Can AI be used to produce art?

[VinceInMT]

….This is what I've seen in the past 3 yrs and it is accelerating in capability. I have been working with Gemini 3 Pro to do a range of server and code improvements and my mind is so blown I don't know how to explain how good this thing is.…..

I retired 13 years ago from teaching, among other things, computer programming at the high school level. A couple years ago I put all of my advanced assignments to ChatGPT and it produced solutions for all of them. Some of the code was more elegant than what I had written for the solutions. I was out with a friend, a retired English teacher, and passed my iPad or to him and had him as AI to produce various things he would assign his high school students: poems in a particular style on a certain topic, etc. It did so with ease.

This is where some of the impact is happening as teacher are having to completely change what they do, the yep of assignments they give, and what they want students to actually fo. I suppose it’s not unlike math teachers who dealt with the advent of the pocket calculators.

 

[runswithsizzers]

There's a hammer because I suspect part of the coding of free publicly available AI is to keep away from violent imagery.

Interesting speculation. If true, it is ironic that my first thought when I saw the image was of the Beatle's song, "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" which, despite it's sunny and cheerful sound, has some of the most violent lyrics in my music collection. Based on a true story, by the way.

... unprompted so it put a general hammer in, which I might add is not an era correct hammer.

I agree, the hammer is just not the right one for the image. Obviously, the correct hammer would be an antique 32 ounce machinists ball pein hammer. Or possibly a 3 pound cross pein hand sledge. ;-) But Sean did not prompt for one. You cannot fault the AI for Sean's lack of attention to detail. AI is easy, but you can't expect it to do all the work. You have to take the time to be specific about what you want.

 

[Cholentpot]

Interesting speculation. If true, it is ironic that my first thought when I saw the image was of the Beatle's song, "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" which, despite it's sunny and cheerful sound, has some of the most violent lyrics in my music collection. Based on a true story, by the way.


I agree, the hammer is just not the right one for the image. Obviously, the correct hammer would be an antique 32 ounce machinists ball pein hammer. Or possibly a 3 pound cross pein hand sledge. ;-) But Sean did not prompt for one. You cannot fault the AI for Sean's lack of attention to detail. AI is easy, but you can't expect it to do all the work. You have to take the time to be specific about what you want.

Sean did not prompt a hammer at all. AI took liberties and stuck one in. While that doesn't seem like a big deal it really is one. Sure it doesn't matter but on some things it does. You're doing research on AI gives a source that seems legit but on scrutinizing it's not. You confront the AI and it says, sorry oops. And then does it again.

I didn't ask for a hammer, don't put a hammer in. AI loves Greebles but it gets them all wrong.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

View attachment 414849

15”x22”, graphite on paper

Very nice. Was that built from scratch or from one of your photos?

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I don't think most grasp that this is merely temporary. AI as it is now is the worst it will ever be. AI as it is now is not the final iteration or a framework set in stone, it is evolving by the hour. It's like I've posted before on how some view AI...

"Well it still can't do A, B or C"
"Ok, now it can do A, B, and C, but it will never do D, and E"
"Ok wow, it is doing D and E, but it'll be 100 yrs before it even gets close to F, G and H"
"What the heck? It's doing F, G and H? But it'll never achieve I, J agh ok forget it!"

This is what I've seen in the past 3 yrs and it is accelerating in capability. I have been working with Gemini 3 Pro to do a range of server and code improvements and my mind is so blown I don't know how to explain how good this thing is. Just a year ago, trying to get ai to help me with server configurations and xenforo code work was an exercise in frustration, it just couldn't understand what I wanted. However, this new Gemini 3 Pro truly seems to understand exactly what I want and provides me perfect instructions, code and more to do whatever I ask it to.

There is also the issue of people using the lesser free ai models or the models that are not ideal for what they need to accomplish, then passing judgement. Google seemed way behind so I was stunned that Gemini 3 Pro was so insanely good (almost seeming like AGI at times). So it is already at an incredible state and I can't wrap my head around what Gemini 4 or 5 would be like as the capability is increasing by orders of magnitude.

Do you intend to keep your moderators?

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

What makes you think AI cannot tell the difference between a knife and a hammer? I'm pretty sure if Sean had asked for a knife or a hammer in the prompt, he would have got what he asked for.

If I understand correctly, Sean was giving examples of what AI comes up with if given only minimal prompts(?) The prompt for the tintype was simply, "Do a tintype" - which suggests a style, but it is very nonspecific about subject matter.

Many historical tintypes were portraits, so the subject of the AI image is not surprising. But the fact that a hammer appears in this AI image -- without being prompted -- is interesting! If I didn't know better, I might think the AI was having a little fun with us. ;-)

If AI requires a human prompt to decide whether a knife or hammer is appropriate, then it's human ideas that are innovative, not AI. AI is just speeding up the process of human innovation and creativity.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

Interesting speculation. If true, it is ironic that my first thought when I saw the image was of the Beatle's song, "Maxwell's Silver Hammer" which, despite it's sunny and cheerful sound, has some of the most violent lyrics in my music collection. Based on a true story, by the way.


I agree, the hammer is just not the right one for the image. Obviously, the correct hammer would be an antique 32 ounce machinists ball pein hammer. Or possibly a 3 pound cross pein hand sledge. ;-) But Sean did not prompt for one. You cannot fault the AI for Sean's lack of attention to detail. AI is easy, but you can't expect it to do all the work. You have to take the time to be specific about what you want.

That's the point. AI can't be creative without human prompts. All abacuses, slide rules and computers have done is speed up the process of human innovation. They're just tools that act on human intervention. They don't have brains, intuition or insight.

 

[VinceInMT]

Very nice. Was that built from scratch or from one of your photos?

I built it from scratch using an image that AI generated as reference.

 

[nikos79]

I asked it for an image in the style of NY school
Could very well be an image from Garry Winogrand book "Women are beautiful".
It even tried to tilt the frame a bit

 

[MattKing]

Do you intend to keep your moderators?

We won't be nearly as necessary if AI gets really good at dealing with the illogical, the unpredictable, the irrational and the unbelievably stubborn.
We probably would be reduced to just dealing with the disorganized and the bat**** crazy!

 

[Pieter12]

A quote from the NY Times:

"A.I. might be trained on human art, but it has its own house style: slick, almost too polished, bumps retouched, like a smooth-talking car salesman. We call it slop, but the look is, if anything, sleeker and less textured than what humans tend to produce.

In 2026, as people grow weary of the inundation of slop, we’ll see a turn away from it and an embrace of art, text and other creative endeavors that embody the Japanese term wabi-sabi, an aesthetic that finds beauty in imperfection and delight in things that haven’t had their edges smoothed out."

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

We won't be nearly as necessary if AI gets really good at dealing with the illogical, the unpredictable, the irrational and the unbelievably stubborn.
We probably would be reduced to just dealing with the disorganized and the bat**** crazy!

Well, I for one hope you stay because there won't be any fun arguing with AI and getting angry at a machine.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

A quote from the NY Times:

"A.I. might be trained on human art, but it has its own house style: slick, almost too polished, bumps retouched, like a smooth-talking car salesman. We call it slop, but the look is, if anything, sleeker and less textured than what humans tend to produce.

In 2026, as people grow weary of the inundation of slop, we’ll see a turn away from it and an embrace of art, text and other creative endeavors that embody the Japanese term wabi-sabi, an aesthetic that finds beauty in imperfection and delight in things that haven’t had their edges smoothed out."

Well, Japanese AI would be looking at Wabi Sabi and coming up with Wabi Sabi slop.

 

[Sean]

This is quite an astonishing watch. So many implications, especially considering 1) Where it might be in another year or two 2) when will ai simply auto-generate endless film and tv (why would it need human direction in a few yrs). You could even imagine uploading an e-book to the ai and saying "make a 10 part TV series, director style Christopher Nolan, score style Hans Zimmer"

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

This is quite an astonishing watch. So many implications, especially considering 1) Where it might be in another year or two 2) when will ai simply auto-generate endless film and tv (why would it need human direction in a few yrs). You could even imagine uploading an e-book to the ai and saying "make a 10 part TV series, director style Christopher Nolan, score style Hans Zimmer"

After a big union strike, the actors and writers union guild in America last year signed off a contract with Hollywood producers that AI cannot be used to replace actors or fill in for speech or write movie scripts. They saw this coming. Can't blame them. Next step is that wedding photographers will only need a picture of the bride and groom, and then AI will create an entire movie and still photo wedding album without having to attend the affair. Think of all the money the bride's father will save? Maybe he can avoid the cost of the affair itself? Do the whole thing on Zoom. Of course, the brides will object.

 

[Sean]

After a big union strike, the actors and writers union guild in America last year signed off a contract with Hollywood producers that AI cannot be used to replace actors or fill in for speech or write movie scripts. They saw this coming. Can't blame them.

The looming (depressing) reality is that "Hollywood" and studios worldwide will not factor into any future entertainment content whatsoever. They will likely be an empty husk that licenses ip to ai entertainment creation systems. I doubt that will even do much to protect their ip. At some point soon, these tools will be open source and able to run locally on most desktops. Anyone could spin up a session and say, "Generate a new Star Wars movie in the style of the originals" and a few mins later they're watching a new SW film. It would be all the same characters, lore, environments etc. They wouldn't bother sharing it, so no one would even know it existed. Another level would be VR and you can be in the movie. Everyone will generate content locally and on demand. Maybe Netflix etc will offer generative ai options and ability to watch what others created and what is rating the highest, but I think most will generate their own content and get their ais to learn what they like so it becomes refined. I'm not seeing much future for humans in this industry (or I guess most industry). Not saying I want this at all, just making predictions based on the trajectory I see.

 

[Sirius Glass]

AI can produce objects which are not art, because art is made by humans not heuristic software.

 

[Cholentpot]

I asked it for an image in the style of NY school
Could very well be an image from Garry Winogrand book "Women are beautiful".
It even tried to tilt the frame a bit

But can you spot what's wrong with it? On the surface it passes but under even the slightest observation it failed over and over. The second photo isn't even close, it screams AI. The first one has problems with sharpness lighting and contrast. It also has the focus all wrong. There is zero motion blur anywhere in the photo, if someone is moving like that there will be some blur somewhere.

For me personally these AI generated photos don't make me go 'Wow, look what technology can do' instead it makes me feel like with all that nuclear powered server farm tech they still can't get things right. Subtlety will always be lost on AI. I don't think it'll ever understand undefinable things. The same way that we've been using drum machines for over 50 years and they still just can't sound human. They can sound great, they can sound awesome when programmed right but put a human on a drum kit and it's a different world.

 

[Pieter12]

Artists have used the intervention and effects of machinery and chemistry for ages to produce art. AI can produce art, just as any machine can with human supervision. Whether is it good art or not is questionable. AI cannot make photographs, only images that resemble photographs to some extent.

 

[slackercrurster]

There is a big debate if AI can produce art. I have the feeling not because it cannot understand or experience the relation to time and as a result death too.

Recently I came across some photos by an artist named Noemia Prada. They looked beautiful, nice compositions and emotional but … something was wrong. They looked as if they were soulless. After reading the artist statement I realized they were all made with the use of AI

Sure, why not. It may be different art than art-art, but there is still art in the process.

Look at these AI vids I archived from YT...

Internet Archive: Digital Library of Free & Borrowable Texts, Movies, Music & Wayback Machine

archive.org

Back in the day the forums would always ask if photography was an art. In short, if the outcome is uncertain and there are judgments to be made...then there is art in the process. This art can be technical or artistic, but it is still art.

 

[nikos79]

I can see that a lot of critic is made on the fact that the images don’t look that realistic yet. I think is a matter of time, maybe w 2 or 3 years when you will not be able to tell a real image from an AI generated image.
Suppose this can happen and suppose no human will intervene will it still be art?

 

[Sean]

I think any "i can tell" criticism will be gone by end of this year, maybe even mid year. I'd say 1 major release away and the releases are coming every 3-6 months. I'm seeing some moments of complete realism already (mixed with moments of uncanny valley) but some moments imo are definitely hitting the can't tell zone. There is a huge bias as well when you know you are looking at an ai generated image or video. I think most can't tell already. On a side note, ai capability in general is increasing roughly 23x per year.

 

[nikos79]

I think any "i can tell" criticism will be gone by end of this year, maybe even mid year. I'd say 1 major release away and the releases are coming every 3-6 months. I'm seeing some moments of complete realism already (mixed with moments of uncanny valley) but some moments imo are definitely hitting the can't tell zone. There is a huge bias as well when you know you are looking at an ai generated image or video. I think most can't tell already. On a side note, ai capability in general is increasing roughly 23x per year.

Yes I was probably very conservative and we are just 1 year away.

I will give you two photos one by AI and one by a famous photographer could you tell the difference?

 

[VinceInMT]

After a big union strike, the actors and writers union guild in America last year signed off a contract with Hollywood producers that AI cannot be used to replace actors or fill in for speech or write movie scripts. They saw this coming. Can't blame them. Next step is that wedding photographers will only need a picture of the bride and groom, and then AI will create an entire movie and still photo wedding album without having to attend the affair. Think of all the money the bride's father will save? Maybe he can avoid the cost of the affair itself? Do the whole thing on Zoom. Of course, the brides will object.

My running partner is a professional photographer who quit doing weddings a few years ago. He said he couldn’t take BrideZilla and her mother anymore. Let AI deal with them.

 

[VinceInMT]

The looming (depressing) reality is that "Hollywood" and studios worldwide will not factor into any future entertainment content whatsoever…..

I don’t care. I quit watching ANY TV or movies several decades ago because, IMO, it was all slop, even before AI slop.