Bronica S2

[mtnbkr]

Looking for some input here. There's a local guy on FB Marketplace selling a Bronica S2 kit (body, Nikkor 75/2.8 lens, 2 backs with darkslide, eye level finder, and several rolls of film of indeterminate age) for $350. This was marked down from $550 and has been listed at the current price for 2 weeks. The pics look good, but he says he hasn't tested it other than to dryfire the shutter. He claims the glass (lens, finder, etc) is free from mold.

Is there anything specific I should ask or look, besides the obvious you'd check on any camera, for if I check it out in person? What are some common issues with the S2? How's the price given what is listed? Given how long it has been listed, I'm going to offer $300 if I decide to pursue it.

Chris

 

[Don_ih]

Bronica S2

Read this. It's fun.

It's a very risky camera, from what I've heard.

 

[OAPOli]

I have the earlier "S" version. I think it's a lovely camera that is fun to use. Full of convenient features, loud and heavy like the P67. The Nikkor-P will flare if the sun is near the frame but the image quality is otherwise good.

The screen/foam issue is well documented online and easy to fix yourself. Mine was ok but 1) mirror got stuck downwards, I sent it to be fixed; 2) film counter on the back was not advancing, which I fixed myself.

You can dry fire the camera if you remove the back to check for gross shutter inaccuracy or mirror issues. You can load the back with a dummy roll and check it (fire on "B" to mark the frames with a pencil).

 

[mtnbkr]

Read this. It's fun.

It's a very risky camera, from what I've heard.

Thanks. I haven't seen that article, but it aligns with others I've read. It looks like the foam replacement is fairly straightforward, but I'm not sure I want to take that on. That said, issues like rotting foam are going to be endemic with most cameras of this vintage.

Are there any common non-foam issues? Most of what I find is either the foam or comments about not being able to get repairs done, but no specific failures in the mechanism.

Chris

 

[mtnbkr]

I have the earlier "S" version. I think it's a lovely camera that is fun to use. Full of convenient features, loud and heavy like the P67. The Nikkor-P will flare if the sun is near the frame but the image quality is otherwise good.

The screen/foam issue is well documented online and easy to fix yourself. Mine was ok but 1) mirror got stuck downwards, I sent it to be fixed; 2) film counter on the back was not advancing, which I fixed myself.

You can dry fire the camera if you remove the back to check for gross shutter inaccuracy or mirror issues. You can load the back with a dummy roll and check it (fire on "B" to mark the frames with a pencil).

Thanks. The foam issue does appear to be within my capability to fix. Not sure about internal mechanical issues though.

Chris

 

[Don_ih]

Are there any common non-foam issues?

I know a guy who has one with incurable light leaks and now the shutter has become unreliable, so he retired it.

One of the problems with the foam (and all such foam in cameras) is how it can migrate into every bit of the camera once it deteriorates.

A lot of these cameras are sitting dead on shelves. But everyone with a working one says its really good.

I think you need to toss a coin.

 

[MFstooges]

I have not found a write up with specific info about the foam thickness

 

[mtnbkr]

I know a guy who has one with incurable light leaks and now the shutter has become unreliable, so he retired it.

One of the problems with the foam (and all such foam in cameras) is how it can migrate into every bit of the camera once it deteriorates.

A lot of these cameras are sitting dead on shelves. But everyone with a working one says its really good.

I think you need to toss a coin.

Yeah, that's what I'm doing mentally. $350 is just on the other side of the threshold for risk. If repairs were more easily obtained, I might be just wing it, but given the scarcity of repair services, I'm hesitant.

Chris

 

[mollyc]

It's funny, I saw this same marketplace post and started researching it a few days ago. I decided it was probably not worth the risk and this specific model can go sideways pretty easily.

 

[jeffreyg]

That lens is very sharp. I had a S2A which was an improvement over some of the short comings of the S2. The S2A served me well for about twenty years It never needed a repair and I sold it for what I paid for it forty before.

 

[mtnbkr]

It's funny, I saw this same marketplace post and started researching it a few days ago. I decided it was probably not worth the risk and this specific model can go sideways pretty easily.

That might be why it's still for sale, we're all coming to the same conclusion.

Chris

 

[Don_ih]

It is, however, getting to the point where you are practically guaranteed your money back just by selling the individual items on ebay.

 

[Hassasin]

I will only say that going into that Bronica lens line, EC is the only way. Not without pitfalls, but superior to anything before it, yet lenses are same mount. And it is a joy to use with most lenses small (no shutter) and helicoid a smooth operator. On a heavier side, but balances beautifully, much better than a Hasselblad. As the line was rather short lived, screens are on a darker side (still about what P67 offers or Hass prior to last line of screens).

 

[mollyc]

That might be why it's still for sale, we're all coming to the same conclusion.

Chris

There's a CLA-ed Pentax 645N with two lenses also listed, which I think would be a much better/more reliable setup, but it's also nearly three times the price, listed at $950. I'm really looking for a 645 personally.

 

[mtnbkr]

It is, however, getting to the point where you are practically guaranteed your money back just by selling the individual items on ebay.

True, but I don't want to get into all that. It's tedious enough selling a single item here and there.

Chris

 

[mtnbkr]

There's a CLA-ed Pentax 645N with two lenses also listed, which I think would be a much better/more reliable setup, but it's also nearly three times the price, listed at $950. I'm really looking for a 645 personally.

Yeah, that's more than I want to toss into an idle interest. I think 645 would be a nice step up from 35mm, but I haven't seen a 645 format camera for a price I want to pay right now.

Chris

 

[mollyc]

Yeah, that's more than I want to toss into an idle interest. I think 645 would be a nice step up from 35mm, but I haven't seen a 645 format camera for a price I want to pay right now.

Chris

There's a member here selling a Pentax 645 with two lenses for a seemingly very reasonable price, but you'd have to work out a non-electronic payment with him. If I lived closer, I'd be keen to do an in-person sale for this.

For Sale - FS: Pentax 645 Medium format motor-drive 120 film camera

FS: Pentax 645 Medium Format 120 film camera. Multi-mode medium-format SLR camera with built-in motor drive. Produces 6x4.5cm negatives on 120 size film. Uses six AA-size batteries (included or not per buyer preferences) A wide variety of high quality directly interchangeable Pentax lenses...

www.photrio.com

 

[reddesert]

I think the Bronica S2 / EC is a funky and interesting system, and if you're patient you can find lenses used at fairly inexpensive prices. But I also think it made more sense when it sold at a bigger discount to newer medium format systems. For example, surfing the KEH website and looking at Bronica ETRS components in "Bargain" condition, one could assemble:
ETRS body w/o finder $122, 75.2,8 MC $100, prism finder E $59, 120 film back $89. Total $370 + tax for a full 645 slr, newer than the S2, working. And KEH is not the cheapest source ever; but in my experience KEH bargain condition is completely usable, and has their guarantee.

One other thing, IIRC the S2 prisms are really big and heavy. It handles better with a waist level finder.

 

[Hassasin]

EC differs a lot from S2 and lens compatibility does not put them any closer. Nothing is interchangeable, lenses aside. EC sounds different, shakes different, I dare to say is far more reliable, and in fact it was redesign away from S2 to address its inherent problems, while adding a few of its own.

ETR was a start of new era in Bronica cameras, everything prior to it was too complex in engineering and manufacture and likely was deemed unsustainable. I wish EC was kept alive for another decade or two, as I prefer it to any of the later MF bodies (ETR/SQ/GS). But as ETR and what followed was a totally new start, any experiences using one are not similar to anything one gets from S2 or especially EC.

 

[hsandler]

I have both an SQ-A and an S2A. The foam issue with the S2 and S2A is more serious than the light leak issues of many older cameras; it's that the foam thickness influences the focus on the ground glass. If you can handle the camera before buying, it's easy enough to check: look at a distant sharp object, like a street light at night and see if it's sharp in the middle of the ground glass with the lens at its infinity stop.

There is foam both under the ground glass seat and behind the mirror. It's not as easy to change as one might think. I ended up cracking both the screen and the mirror when I tried to change mine. A third-party replacement screen from China had very poor snap and I ended up putting the cracked screen back in and leaving the mirror as is because it's better. The camera has beautiful art deco/streamline styling and is fun and practical to shoot, but frankly, the more modern SQ-A outperforms it and has leaf shutters, a good right-hand speed winder grip, and mirror lock up to boot.

Bronicas by Howard Sandler, on Flickr

 

[outwest]

I had an S2a around the early 1980s. Nice looking camera. I got it with 2 lenses for $200. One of the lenses was a beautiful long one, maybe a 200? Anyway its helical focusing tube had just enough play in it that the not inconsiderable jar given to the camera by the shutter closing and the mirror getting out of the way and then exposing at longer shutter speeds would give the helical enough of a shake to give a slight double exposure to the negs even on a tripod. I found that hugging the lens and camera together while releasing the shutter could eliminate the doubling but it was a pain to think about so I got rid of it and got a Kowa Super 66 - now that is a camera. I still have it even though I also have a Hassie. It is still hard to beat a good Rollieflex!

 

[Cholentpot]

I think the PC flash socket on all of them have issues. I have an S2 and I did have to replace the foam. It is very capable though heavy.

 

[mollyc]

I see this ad has been updated with the seller stating that he is getting it tested and cleaned, so you might want to keep an eye on it, or reach out to him if you still have interest.

 

[Oldwino]

I had a 2A, and I found it to be a loud and heavy, but beautiful, camera. The lenses are great. I bought mine from KEH, and a few months into ownership, the shutter jammed. I sent it back to them, they serviced it, and it worked perfectly thereafter.

 

[mtnbkr]

I see this ad has been updated with the seller stating that he is getting it tested and cleaned, so you might want to keep an eye on it, or reach out to him if you still have interest.

Thanks!

Chris