C-22 Found film

fletch2 · Feb 25, 2014

The chemicals for everything but developer just arrived. As a recap the MSDN listing for part A of the developer kit is.

fletch2 said:
This is only going from the MSDS listing

============= Composition/Information on Ingredients =============

Ingred Name:ETHYLENE DICHLORIDE (SARA III)
Ingred Name:BENZYL ALCOHOL
Ingred
Name:4-(N-ETHYL-N-2-METHANESULFONYLAMINOETHYL)-2-METHYLPHENYLENEDIA
MINE SESQUISULFATE MONOHYD
Ingred NameIETHYLENE GLYCOL

I'm assuming that the Ethylene Dichloride and the Diethylene glycol are there to preserve/stabilise the components and that the CD3 and Benzyl Alcohol are the only photographically active chemicals? Is that reasonable? If I mixed a new part A using just CD-3 and Benzyl Alcohol, could I do without the glycol and the Ethylene Dichloride?

If I decide to do this over and start from scratch is this the formula I have for the developer (BJP formula circa 1958. For 1 ltr of developer)

Benzyl Alcohol 8.5cc
Sodium Metaborate 40gm
Trisodium Phosphate 20gm
Sodium Sulphate (anhyd) 2.5g
Potassium Bromide 1.2gm
Potassium iodide 0.01gm
6-nitrobenzimideazole nitrate 0.02gm
CD-3 7.5gm

Water to 1 liter

In general is this formula ok?

6-nitrobenzimideazole nitrate is Kodak Antifog #2. Does anyone know where to get some?

Photo Engineer · Feb 25, 2014

LOOK! This formula cannot be duplicated exactly. It is the result of advanced organic chemistry, so you can only approach it approximately.

This was done using SO2 gas and a lot of oddball (to you) equipment.

You will only do a "fair" job of getting there.

PE

frobozz · Feb 26, 2014

fletch2 said:
6-nitrobenzimideazole nitrate is Kodak Antifog #2. Does anyone know where to get some?

Kodak sells Antifoggant AF-2000 for movie film processing, 10L for $55.25 Here is a sheet comparing it to AF-9:

http://motion.kodak.com/motion/uplo...robat_en_motion_support_processing_af2000.pdf

Here is the MSDS:

Dead Link Removed

Duncan

Photo Engineer · Feb 26, 2014

AF2000 will be found to be less effective than 5-Nitro!

But, any C22 film from about 40 years ago will be very foggy and might need a lot more antifoggant! IDK.

PE

Athiril · Feb 26, 2014

I've gotten vastly better negs with much better dMin on old fogged film by increased restrainers, dMax was also restrained, and it required, and required an increase in developer time. I haven't used AF #2 before however.

John Shriver · Mar 3, 2014

I only did the bleach, re-expose, and C-22 processing because I'd already processed the film as B&W, thinking I'd never find a C-22 kit. But I finally found one. The CD-3 in it (powder form) was fine, light tan powder, it was the bleach that had eaten through the foil bag.

I can understand your desire to do B&W processing first, to be sure that you get an image. If you process in C-22 with dead developer, once you bleach the film (which will succeed), there's no second chance. But developing as B&W first is really going to compromise the quality, and you have to use absolutely fresh bleach. It's a very nasty process, really hard to keep the film clean in re-exposure.

Instead of developing as B&W first, get some unexposed C-22 or E-4 film, expose it as a test roll, mix the kit, and see if it comes out with "reasonable" color. If it does, process the found film. If not, keep looking on eBay for another C-22 kit.

fletch2 · Mar 8, 2014

John,
good suggestion about using an old/new C-22 film as an experiment, If I can find it in 35mm it will give me a lot of film length I can use to test variations in processing. I'll have the makings of entirely fresh developer in two weeks that gives me the option of trying three variations on the process.

1) The kit as bought (thinking this won't work)
2) Part B of the kit with a fresh mixed part A (mainly new CD-3)
3) The 1958 BJP formula mixed from fresh chemicals.

I'll scan ebay for some unused 35mm. I have a nice little Canonette that hasn't seen light in a while.

StoneNYC · Mar 8, 2014

fletch2 said:
John,
good suggestion about using an old/new C-22 film as an experiment, If I can find it in 35mm it will give me a lot of film length I can use to test variations in processing. I'll have the makings of entirely fresh developer in two weeks that gives me the option of trying three variations on the process.

1) The kit as bought (thinking this won't work)
2) Part B of the kit with a fresh mixed part A (mainly new CD-3)
3) The 1958 BJP formula mixed from fresh chemicals.

I'll scan ebay for some unused 35mm. I have a nice little Canonette that hasn't seen light in a while.

This is exciting, I hope the BJP formula works! I have one SHOT and 3 other "fresh" rolls of C-22/NK-17 (was it NK?? Something -17) frozen and ready to shoot / develop!

Gerald C Koch · Mar 10, 2014

fletch2 said:
In general is this formula ok?

The formula calls for sodium sulfite not sodium sulfate. I hope that this is just a typo.

fletch2 · Mar 10, 2014

Gerald C Koch said:
The formula calls for sodium sulfite not sodium sulfate. I hope that this is just a typo.

It's a typo I ordered Sulfite

fletch2 · Mar 19, 2014

Just an update. CX-135 film proved elusive but I managed to get 3 rolls of Kodakcolor-X in 620 with an expiration date of mid 1966. This is good for two reasons, first the biggest single source of the C-22 film I have came from a camera lot that also included some rolls of VP620. The pictures on those rolls all seem to date from the late 60's so there is a good chance the color film will be of the same era. That makes my test stock reasonably close to what I will end up developing. I plan to shoot a roll of CX620 at ISO 40 and developing it 3 ways. A second bonus is 3 more 620 reels

I now have all the chemicals for the BJP formula save the 6-nitrobenzimideazole nitrate AKA Kodak Antifog #2. I haven't been able to find a source for this and I will need an anti fogging agent. I am considering using Benzotriazole instead and using one of the other CX620 rolls to work out the concentration.

StoneNYC · Mar 19, 2014

fletch2 said:
Just an update. CX-135 film proved elusive but I managed to get 3 rolls of Kodakcolor-X in 620 with an expiration date of mid 1966. This is good for two reasons, first the biggest single source of the C-22 film I have came from a camera lot that also included some rolls of VP620. The pictures on those rolls all seem to date from the late 60's so there is a good chance the color film will be of the same era. That makes my test stock reasonably close to what I will end up developing. I plan to shoot a roll of CX620 at ISO 40 and developing it 3 ways. A second bonus is 3 more 620 reels

I now have all the chemicals for the BJP formula save the 6-nitrobenzimideazole nitrate AKA Kodak Antifog #2. I haven't been able to find a source for this and I will need an anti fogging agent. I am considering using Benzotriazole instead and using one of the other CX620 rolls to work out the concentration.

Oh I have some Kodacolor in my fridge... If I had realized it was C-22... Oh well... Hah!

MattKing · Mar 19, 2014

StoneNYC said:
Oh I have some Kodacolor in my fridge... If I had realized it was C-22... Oh well... Hah!

The original Kodacolor and Kodacolor-X were both C-22.

Kodacolor II, Kodacolor 400, Kodacolor HR (disk only) and the various Kodacolor VR films were all C-41.

StoneNYC · Mar 19, 2014

MattKing said:
The original Kodacolor and Kodacolor-X were both C-22.

Kodacolor II, Kodacolor 400, Kodacolor HR (disk only) and the various Kodacolor VR films were all C-41.

That's a shame, I just "wasted" two "fresh" rolls (one of each of those) and re-rolled with 70mm HP5+... I needed the backing paper and spools... I feel bad now... It's a neat color though...

I tried selling them first here in the classifies but no one wanted them so then I listed on eBay and no one wanted them there so I gave up and unrolled them to use the backing paper... Sorry guys...

John Shriver · Feb 18, 2021

Just for the record on Process C-22 Liquid Developer, here's a Kodak marketing sheet on it from 1970 that I just got.

I've got several 1 gallon developer kits, so I may mix one and see how it works on some High Speed Ektachrome. (I have mixed hardener, bleach, and fixer left over from a powder 1-pint C-22 kit.) Curious to see if the sulfur dioxide made Part A long term stable. Won't know until I open that bottle and see if it stinks.

C-22 Found film

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