Berlebach equivalent of Ries J series

[John Kasaian]

I was wondering which model Berleba could be considered to be an alternative to a Reis J tripod? Thanks!

 

[Dan Fromm]

www.berlebach.de

 

[herb]

Berlebach equivalent

I have had a couple B'bachs, and neither were as heavy as Ries. I am selling the 9003 I special ordered from Germany, which was as heavy as I could get from them with a decent elevation. They work great on 4x5 and 5x7, but I did not like the rigidity with 8x10's weighing 12 lbs or more.

That said, a lot of 8x10 shooters use em and like em.

I got the ries j-100-2, which has special leg extensions to add more rigidity than the regular j-100.

 

[Mongo]

Sorry to hear that the 9003 didn't work out for you Herb. I have a Berlebach 4032 that I regularly use with a Calumet C1 at full extension, and the combination is solid as a rock. (This is with a heavy process lens on the front...I can't imagine anything else that would make this combination more challenging for a tripod.)

Best of luck with the Reis. They do make wonderful tools.

Be well.
Dave

 

[Alexz]

A side question from an LF novice: what exactly makes those wooden tripods stand out from regular heavy Bogen/Manfrotto or Gitzo tripods ? Years of shooting with heavy 35mm gear and few years experience with less then lightweight MF gear didn't neglect those I mentioned proving their usefulness in terms of stability and rigidity (albeit pain on my back - heavy beasts), so why one would strive for wooden tripods once shooting LF even though many of 4x5 LF aren't heavier then professional 35mm or MF landscape setup ?
Those Berbelach intended to support similar wieght don't seem to be more compact neither lighter then metal Bogen/Manfrotto...
Just out of curiosity...

 

[Mike A]

A side question from an LF novice: what exactly makes those wooden tripods stand out from regular heavy Bogen/Manfrotto or Gitzo tripods ? Years of shooting with heavy 35mm gear and few years experience with less then lightweight MF gear didn't neglect those I mentioned proving their usefulness in terms of stability and rigidity (albeit pain on my back - heavy beasts), so why one would strive for wooden tripods once shooting LF even though many of 4x5 LF aren't heavier then professional 35mm or MF landscape setup ?
Those Berbelach intended to support similar wieght don't seem to be more compact neither lighter then metal Bogen/Manfrotto...
Just out of curiosity...

John,
I use my Berlebech with my Phillips 11x14 and love it. I had a Darth Vader, Carbon fiber number for a while but ditched it to buy more film holders.

Alex,
Wood is supose to have a lower vibration transmition ratio than other materials currently available. This is a factor when stopping down to uh...lets say oh f90 with a 4min long exposer. The one I purchased was just as compact and a pound or two heavier than what hte other supports where at half the price or more, you do the math. I'm not a guy that gets hung up on the weight skimping issue so YMMV.
Mike

 

[Curt]

I bought a Berle some time back and was so impressed that I bought a second one. Its German made and really has a nice fit and finish. I live about 45 minutes from the Ries manufacturer and I must say that the price is the factor. When all of the film, paper, and chemicals are long gone they will continue to charge the high prices. It's a world wide economy and you have a lot to choose from. Do they make any wood tripods in Israel? It's something that many have made themselves in home workshops.

 

[Dan Fromm]

Alex, I recently replaced the Bogen 3021/Manfrotto 055 -- not the same design as current 3021s -- I bought in the '80s with a Berlebach 8023. The Bogen was fine with shorter lenses, but lacked torsional rigidity and this was a problem with long lenses. If I so much as breathed on it the point of aim moved.

Before I bought the Berlebach, I spent part of a Sunday afternoon in B&H trying out all of the tripods they had on display. Only one, an enormous carbon fiber Gitzo priced over $800, had the torsional rigidity I needed. The problem seems to be that multi-section legs flex a little at the joints between the legs, even when the leg locks are as tight as can be. I used to think this was a design problem, but after seeing a pair of quite new 3021s, one very stiff, the other quite limp, I've come to believe that it is may be an adjustment problem. Tightening my aged 3021's leg clamps as much as possible didn't solve its problem.

Along the way to the Berlebach, I looked at surveyor's tripods, even bought a big K&E wooden tripod for $10 at a yard sale and put a head on it. Big problem with them is controlling leg splay. The large Zone VI tripod is a converted surveyor's tripod, uses a nylon cord running through eye bolts to hold the legs together. It is wonderfully rigid, but gigantic and heavy. Anyway, my K&E monster has wooden legs, and it takes quite a while to stop "ringing" after being whacked lightly. So I take claims that wood damps vibrations better than, say, aluminum tubing with a little skepticism.

But to get to the point, the 8023 I bought after having an opportunity to play with it is much stiffer in torsion than my old 3021. And it supports my tandem camera -- two 2x3 Graphics, one in front of the other, with a coupler between them -- with 480/9 Apo Nikkor very well and the point of aim doesn't shift when I touch the tripod. I've used the 8023 once with my Questar 700. I was on a wooden structure that wouldn't sit still -- long story -- while shooting, so don't want to draw conclusions from those results.

I believe that Berlebach's design makes leg joints that give less. The mating surfaces are longer than in "tube in tube" designs.

Cheers,

Dan

 

[User Removed]

When I needed a new tripod, I looked at tons and tons of different Bogen, Gitzo and more metal tripods. Althought they were all nice, none of them had a large enought platform head to support my 8x10 camera. Also, they had all these "bells and whisles" with like, locking, spring loaded, adjustable, parts that were not needed. They just seemed cheep and like they would break easy.

I looked at the Bach tripods, but the tops of them were too small! It created a weak point right at the top, which I was afraid would flex.

I decided to go with a Ries Model A for my 8x10 and larger, and a Ries Model C for my 4x5 (but I have even used it for 8x10 a few times). The A has a 6" crown, and the C has a 4".

My Ries Tripods are seriously the easies to use and handle, very simple and rugged. I can seriously sit on top of the Model A, without the legs even flexing!

If you cannot afford a new Ries, check on Ebay because you can usually find one of the older models for only a few hundred bucks...and then refinish it and replace all the nuts and bolts, and it the tripod will be like brand new!

 

[Alexz]

Thank you guys.
Well, Curt, frankly, didn't get your point. What is the relation you drew between wooden tripods and my country ? Not very clear for me, sorry. In fact, would we do our own wooden tripods here from our wood - it would eat all the wood in our country. Natural wood is quite scarce in our environment (cannot say this about desert and rock though )
BTW, Dan, I also own Bogen 055 tripod. Heavy beast, so far didn't experienced special problems with its stability, however neither put one in particular demanding conditions except of shooting with quite heavy 35mm and MF gear mounted on it. The weak point was the head (I used to own regular 141RC 3D head which just wasn't up to the task supporting safely my EOS-3+booster+70-200/2.8 lens). Once I swapped this head by another one (482RC if I'm not wrong) - that made a world of difference.
I noticed my Shen-Hao setup isn't any heavier then my 35mm one I mentioned above, although the lenses are small and light (have Fujinon 150mm/5.6 NWS and an upcoming Caltar II-N 90mm/6.8).
Frankly, all these wooden tripods looks a bit delicate to me for lugging them around in rough conditions and through flights (I usually check the tripod in inside of my check-in luggage), however this may be just an illusion...

 

[Changeling1]

Ries vs Berlebach

I was wondering which model Berleba could be considered to be an alternative to a Reis J tripod? Thanks!

I have both- The Ries is far sturdier and heavier than the Berlebach 2042 Report that its maker rates at 26 pounds. Personally, I would only recommend using a MF or 35 mm on the report OR be very careful and keep a close eye on things. Another viable option is to pick up a used Zone VI tripod- very similar in strength, looks, and durability as the Ries.

When is a tripod, head, and case worth $1100 new? When it's a Ries!*

* I purchased my Ries set-up used for less than half that.

 

[Curt]

Well Alexz, frankly, I can see why you didn't get the point. I have considered YOUR Country to have high standards of manufacture and the products from there demonstrate that. We, here in the United States of America, who supports YOUR country, don't always have the raw resources but obtain them from the WORLD community and make some of the highest quality products; period.

Pardon me for asking if wood tripods are made in your country.

By the way, I put my Berlebach in my check in luggage and have not had a scratch on it.

 

[John Kasaian]

Alexz,

I've used tripods made out of all kinds of materials. I primarily shoot 8x10 these days and I prefer a wood tripod, though metal ones will certainly work as well. Wood IMHO is better in areas where you'll likely encounter grit, such as on the beach and streamside. Grit and corrosion will sieze up a metal tripod with telescoping legs IMHO, Its not a quesion of 'if' but of 'when.' In a studio, or working out of the trunk of an automobile, I suppose it dosen't make much difference (except wood looks cooler under an old wood camera!) As far a weight goes, there might be a sllight advantage to wood, but only slight. For compactness metal usually has the advantage. Also in favor of wood, well you can repair a wood tripod. Bent metal is more involved.

As soon as my rotor cuff heals, I'm going to take my 8x10 skiing and I'm simply exploring possibilites. A metal tripod that collapses to, say 2-1/2 - 3' that wieghs less than a Ries would certainly work. I've heard that a Ries J model can suppport an 8x10 and I was curious if Berlebach had something equivalent in order to compare what options are available.

Curt

I certainly didn't intent to start an internatioinal incident---theres way too many of those as it is!

Thank you all for your help & info!

Cheers!

 

[Mongo]

John-

As I mentioned earlier in the thread, take a look at the Berlebach x032 series. My Berlebach 4032 supports a Calumet C1 with a Nikkor 480mm f/9 lens, a Packard shutter, and a Graflex wooden film holder, all coming to a total weight of about 22 pounds. And it's not a case of the tripod just holding the camera...I can lean on this combination and it doesn't go anywhere. I've used mine...in windy conditions with the bellows all of the way out, in streams, on slopes, and in many other unfriendly conditions, and it just plain works. No leg flex, no instability, no problems with the crown...it works. Reis definately makes nice tripods, but the Berlebachs are a great alternative for a lot less money.

Be well.
Dave