How about standing in a field, pressing the button on a box with a bit of glass attached to the front?does putting a prompt into GPT and sitting back count as art?
In some ways it is, in some ways it isn't.AI is not the same as crafting something in Photoshop.
Will there come questions of honesty and authenticity (how much fraud)? Here is an ai artwork from my chatgpt, the only prompt to the ai was, "create a work of art with no human involvement". Zero creative input from me, it spat this out in 20 seconds:
View attachment 414811
I then told the ai, I want people to think I created it, so provide a description for them, I mean.... after all this took me 1,000hrs of painstaking digital illustration (...right???):
----
"After nearly 2 months of illustrating, I'm pleased to show everyone my latest piece. It explores a moment of convergence, where opposing forces collide and radiate outward. The composition is structured around a central ignition point, using color and texture to suggest energy, pressure, and movement.
Warm tones concentrate at the core to imply intensity and emergence, while cooler hues disperse toward the edges, creating a sense of expansion and flow. Layered textures and branching forms reference both organic growth and geological fracture.
The piece is intended to feel dynamic rather than static, inviting the viewer into a field of motion and transformation rather than a fixed image. I hope you all enjoy it!"
----
"OMG that is amazing!"
"I can't believe you spent so long constructing that, truly a marvel!!"
"Where can I order a print?"
Now, I'm sure people will use AI as a tool and be authentic about it, but there is the other dark side to it that will surely have a big impact on the authentic. With something so powerful, how do we know who is and who isn't being genuine? Does it matter? Will it matter? Is there a threshold for authenticity? What would that be? 95% human driven? Who could even prove it? I am expecting no one will care, or give up trying to care. I already know people listening to random ai generated endless music streams and they could not care less if zero human artistry involved.
I could easily get ai to create a random art image set where I have zero creative involvement. Let's say 25 random images in a cohesive art series/style, print at ultra high quality 150" prints, hang in a show and done. Who would know? At that point is merely asking for a random set of images, printing it and hanging it = art? To what extent would such mass produced "slop" eventually eradicate all value in human created art? The "I can tell it's ai" crowd is exponentially shrinking as it improves by the week. Right now is the worst it will ever be. There is no way anyone will be able to detect ai work very soon if not already. A blind test would probably already fool over 90% in many cases and this will be 100% soon.
AI music might be even more painful. I could see some less than capable bands randomly generating full songs in ai, then simply covering the ai songs and releasing those songs as their own.
All this makes me wonder how visual arts, music, etc becomes viewed in the near future when all levels of source or authenticity are unknown, and there are billions of such works flooding the internet every single day.
My answer to this as an artist is to do what I want and love to do, and share in that with others in the same boat. I've never had a desire to sell work, compete or obtain any notoriety. I imagine that aspect of art will quickly evaporate in the next 10yrs as it is lost in a tsunami of content
How about standing in a field, pressing the button on a box with a bit of glass attached to the front?
Lifting one end of a tray in a room with a dim red light, then allow it to drop again?
Dragging colorful squares from one end to another in a computer program like Lightroom?
Of course the act of prompting isn't art. That's not the point. But this confusion is at the core of many of the end-all rejections of the potential use of AI for the production of 'good' art (whatever the heck 'good' means here). It ultimately boils down to some form of "you're doing it wrong." Which seems entirely sensible, until some guy or gal pops up who does it "all wrong" and your jaw drops to the floor.
In some ways it is, in some ways it isn't.
If you're interested, I'd like to invite you to read some primers on how generative Ai works, and in particular the conceptual underpinnings of these models. There seem to be some misconceptions about this in most of your arguments, making them problematic to comment on.
"Good paintings cannot be made with acrylic paints and synthetic brushes. I hate acrylic paints and synthetic brushes unless they're used to paint a door or a wall."
I think much of the problem is that you've not seen or recognized the possibility of an exception to what you perceive as an axiomatic rule. The same happened when photography came around, when CGI first popped up and in plenty of other cases where a new tech emerged, and the first output poured in and it turned out to be lackluster. Da Vinci wasn't the first guy to break a couple of eggs and paint a ceiling with them. Plenty of "meh" ceilings were painted before he performed his miracles.
One of these days, we're going to see art pop up and one day (perhaps soon after, maybe much later) many people will realize it's damn good art - and generative Ai is at the core of producing it. It's a powerful tool and with 8 billion of us running around, there's plenty of talent to exploit it to magnificent ends. The lack of recognition of what capable hands and minds can do with Ai are limited by the same lack of imagination that currently produces the 'slop'. The real challenge at this point of course is to weed out the chaff. But perhaps AI can help in that.
Maybe part of the problem is that AI is so deceptively simple. In that sense, it's a bit like the camera on a modern phone. Point it at something and you walk away with a technically good photo. But how many of those snapshots are 'good art'? A fairly quick session of prompting by a random person can produce technically 'correct' images - but they'll for the most part be 'slop'. Turns out that just like a decent camera doesn't make one an artist, generative AI cannot do the same thing. That, on the other hand, doesn't mean it's inherently impossible.
I feel the core of much of the criticism of many relates to another point you've made, about AI being a potential threat. Many of us are frightened and/or have rapidly grown a dislike for it. It's understandable, and in many cases also justifiable. However, at the risk of gross oversimplification: if something is 90% problematic and 10% promising, you can't just disregard the 10% because of the 90% (or whatever ratio you want to stick to it). Yet, that's what happens. People dislike it, so they disqualify it categorically. It's human nature.
If you entered your works into a prestigious gallery and got bumped by AI slop how would that make you feel? What if it derailed your entire career? What if you now have to compete against data farms powered by nuclear plants harvesting the work of billions with no permission or copyright conditions? Or better you, you've established your work and specific vision and are making traction and you get derailed by someone using your specific body of work via AI?
Does 'Let there be Art!' still sound like a good thing?
If you don't mind me asking, how are you involved with AI? Have you spent much time using prompts to generate AI images?
I have generated only a few AI images, maybe a dozen, so I am only very briefly familiar with the process. But it seems to me, creating AI images can involve a certain amount of creativity and skill.
First, one must conceive the image. It requires a certain amount of imagination to come up with an idea -- a concept -- and then create a mental image of that concept. Someone with a vivid imagination will "see" a lot of details -- what particular objects will be in the image, their colors and textures, composition (how the objects should be arranged), framing, and lighting. This part of the process would be no different from a painter visualizing the concept for a new painting, and it is inherently a creative process.
Next, one must come up with the right prompts which lead to a generative image which matches the image in your head. In my experience (very limited), it can take some time and multiple additional promts before an acceptable result is obtained. Each modified prompt creates a different version of the scene; sometimes the changes are favorable towards your goal, sometimes not. I am guessing that with practice, more carefully chosen prompts will get better results?
Certainly, the process of creating an AI generated image is quicker and easier than making a photograph or a painting. Maybe it is not art. Maybe it's more of a craft? I don't know. But I do think some creativity is required to make an AI image, and I do think it is possible to make AI images which are compelling, enjoyable, and/or thought provoking in ways that are similar to other visual arts.
Will there come questions of honesty and authenticity (how much fraud)? Here is an ai artwork from my chatgpt, the only prompt to the ai was, "create a work of art with no human involvement". Zero creative input from me, it spat this out in 20 seconds:
View attachment 414811
I then told the ai, I want people to think I created it, so provide a description for them, I mean.... after all this took me 1,000hrs of painstaking digital illustration (...right???):
----
"After nearly 2 months of illustrating, I'm pleased to show everyone my latest piece. It explores a moment of convergence, where opposing forces collide and radiate outward. The composition is structured around a central ignition point, using color and texture to suggest energy, pressure, and movement.
Warm tones concentrate at the core to imply intensity and emergence, while cooler hues disperse toward the edges, creating a sense of expansion and flow. Layered textures and branching forms reference both organic growth and geological fracture.
The piece is intended to feel dynamic rather than static, inviting the viewer into a field of motion and transformation rather than a fixed image. I hope you all enjoy it!"
----
"OMG that is amazing!"
"I can't believe you spent so long constructing that, truly a marvel!!"
"Where can I order a print?"
Now, I'm sure people will use AI as a tool and be authentic about it, but there is the other dark side to it that will surely have a big impact on the authentic. With something so powerful, how do we know who is and who isn't being genuine? Does it matter? Will it matter? Is there a threshold for authenticity? What would that be? 95% human driven? Who could even prove it? I am expecting no one will care, or give up trying to care. I already know people listening to random ai generated endless music streams and they could not care less if zero human artistry involved.
I could easily get ai to create a random art image set where I have zero creative involvement. Let's say 25 random images in a cohesive art series/style, print at ultra high quality 150" prints, hang in a show and done. Who would know? At that point is merely asking for a random set of images, printing it and hanging it = art? To what extent would such mass produced "slop" eventually eradicate all value in human created art? The "I can tell it's ai" crowd is exponentially shrinking as it improves by the week. Right now is the worst it will ever be. There is no way anyone will be able to detect ai work very soon if not already. A blind test would probably already fool over 90% in many cases and this will be 100% soon.
AI music might be even more painful. I could see some less than capable bands randomly generating full songs in ai, then simply covering the ai songs and releasing those songs as their own.
All this makes me wonder how visual arts, music, etc becomes viewed in the near future when all levels of source or authenticity are unknown, and there are billions of such works flooding the internet every single day.
My answer to this as an artist is to do what I want and love to do, and share in that with others in the same boat. I've never had a desire to sell work, compete or obtain any notoriety. I imagine that aspect of art will quickly evaporate in the next 10yrs as it is lost in a tsunami of content
I;m curious about how the AI program selects what to do. Obviously, AI is not a sentient being. It doesn;t really think on it;s own. So there has to be a program behind it written by some actual human being. How does that program work? How does it select the features? IS it polling the entire web for ideas and then selecting and integrating what applies? Anyone know?
As you explain it, I think you're right about how a person can be creative using AI. At the end of the day, however, it's going to marginalize photography as a hobby. Primarily, it will be used by people taking family and vacation shots, as well as capturing other real-time moments of their lives. Artistic photography will be side-tracked to a minor role as film photography is today. I can also imagine AI creating oil paintings with a device that applies paint in selected strokes based on your ideas. I wonder what painters are going to say when this starts happening? How about sculpting?
PS Grammarly AI app just did a nice job updating this post to something more readable.
Here is some playing with Google's new nanobanana pro.
prompt:
"create a fine art photograph, it will need to be shot with a large format view camera, contact printed to platinum palladium, the landscape should be death valley, you decide on the creative aspects"
View attachment 414818
"do another variation, maybe from the desert floor":
View attachment 414819
"Do a tintype":
View attachment 414821
Thanks for that explanation Sean. So basically, it's not thinking out of the box. So it can't be really innovative. It's a copy expert. It's basically polling what others have done, looking at huge data fields of original thinking and work, selecting favored probabilities, and spitting out the same stuff rehashed so you don;t recognize the original parts from the new whole. It;s not really imaginative or intuitive. New ideas will escape it.
It seems we humans still have a chance.
I agree with this. Photography will be left to capturing moments rather than for creative artistic uses for most people.
I'm not saying I'm an expert but I'd point these out as having AI red flags if I ran across them in the wild. There's just something subtly off about the photos. Be it the lighting, the depth of field or perfect sharpness. The tintype messed up by sticking a modern hammer in there. And the tintype got the depth of field wrong. But to a causal viewer everything looks fine.
Limitation of LLMs, but LLMs are not the end game of AI nor should be considered the future of AI. I'm already seeing 2 non LLM AI systems that might send LLMs to the junk pile and lead to AGI, full creativity and new science.
Thanks for that explanation Sean. So basically, it's not thinking out of the box. So it can't be really innovative. It's a copy expert. It's basically polling what others have done, looking at huge data fields of original thinking and work, selecting favored probabilities, and spitting out the same stuff rehashed so you don;t recognize the original parts from the new whole. It;s not really imaginative or intuitive. New ideas will escape it.
It seems we humans still have a chance.
Limitation of LLMs, but LLMs are not the end game of AI nor should be considered the future of AI. I'm already seeing 2 non LLM AI systems that might send LLMs to the junk pile and lead to AGI, full creativity and new science.
This whole concept of authenticity fascinates me.Now, I'm sure people will use AI as a tool and be authentic about it, but there is the other dark side to it that will surely have a big impact on the authentic. With something so powerful, how do we know who is and who isn't being genuine? Does it matter? Will it matter? Is there a threshold for authenticity? What would that be? 95% human driven? Who could even prove it? I am expecting no one will care, or give up trying to care. I already know people listening to random ai generated endless music streams and they could not care less if zero human artistry involved.
Large Language Models andWhat are LLM and AGI?
I think one could argue that the process you describe is pretty much how many human artists work as well.It's basically polling what others have done, looking at huge data fields of original thinking and work, selecting favored probabilities, and spitting out the same stuff rehashed so you don;t recognize the original parts from the new whole.
I think one could argue that the process you describe is pretty much how many human artists work as well.
There is a saying, the gist of which goes back many years, which says, “Good artists copy. Great artists steal.”
So this is how AI views humans, murderous brutes with hammers?"Do a tintype":
Oh definitely, but I suspect in another year these red flags will evaporate. I think the hardest ones to tell right now are product based photography images.
edited: "polling and stitching" are Alan Edward Klein's words, not mine; did you meant to reply to him?This is also not true at all. It is not polling or stitching.
If true, you seem to be making the case that AI can create?The generated stuff may have never appeared in the data. It is in that way very novel
So this is how AI views humans, murderous brutes with hammers?
Actually, I really like this image. Looks like it could be a wanted poster for Maxwell the silver hammer murderer.
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