bokeh

[mono]

Sorry, my English is not good as yours, but I still do not understand what bokeh really is or means!
Can you help me, please?

 

[catem]

O.Fernandez, thanks for that, it's the most comprehensive and clearest summary I've seen.
In answer to mono's question, isn't bokeh *just* 'out of focus' areas. We perceive this differently, in terms of what is aesthetically acceptable or not (so it's subjective). But an attempt has been made to define certain kinds or patterns of renditions in the out of focus areas.

I think part of the problem of understanding/defining bokeh is a cultural one, and in our western way we want something definite and *right* or *wrong* when it's not as cut and dried as that, and the Japanese language is infinitely more subtle than ours. In the end, it doesn't matter, go with what pleases you. If you think of 'bokeh' as meaning 'blur' (which I think is how it translates) then you realise it isn't specific, and it isn't in itself value-laden, though we make judgements about particular renditions of it.

 

[firecracker]

I think part of the problem of understanding/defining bokeh is a cultural one, and in our western way we want something definite and *right* or *wrong* when it's not as cut and dried as that, and the Japanese language is infinitely more subtle than ours. In the end, it doesn't matter, go with what pleases you. If you think of 'bokeh' as meaning 'blur' (which I think is how it translates) then you realise it isn't specific, and it isn't in itself value-laden, though we make judgements about particular renditions of it.

Speaking of subtlety, here's something related to what we've been discussing here:

http://72.14.207.104/search?q=cache...&hl=ja&gl=jp&ct=clnk&cd=10&ie=UTF-8&inlang=ja

what some Japanese people pay attention to is the part of substance that hardly matters to and/or simply not wanted by others. The texture of raw meat (in this picture it's beef) is just as popular as the bokeh taste on lens quality. Japanese people tend to prefer it with some (but to me too much) fat rather than the lean part only, and they think it's their Japanese taste.

I think I've posted a similar comment somewhere before. But that's the easiest way to explain what subtlety means to over here.

 

[Dan Fromm]

Where in South Jersey? I'm in Haddon Township.

Right down the road. Cherry Hill.

 

[George Papantoniou]

Sorry, my English is not good as yours, but I still do not understand what bokeh really is or means!
Can you help me, please?

You should do a Google search for Bokeh and you'll be fairly enlightened. A simplified way to put it (sorry if I oversimplify it) would be:

Bokeh is the way the out-of-focus areas of the image look when using a specific lens. Some lenses have nice Bokeh (the out-of-focus areas look nice) and some other not. Pinhole cameras have OK Bokeh (but they don't have a lens

A German (like you) might ask: Why the h**l would someone care how an out-of-focus area would look when the objective is not to have out-of-focus areas on the film ? Well, the answer to that can be given by someone else...

 

[George Papantoniou]

Sorry, my English is not good as yours, but I still do not understand what bokeh really is or means!
Can you help me, please?

How have you done so nice pictures without knowing what Bokeh is ?

(PS shoudn't you spell your name "Volker" ?)

 

[mono]

How have you done so nice pictures without knowing what Bokeh is ?

(PS shoudn't you spell your name "Volker" ?)

Thank you George!
But I really have no idea what bokeh is, have never heard of it before I joined APUG.
This name is correct with F! Most people ask this question ;-)

 

[O Fernandez]

Bokeh Articles from Photo Techniques Magazine

Mr Fernandez, this is really impressive !!!! I will look for the issue you mention in my Photo Techniques collection, but in case I don't find it, could you point out the link where the third article can be found (the one that is posted on the internet) ?

You can purchase back issue of Photo Techniques on bokeh (May/June 1997/Vol. 18, No. 3: What is 'Bokeh') here: http://www.phototechmag.com/back_issues2.htm scroll down to the right issue. The cost for shipping outside of the USA at $10 (on top of the $5.00 cost of the back issue) is a bit much.

Harold Merklinger’s article, “A Technical View of Bokeh,” can be found for free here: http://www.darkroom.com/MiscDocs/bokeh.pdf . I didn’t find this article so useful as it tends to get too technical and hard to follow. The other two articles from the above issue of Photo Techniques are more interesting to me.

 

[Dan Fromm]

How have you done so nice pictures without knowing what Bokeh is ?

(snip)

George, have you lost your tiny hellenic mind? Discussions of bokeh are a form of oneupmanship. The sad part of it is that people who carry on lenses' bokeh haven't got to first principles yet.

Yeah, I know, the hokey bokey, that's what its all about. Might even be true, but I doubt it.

Cheers,

Dan

 

[Oren Grad]

I wish Oren Grad had decided to speak up more on the topic of bokeh, since his article is the most pertinent to this discussion.

I'm happy to try to help if you have specific questions.

 

[George Papantoniou]

You can purchase back issue of Photo Techniques on bokeh (May/June 1997/Vol. 18, No. 3: What is 'Bokeh') here: http://www.phototechmag.com/back_issues2.htm scroll down to the right issue. The cost for shipping outside of the USA at $10 (on top of the $5.00 cost of the back issue) is a bit much.

Harold Merklinger’s article, “A Technical View of Bokeh,” can be found for free here: http://www.darkroom.com/MiscDocs/bokeh.pdf . I didn’t find this article so useful as it tends to get too technical and hard to follow. The other two articles from the above issue of Photo Techniques are more interesting to me.

Thank you, senor Fernandez... I know about the back issue ordering, it's not really (financially) interesting...

The online article is great, I can imagine how good must be the other ones (since they are better)...

 

[George Papantoniou]

This name is correct with F! Most people ask this question ;-)

OK Folker, I'll jump in my Folksvagen and come to visit you in Vrankvurt am Main one of these days...

 

[mono]

OK Folker, I'll jump in my Folksvagen and come to visit you in Vrankvurt am Main one of these days...

;-)))

 

[Soeren]

Whatever you might think of Ken Rockwell his article on bokeh may be easier to read than others.
Sorry if the link has been posted before.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/bokeh.htm

I do understand why Folker take good pics without knowing about bokeh. There is a lot of debth of field in them. Great pics BTW (by the way)

Cheers, Søren

 

[mono]

Whatever you might think of Ken Rockwell his article on bokeh may be easier to read than others.
Sorry if the link has been posted before.

http://www.kenrockwell.com/tech/bokeh.htm

I do understand why Folker take good pics without knowing about bokeh. There is a lot of debth of field in them. Great pics BTW (by the way)

Cheers, Søren

Thank you Soeren!

But I think I am certainly not the subject of this thread ;-)

 

[kunihiko]

I think I've posted a similar comment somewhere before.

I thought it's here
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

 

[firecracker]

I thought it's here
(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

I'm repeating myself... I'm so bokeh!

 

[kunihiko]

I'm repeating myself... I'm so bokeh!

I too got GW head:rolleyes:

 

[firecracker]

I too got GW head:rolleyes:

GW? George ... Yeah, he's one big bokeh of our time!!

By the way, whoever named the "Golden Week" for the holidays in Japan probably suffered and died from the serious cause of bokeh.

 

[firecracker]

A quick Japanese lesson: Bokeh in Japanese also means being dumb and stupid.

 

[Soeren]

A quick Japanese lesson: Bokeh in Japanese also means being dumb and stupid.

Ahh
You guys got me bewildered for a moment there.
Cheers, Søren

 

[firecracker]

Ahh
You guys got me bewildered for a moment there.
Cheers, Søren

You can curse someone with that word. Check out some Japanese gangster and/or Yakuza movies, you will know what I mean.

 

[Soeren]

You can curse someone with that word. Check out some Japanese gangster and/or Yakuza movies, you will know what I mean.

:confused: What word ?
Cheers, Søren

 

[firecracker]

:confused: What word ?
Cheers, Søren

"bokeh"

 

[Soeren]

OH
DOOH

Cheers, Søren