any rate, back to the point. There used to be sold cassettes with DX coding in various speeds for bulk loading, and stickers to put on those without it, or over regular ones, to fool the camera (or just make it work.) I haven't looked for them recently but it seems the stickers would be so easy that, if it's an issue, you could just print them yourself if you wanted. The information needed should be readily available.

I want to try this film but I'm still in the midst of building out my new darkroom so it will wait. I am curious both why a film called 320 is recommended to be exposed at 200 (why not just call it 200 then?) and why one tester got such dramatically slower results. I seldom shoot in bright sun. 100 is slow for me, 200 is better, and I prefer 400 for standard use. A film that has to be exposed at EI 50, much less 20-25, is pretty much a tripod only thing for me, or for the very rare cases when I am shooting in bright sun of course. I shot a fair bit of Pan F at the beach when I used to go with my now-ex wife, and quite liked that film for that environment. Even so I was shooting more often in later evening and using FP4+ or, at the time, Tri-X.
 

Roger Cole

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Although most folks do not shoot Delta or Tmax 3200 at 3200, it is what both ILford and Kodak has set the DX default to 3200, looking at the Kodak data sheet I can see that with Tmax developer you can shoot at 3200 with shadow detail. I develop in D76 so I shoot 1600 and consider 3200 to be push.

Until I get my rolls of Catlabs new film and do some very basic testing of my own have no idea what my E.I will be.
Most don't?

I definitely do. But I develop per the times for 6400. If I do shoot it at 1600 I develop per recommendations for 3200 etc. I find I get far better results that way.

I really miss the old pre-2007 Tri-X. It was great shot at 1600 and developed in Diafine. The current film is more like 800 in that developer.
 

AgX

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which is why that we don't get any direct posts from Film Ferrania or some of the other firms.

Well, some times, when he got time for it or is in the mood we get very interesting postings by Mirko (Adox/Fotoimpex) where he revealed things not to find at all at the Adox side or elsewhere, though he faced some criticism here too.
 

ags2mikon

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All of the sample images I have seen so far have all had crushed, dead, and lifeless shadows. This is typical of films with a long toe. Many of the samples had highlights that were blocked or close to it. The results look like under exposed and over developed / pushed film. I know some like that look and that's fine, but some of us don't.
 

Paul Howell

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Most don't?

I definitely do. But I develop per the times for 6400. If I do shoot it at 1600 I develop per recommendations for 3200 etc. I find I get far better results that way.

I really miss the old pre-2007 Tri-X. It was great shot at 1600 and developed in Diafine. The current film is more like 800 in that developer.

Your are likely correct, I should said the majority of folks who have posted here seem to shoot at a lower ISO, outside of PhotoTrio most likely shoot at box speed. And again true, old TriX shot at 1600 and developed in Diafine while a little soft had very good shadow details. The newer version of TriX with a thinner emulsion cannnot absorb as part A developer as the new thicker emulsion version.
 

ags2mikon

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Kodak has been the best sales person for Harman products. Panatomic X gone, use Pan F. Plus X gone use FP-4. Improve Tri X, use HP-5. Drop Tmax 3200, use Delta 3200.
 

pentaxuser

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Good to know that ISO 200 is in the ball park. My Catlabs 200 just arrived. I have roll of Kodak double X in my Minolta 9, will shoot my test roll with Minolta 800si or Nikon F4, need to set up test scene.

Paul, when you open your cassettes, assuming it is 35mm, can I ask that you tell us if they have the electrical tape like aparat reported and what the code underneath the tape says. If it's 120 roll film does it say what the speed is on the backing paper?

Thanks

pentaxuser
 

Digital Wendy

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CATLabs are offering a 10% discount to photographers who identify as non-male! Brilliant idea 😀. Don't think it will make it worth my while to buy US film tho' unless they produce some sheet film. 10% off sheet film for non-male photographers would reach a truly niche audience.
 

faberryman

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For many years the main ad on the Kodak website for the "new Tri-X professional" film was promoted by none other than Mary Ellen Mark with some photo of buffalos or some such with a quote from Mark saying something like: i love Tri-X 400, its an amazing film especially when you shoot it at 250 ISO.

The fact that Mary Ellen Mark liked to shoot Tri-X at EI 250 does not mean that Tri-X was not an ISO 400 film. Kodak claimed it was an ISO 400 film because they tested the film according to the ISO rubric for determining film speed and determined that it was ISO 400.

CatLABS claims that its new film has an "EI ISO" film speed of 320. I do not know 1) what "EI ISO" is supposed to mean, 2) whether CatLABS determined that its new film has a film speed of 320 according to the ISO rubric, or 3) if the film does have an ISO film speed of 320, why they nevertheless recommend that it be shot at EI 200. Maybe they just think their new film looks better overexposed.
 
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mshchem

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CATLabs are offering a 10% discount to photographers who identify as non-male! Brilliant idea 😀. Don't think it will make it worth my while to buy US film tho' unless they produce some sheet film. 10% off sheet film for non-male photographers would reach a truly niche audience.

This has been the case for years. Applies to some used equipment, many things in different categories. Very progressive minded organization.
 

Huss

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Once i attended a lecture by Mary Ellen Mark, who for an eternity was derided by the fine art establishment for various reasons. I thought it was going to be an earth shattering and momentous event, a chance to meet a childhood hero in person and i had hoped to learn something i did not know, something that would change the course of my life. In fact, i had misplaced my copy of American Odyssey that i so wanted to have signed, in person that i rush ordered another copy when i could not find it in time for the lecture.
I guess the reason that Mark was so derided by the fine art world was her touch with journalism, editorials and even some corny schmalz that came out of her collaborations with her husband and streetwise/twins etc. Ironically, the same derision was pointed at Anny Leibowitz. It was hard not to consider these emotions and antics are were in no small part the reaction of a patriarchal world and industry towards two exceptionally talented and supremely successful female photographers, who never shied away from the fact they are strong women making waves in a male dominated environment.

The lecture went about as one would expect from this type of event, the usual introductions followed by the usual barrage of anecdotal behind the scene tidbits that by now ever person in the audience probably knew by heart. Some of the usual photos and stories. Then your typical Q&A, from young and old. The old asking what lessons for life are there in a life long dedicated pursuit of a single motivational goal (answer: there isent any), the young asking what room is there in the world for up and coming photographers and how they too could achieve such levels of success (the answer: there is no more room, that world has come and gone for good).
Then, there was some spread with cheese an drinks to mingle. I thought to myself, well, now is surely the chance to introduce myself, to have the book signed and to mention the life impact her work had on my career and life path.

To put this into context, about a decade earlier, i was already a working photojournalist for a daily newspaper covering spot news when i ran into another photographer, whom i have only ever heard of and saw the work of and whos ground breaking work i saw as a kid was one of the major driving forces that pushed towards photography and journalism. In passing i mentioned that it was his work and in particular one photo that had brought me to where i was. He immediately responded by saying "dont lay that responsibility on me, i dont want it". He ended up being a bit of an unpleasant person in general thought perhaps not a fair judgment as spot news in a flashpoint area that was constantly at the peak of the global news cycle makes people jaded and rough on the outside, its hard to survive otherwise. Still, i thought i had a met my childhood hero, he listened to my words and i learned something, not a bad exchange, even if not what i thought it would be like. We ended up working side by side on other occasions and it was hard to comprehend we were in fact, colleagues doing the same work at the same time.

So, armed with this past experience, i figured i shouldent expect too much from a 15 seconds conversation with Mary Ellen Mark and just add this to the book of experiences i can once tell some poor sucker about, hey, you know, i once met Mary Ellen Mark, or something like that. An indeed, a few minutes later, thats exactly what happened. We exchanged some pleasantries, had my book signed and the next person in line, anxiously waiting to tell Mark how much they admire her, inspired by her or ask massively open ended questions that a lifetime of therapy might not answer expecting to be wowzed out of their socks moved in.

For many years the main ad on the Kodak website for the "new Tri-X professional" film was promoted by none other than Mary Ellen Mark with some photo of buffalos or some such with a quote from Mark saying something like: i love Tri-X 400, its an amazing film especially when you shoot it at 250 ISO.

Fantastic! Thank you.
 

Huss

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All of the sample images I have seen so far have all had crushed, dead, and lifeless shadows. This is typical of films with a long toe. Many of the samples had highlights that were blocked or close to it. The results look like under exposed and over developed / pushed film. I know some like that look and that's fine, but some of us don't.

I’ve never seen a shadow full of life. If I had i’ll be walking very quickly the other way and it better not be following me.
 

MattKing

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I’ve never seen a shadow full of life. If I had i’ll be walking very quickly the other way and it better not be following me.

How about these - seem pregnant with life to me :whistling:?
1664905487899.png

(FWIW, when I practiced law, I used to take particular delight in using other people's words/actions/arguments/case authorities against them :smile:. You have lots of lively shadows in your photos).
 
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Huss

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How about these - seem pregnant with life to me :whistling:?
View attachment 318037
(FWIW, when I practiced law, I used to take particular delight in using other people's words/actions/arguments/case authorities against them :smile:. You have lots of lively shadows in your photos).

They are not lively shadows! They are zombie shadows!

p.s. awesome demonstration of Kentmere 400 pushed to 1600 w DF96 monobath.
 
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MattKing

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