Bleaching and Selenium toning

[Robk331]

Hi All,

I've seen a number of prints where people have bleached back a print then toned in selenium. I want to try this technique but have a couple of questions:

1. The bleach used is the standard one used for things like sepia toning?

2. Is the print refixed before toning in selenium or does it go straight into the toner after the wash?

Thanks

Rob

 

[fschifano]

You do realize that selenium toner will not act like a re-develop the halides rendered from the bleach as would the second bath of a bog standard sepia toning setup. So yes, if you want that bleached back look and you want to make it permanent, you will need to refix the print. The second run through the fixer will remove the halides created by the bleach. Essentially what you're doing is accomplishing in two steps, bleach and fix, what a Farmers Reducer does in one step. After a wash, you can then tone in selenium the remaining silver in the print.

It's an interesting concept, and one that I've never thought of trying. Might look good for a warm toned, high key type of thing.

 

[Robk331]

That's kind of what I thought (that selenium doesn't act as a re-developer).

Another variation of this is to tone in selenium and then bleach, which also gives an interesting effect.

 

[Ian Grant]

Some selenium toners can be used for Bleach and re-Development particularly Sulphide/Selenium toners. These wre sold commercial and were known as Flemish Toner.

Ian

 

[Jon Shiu]

I think I tried it one time and got some interesting greenish metallic bronzing tones. The emulsion got real soft and the color is not stable, changed in a few months time. Also, some black stuff precipitated out in the selenium toner.

Jon

 

[ronlamarsh]

Tone then bleach

That's kind of what I thought (that selenium doesn't act as a re-developer).

Another variation of this is to tone in selenium and then bleach, which also gives an interesting effect.

I have done this with Arista EDU ULtra fiber base paper developed in LPD 3:1 or 4:1. I first tone in selenium 20:1 for about 6 min then wash for 5 min then bleach in a weak bleach(1% or less) for about the count of ten. I turns from a neutral/semi-cold to a very warm brown. The actual tonal change is highly dependent upon devloper, developer dilution, amount of selenium toning and of course bleach strength and time. I have some that are a very chocolate brown to some that tend toward the pink(almost a lith effect if left in the bleach long enough). Tim Rudmann and Barry Thornton both describe this technique rather well. Haven't tried it with other papers though.

 

[dfoo]

When you say bleach, what do you mean chemically? Do you mean a reducers like farmer's? Or bleach like the stuff you wash your whities in.

 

[fschifano]

They're both chemical bleaches, but no, we're talking about some sort of ferricyanide bleach, like a farmer's reducer, not chlorine.

 

[Ian Grant]

Selenium toners that also contain thiosulphate (like KRST) can't be used as redevelopment toners, but the Selenium/Sulphite type work well.

Ian

 

[Robk331]

Are there any commercially available selenium toners without thiosulphate?

Rob

 

[PVia]

Try toning in selenium, then bleach and redevelop in a thiocarbamide toner, then tone in selenium again. You can get some beautiful tonal possibilities...