Bronica's underrated?

hsandler · Oct 7, 2014

I'm very happy with my Bronicas. I have an ETRSi with 3 lenses, and recently acquired an SQ-A with two lenses. I like a camera with an electronically-timed shutter. No need to worry about calibrating the speed over time as springs age. No CLAs. If something breaks, I'll just replace it. I find the standard Bronica focusing screens much brighter than any of the 1950s Japanese TLRs I've had. The ETRSi, in particular, is a very well sorted system, with all the main lenses taking 62mm filters, and a clever speed grip design that slides on and off quickly. The mirror lock-up on the SQ-A is a bit better design than on the ETRSi though, having both a one-time, and a continuous setting.

Old-N-Feeble · Oct 7, 2014

hsandler said:
I'm very happy with my Bronicas. I have an ETRSi with 3 lenses, and recently acquired an SQ-A with two lenses. I like a camera with an electronically-timed shutter. No need to worry about calibrating the speed over time as springs age. No CLAs. If something breaks, I'll just replace it. I find the standard Bronica focusing screens much brighter than any of the 1950s Japanese TLRs I've had. The ETRSi, in particular, is a very well sorted system, with all the main lenses taking 62mm filters, and a clever speed grip design that slides on and off quickly. The mirror lock-up on the SQ-A is a bit better design than on the ETRSi though, having both a one-time, and a continuous setting.

What broke on yours?

skysh4rk · Oct 7, 2014

brianentz said:
Anyone care to comment?

Perhaps they're undervalued by many folks, but I rate them highly. I'd argue that their cost to performance ratio is nearly unbeatable for medium format SLRs. Some may say that their other competitors have sharper glass, etc., but I've always thought that sharpness and image quality were more dependent upon the skills of the photographer than any piece of gear, especially when we're comparing the major medium format companies. I've never had a reason to complain about the images that my Bronicas can produce.

I just wish that there were one lens in the Bronica SQ line-up faster than f/2.8 or in the GS-1 line-up as fast as f/2.8.

hsandler · Oct 7, 2014

Old-N-Feeble said:
What broke on yours?

Nothing---yet. I'm just saying.

Mike Johnston at theonlinephotographer wrote a nice piece about Bronicas a couple years ago:

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2012/10/bargain-medium-format.html

nbagno · Oct 7, 2014

hsandler said:
Nothing---yet. I'm just saying.

Mike Johnston at theonlinephotographer wrote a nice piece about Bronicas a couple years ago:

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2012/10/bargain-medium-format.html

That article is what got me deep into film photography.

Sent from my SM-N900V using Tapatalk

Gimenosaiz · Oct 9, 2014

Hello.
I've a S2A and a ECTLII and I'm very happy ... I also have several lenses. I've never used a Hassel or another MF SLR but .... for the price I paid I'm more than satisfied.

Regards

Sirius Glass · Oct 9, 2014

When I first got into photography in the early 1960's I wanted the Bronica S in the worst way. When I joined APUG I inherited my father's Mamiya C330 with the 65mm, 80, and 250mm lenses and every attachable device known to mankind. I was not happy with it and so after much research I traded it in for the Hasselblad 503CX. While I was working on the trade the camera sales person also showed me the Bronicas. I found the Bronicas bulkier than the Hasselblads and I felt not as rugged as the Bronicas. I probably could have been happy with the Bronica, but the store had a Hasselblad repairman and the supply of Hasselblad components was much better than the Bronica family.

E. von Hoegh · Oct 9, 2014

brianentz said:
Anyone care to comment? It seems to me that Bronica's never get their due. 2nd always to mamiya, hassle, pentax.... They seem to me to be a pretty friendly system with optics just shy of hassle. Even the Bronica RF645 gets no respect. I'm just perplexed at why they never get praised for being anything other than a workhorse.

Why does this be?

I love my etrsi system.

'Bronicas'. The plural, not the possessive.

brian steinberger · Oct 10, 2014

I have a Bronica RF645 with 45/65/100 and love it. IMO it's the best camera ever made. Small and compact, large negative, and controls in the right spot. It also has perfect metering and sharp lenses. I had an SQ-A for many years and loved it as well. Much cheaper alternative to Hassy and as mentioned earlier in this thread it has a great speed grip! So yes I'm a fellow Bronica lover!

Richard Jepsen · Oct 11, 2014

I bought the RF645 when it first came out. Later I added the 100mm and adjusted the rangefinder for the new focal length.

I have posted many comments about the strengths of the camera. The viewfinder is very large and as contrasty as a Leica MP. This makes the camera with the 65mm optic fast and easy to focus. The 65mm is the equivalent to a 40mm in 135 format. The camera is automated just enough to be useful without getting in the way of taking images. As mentioned, the lenses are sharp, in camera meter accurate, the finder automation display readable, and the auto shutter blind allows a lens change without activating a dark slide. The size of a 3 lens kit is the smallest available.

I have a Rollei TLR f/2.8. It also is a great camera. The RF645 optics are more contrasty and have excellent but not better bokeh. I read the Rollei may have higher resolution but you won't see it in monochrome 9x12 inch prints or a little larger. A bigger negative is called for if one printed 15x15 or 16x20. A 645 neg will suffice to support the print size most people enlarge to. To that point the RF645 is the easiest MF camera to use with the smallest interchangable lens kit available.

One last comment; the build quality and ergonomics are much better than the typical Bronica. The RF645 also has the advantage of being one of the last camera bodies produced.

PentaxBronica · Oct 26, 2014

About the only problem Bronica item I have is a PE 150mm lens which seems not to close its shutter (so you end up with a dark smear across what should be multiple frames of film). It must be the lens as I've had the same fault on two bodies while using it, and neither body plays up with a different lens! Servicing would be more than I paid for the lens, and I use the 75mm and 50mm lenses more often anyway.

Fit the speed grip and a prism viewfinder and it handles just like a giant 35mm camera, in fact the ergonomics are better than most as that big chunky grip is easier to hold than a 35mm body. Swap to a waist-level finder and it's superb for landscapes on a tripod - no need to kneel in the mud to get that low angle shot.

You can often benefit from people not knowing much about the system. I picked up a "spares or repair" ETR body as a project, then found that there was nothing wrong with it. The dealer simply didn't know that the shutter won't fire if you don't have a loaded film back attached, and the multi exposure lever was missing so they couldn't flick that to make it fire without a film back. Fitted a spare lever from a very broken ETRS I had around and I have a fully functioning spare body for £20.

AlexRT · Oct 27, 2014

I have old Bronica-S2. This is a great camera - it is my opinion. Nice and not so expansive lens in our days. Of course, only manual options are here - but it is best option to learn photgraphy more deeper .

flavio81 · Oct 27, 2014

David A. Goldfarb said:
My S2A was a great camera, and so were the Nikkor medium format optics of that era. The attraction and downfall of the early system was the falling mirror design (and split mirror with the EC system), which made it possible for wide lenses to protrude into the mirror box, so they didn't need as much retrofocus correction as lenses for other MF SLRs. The 40mm lens was a real gem, as was the 50/2.8.

Not having a mirror to block out the viewfinder, however, necessitated a system with three shutters--one for the film plane, one for the viewfinder, and one to prevent light from reflecting up from the mirror onto the film during exposure, making the camera louder, heavier, and more complex than it might otherwise be.

Spot on, particularly with the retrofocus comment.

This is the reason i have rejected a Bronica EC at good price not so long ago. The camera looks really well built but so far all i've read is that reliability is a nightmare with that machine.

But thanks to this thread now I know which Bronica to look for.

Argenticien · Oct 27, 2014

After an initial focusing screen adjustment, and replacement of light seals on one film back, I've had no problems so far with my S2 after 3+ years with it. Wait, one small problem: I've managed to make one or two double exposures through some strange sequence of events in switching backs, despite the protections meant to prevent this. That may have been user error. Otherwise the kit is fun, usable, and reliable. I should say that it does draw attention among normal (read: younger, digicam-toting) people, as much as or more than a TLR might do, owing to its unusual grey & chrome appearance.

The camera + 75/2.8 + 50/3.5 make an acceptably portable normal/wide kit, volumetrically speaking. I can fit those components, a JCH film box, and some various small bits in a LowePro Flipside 200. In terms of mass, it can get a bit tiring through a full-day trek. (Much of that problem is down to the 50/3.5, which is like a leaden weight. If I were to get a 50/2.8 like any reasonable person would do, that might help.)

--Dave

Alan Gales · Oct 27, 2014

flavio81 said:
Spot on, particularly with the retrofocus comment.

This is the reason i have rejected a Bronica EC at good price not so long ago. The camera looks really well built but so far all i've read is that reliability is a nightmare with that machine.

But thanks to this thread now I know which Bronica to look for.

From what I have read the split mirror system on the EC was a bear to fix if it ever got out of alignment but the problems with the mirror system were exaggerated. I used to shoot EC's and never had a problem with the mirrors.

I'm not saying you are wrong. This is what I have read and my experience with using the EC cameras non professionally. I'm not an expert on them.

The ECTL's have a built in meter and I read that if the meter fails the camera becomes a door stop so as old as they are I would stay away from the ECTL unless I got it really cheap.

I like the EC and earlier S2a and I especially like the lenses. The cameras and lenses are dirt cheap and because of the focal plane shutter the lenses have no leaf shutter that needs periodic service. Since Jimmy Koh retired I don't know of anyone who services the cameras anymore.

I have also owned a Hasselblad 500cm. It is a better camera but of course a lot more expensive.

johnha · Oct 28, 2014

Argenticien said:
After an initial focusing screen adjustment, and replacement of light seals on one film back, I've had no problems so far with my S2 after 3+ years with it. Wait, one small problem: I've managed to make one or two double exposures through some strange sequence of events in switching backs, despite the protections meant to prevent this. That may have been user error. Otherwise the kit is fun, usable, and reliable. I should say that it does draw attention among normal (read: younger, digicam-toting) people, as much as or more than a TLR might do, owing to its unusual grey & chrome appearance.

I've recently acquired an S2A (no film through that's come back yet though). Apparently you can get double exposures by removing the back before cycling the body/shutter then putting the back, back on. I think the S2/S2A are the most elegant of the 6x6 SLRs (the Kowa's running a close second).

When I started shooting medium format in the '90s, Bronica weren't underrated - there were Hasseys and Rollies then the rest. If you wanted a 6x6 SLR, Bronica was the only 'sensible' option - rumour had it that the Kiev's had to be re-built by the UK importer to fix light leaks etc. In the end I bought an SQ-B - cheaper than the SQ-Ai and at the time I couldn't justify the cost of any of the extras that offered any benefit (metered prisms, power drives etc).

Paul in Arizona · Oct 29, 2014

I have an ECTL w/Nikkor P 75mm. It works flawlessly. A bit bigger, heavier than a TLR and built like a tank.
My only MF image comparison is Rollei [a 3.5E and 2.8C]. I don't know what the pixel peepers would say but the Nikkor is razor sharp -sharper and contrastier than the Xenotars.
That said I prefer using the Rolleis both for the ergonomics and to some extent to indefinable image quality characteristics. Purely subjective of course.
One of these days I'd like to pick up an RF645 if the price is right.

mweintraub · Oct 29, 2014

Paul in Arizona said:
I don't know what the pixel peepers would say but the Nikkor is razor sharp -sharper and contrastier than the Xenotars.

You mean grain peepers.

Les Berkley · Oct 29, 2014

Just got an ETRS w/meterless prism, 75mm and Speed Grip. Love it. Traded my RB stuff for it, and I don't miss the weight. Picked up a 150mm lens on eBay for USD 36.50, and a screen for $16. Waiting for a second back, for which I paid $45. Can't beat the price or quality.

Cropline · Oct 30, 2014

wiltw said:
Unfortunately, Bronica was purchased by Tamron, then put out of business by them. So the amateur of today does not hear the name except by testimony...no current offerings in the film or digital realm. Kinda like asking about handheld meters today, almost everyone chimes in about Sekonic, Minolta (who was once king in the meter business until early 2000's) never gets mentioned simply because so few are aware of their existence!
..................

Wise response.
To the OP I would say that could be all the better for you. Many experienced film photographers had at least some knowledge of Bronica's presence.

Why not think of Bronica as a best kept secret. When I pick up my ETRSi, I have no doubts about it's capabilities. As this equipment ages and serviceability becomes an issue, the better your chances of finding usable replacement.

My 645 isn't going anywhere and a GS-1 (maybe two) will be coming.

Alan Gales · Oct 30, 2014

I always thought of Bronica as wedding and portrait cameras. I have only been to one wedding where the photographer shot a Hasselblad. The Bronica's did a great job and were more affordable than a Hasselblad kit.

Peter Simpson · Oct 30, 2014

SQ-A here. Bought it because I couldn't afford a Hasselblad. It's true what they say about the grip -- it makes a clumsy box much more usable. As does the metering prism finder. It takes great pictures, but the non-return mirror does take a bit of getting used to. I love mine. Have both the 6x6 and the 4.5x6 backs and 50, 80 and 150 lenses. I think I have maybe $600 into the set and for that I have a quality MF setup.

Neil Poulsen · Nov 1, 2014

I sure like my Bronica S2a that I had for years and got some very nice photos with it. I had several lenses and a pretty full selection of accessories.

But the 1/40th flash sync was a downer, and I felt that couldn't use it except on a tripod. A few years ago, I got a ton of Mamiya RB equipment, several bodies and lenses. So, I sold the Bronica and all the Mamiya stuff that I didn't need and ended up with a pretty complete RB and Mamiya Press systems.

IloveTLRs · Nov 1, 2014

brianentz said:
Anyone care to comment? It seems to me that Bronica's never get their due. 2nd always to mamiya, hassle, pentax.... They seem to me to be a pretty friendly system with optics just shy of hassle. Even the Bronica RF645 gets no respect. I'm just perplexed at why they never get praised for being anything other than a workhorse.

Why does this be?

...

I had an S (not an S2) years ago, because I couldn't afford a Hasselblad. When I finally got a Hassy I was disappointed that you couldn't close-focus like a Bronica.

On mine, the mirror/shutter CLANG could be heard down the block, I had issues with multiple backs (frame spacing & one where the back popped-open mid-roll) and eventually the focus went out of alignment. Even in Japan, most repair people didn't want to touch a Bronica, so I sold mine. I think that's why they weren't popular.

It took really nice photos while I had it, though.

Sirius Glass · Nov 1, 2014

IloveTLRs said:
When I finally got a Hassy I was disappointed that you couldn't close-focus like a Bronica.

Use extension tubes

Bronica's underrated?

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