Bellini / Ars-Imago Color Reversal E6 processing kit in Jobo?

[pkr1979]

Hi all!

I have used the Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit a lot with a Jobo, but I now just got the Ars-Imago Color Reversal E6 processing kit, and I have a few questions.

1. I assumed that the Ars-Imago kit and the Bellini kit was the same kit, but when i read the developing instructions in the sheet that came with the Ars-Imago kit (https://www.ars-imago.com/web/conte...314eefe907a141e20f65b2317351964&download=true) the first developer times are 30 seconds longer then the Bellini kit (https://www.fotoimpex.com/shop/images/products/media/69426_5_PDF-Datasheet.pdf). Everything else seems to be the same. Is it the same kit? If so, why are the times different?

2. As I also intend to develop 8x10" sheet film I intend to develop the film using a Jobo. Is this kit suitable for use with a Jobo?

3. The times given are for manual developing. If the kit is suitable for a Jobo can anyone provide times for use with Jobo? The film I am developing is Kodak Ektachrome E100.

4. As far as I understand the instructions washing is not required between reversal, color developer, pre bleach, bleach and fixer. Can anyone confirm this as well? If this is the case I assume I can still reuse the chemicals? So that I am able to develop 5 films one day, store the used chemicals and use them the next day (or the week after) to develop 5 more films?

Cheers
Peter

 

[ChrisGalway]

Hi all!

I have used the Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit a lot with a Jobo, but I now just got the Ars-Imago Color Reversal E6 processing kit, and I have a few questions.

........

4. As far as I understand the instructions washing is not required between reversal, color developer, pre bleach, bleach and fixer. Can anyone confirm this as well? If this is the case I assume I can still reuse the chemicals? So that I am able to develop 5 films one day, store the used chemicals and use them the next day (or the week after) to develop 5 more films?

Cheers
Peter

Peter, I can confirm that there are NO washes between the baths you list ... I asked Bellini about this, and they explained that in most cases a trace of the previous bath helps trigger the next bath ... so you should NOT have a wash bath between the steps you mention. The only exception in between the bleach and fixer baths, some people give a short wash to "preserve" the fixer, but again Bellini told me that this wash is not required and the brown colouration of the fixer that accumulates (from the bleach) does not matter.

And yes, you can re-use the chemicals as per the instructions. I usually process 5 x 120 in 500ml sequentially in a Paterson tank. (I'd love to have a Jobo but I can't really justify the cost!)

Hope this helps.

 

[ChrisGalway]

Hi all!

I have used the Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit a lot with a Jobo, but I now just got the Ars-Imago Color Reversal E6 processing kit, and I have a few questions.

1. I assumed that the Ars-Imago kit and the Bellini kit was the same kit, but when i read the developing instructions in the sheet that came with the Ars-Imago kit (https://www.ars-imago.com/web/conte...314eefe907a141e20f65b2317351964&download=true) the first developer times are 30 seconds longer then the Bellini kit (https://www.fotoimpex.com/shop/images/products/media/69426_5_PDF-Datasheet.pdf). Everything else seems to be the same. Is it the same kit? If so, why are the times different?

......

Cheers
Peter

I have found you need to experiment with the 1st Dev time in E6. For example, in a Paterson tank, I give Provia 100f 7min30sec (instead of the guide time of 6min15sec) for the first film in fresh solution. So my advice is follow the instructions you have for the first film, and adjust the time appropriately for subsequent films. I've processed around 125 Provia 100f films in the past five years, and it all comes instinctively after the first few films. By the way, I add around 2mins to push by one stop.

 

[pkr1979]

Thanks @ChrisGalway - this is indeed helpful and much appreciated

 

[pkr1979]

One more think @ChrisGalway - in your experience, what is shelf life for working solution in capped filled up bottles?

 

[ChrisGalway]

I asked Bellini about solution lifetimes a couple of years ago and their response was:

• Stock solution (concentrate) in original bottle opened once and capped, with air squeezed out of bottle: 5 weeks.
• Working solution (mixed for use): 7 days.
• Unopened bottle of stock solution (concentrate): 1-1.5 years after purchase.

Note they do not list the lifetimes of the individual baths, so I suspect those numbers are dictated by the least stable one. I think I've kept half-filled stock solutions, using Protectan/butane gas, for more than the 5 weeks. These times are shorter than the lifetimes stated for the Adox 3/4 bath kit.

By the way, the Bellini boxes (I do not know if the Ars Imago branded are identical) have a manufacturing date batch code. As an example, the unopened box I have here has the batch code 24339, meaning it was made (packaged?) on the 339th day of 2024 (4 December 2024). I plan to use it in August /September.

Another point: I asked Bellini about the "dry preheat" (because for most kits, like Adox, it's a wet preheat) and they responded that the proper E6 process states a dry preheat. I use a 2 kg weight on the tank to hold it down in the water bath!

Bellini have a contact form on their website and I have found they are very responsive. If the front-office staff cannot answer you, they get a technical person to help.

 

[pkr1979]

I asked Bellini about solution lifetimes a couple of years ago and their response was:

• Stock solution (concentrate) in original bottle opened once and capped, with air squeezed out of bottle: 5 weeks.
• Working solution (mixed for use): 7 days.
• Unopened bottle of stock solution (concentrate): 1-1.5 years after purchase.

Note they do not list the lifetimes of the individual baths, so I suspect those numbers are dictated by the least stable one. I think I've kept half-filled stock solutions, using Protectan/butane gas, for more than the 5 weeks. These times are shorter than the lifetimes stated for the Adox 3/4 bath kit.

By the way, the Bellini boxes (I do not know if the Ars Imago branded are identical) have a manufacturing date batch code. As an example, the unopened box I have here has the batch code 24339, meaning it was made (packaged?) on the 339th day of 2024 (4 December 2024). I plan to use it in August /September.

Another point: I asked Bellini about the "dry preheat" (because for most kits, like Adox, it's a wet preheat) and they responded that the proper E6 process states a dry preheat. I use a 2 kg weight on the tank to hold it down in the water bath!

Bellini have a contact form on their website and I have found they are very responsive. If the front-office staff cannot answer you, they get a technical person to help.

Thanks a lot for this! Much appreciated

 

[halfaman]

There is no need to wash between reversal and CD, you absolutely DON'T wash between prebleach and bleach. But you need to wash between bleach and fix if you want to reuse the latter, for one-shot usage you can skip also the wash.

 

[Samu]

Hi all!

I have used the Tetenal 3-bath E6 kit a lot with a Jobo, but I now just got the Ars-Imago Color Reversal E6 processing kit, and I have a few questions.

1. I assumed that the Ars-Imago kit and the Bellini kit was the same kit, but when i read the developing instructions in the sheet that came with the Ars-Imago kit (https://www.ars-imago.com/web/conte...314eefe907a141e20f65b2317351964&download=true) the first developer times are 30 seconds longer then the Bellini kit (https://www.fotoimpex.com/shop/images/products/media/69426_5_PDF-Datasheet.pdf). Everything else seems to be the same. Is it the same kit? If so, why are the times different?

2. As I also intend to develop 8x10" sheet film I intend to develop the film using a Jobo. Is this kit suitable for use with a Jobo?

3. The times given are for manual developing. If the kit is suitable for a Jobo can anyone provide times for use with Jobo? The film I am developing is Kodak Ektachrome E100.

4. As far as I understand the instructions washing is not required between reversal, color developer, pre bleach, bleach and fixer. Can anyone confirm this as well? If this is the case I assume I can still reuse the chemicals? So that I am able to develop 5 films one day, store the used chemicals and use them the next day (or the week after) to develop 5 more films?

Cheers
Peter

1. FD time in E6 is dependent on many factors, one of them being the agitation. Nominal time for unused (or replenished) developer is :6:00, but the instructions, such as Fuji TB also state, it must be adjusted for each lab according to results. I personally use 6:30 time for fresh developer.

2. Yes. Bellini kit is their professional chemistry packed in a smaller kit with starters already added. It works for all film sizes.

3. Yes/ it is suitable for rotary developing, such as JOBO.

4. Washing between REV and CD is not only not required, but MUST NOT be done, as reversal happens only when the film immersed in reversal bath hits the alkaline color developer. Also, no wash should be added between pre-bleach and bleach, as this step is also based on carryover. If desired, wash can be added between bleach and fixer. if desired. It is by no means mandatory though. Prewashing does not ruin the film, alhough Bellini instructions adbice against it/ I normally preheat E6 by a prewash.

For s good overview about the E6 process. look at Fuji TB document about Pro6 chemistry. As Bellini kitt is a standard E6 chemistry, most of the information there applies also for this kit/

 

[ChrisGalway]

Here is the link to that Fuji Technical Bulletin:

https://asset.fujifilm.com/www/nl/files/2021-05/3b66e59738c725cc366e4d03f9320329/TB_E6_E01_10-20.pdf

 

[pkr1979]

Thanks for this guys - got excellent results

 

[ChrisGalway]

Thanks for this guys - got excellent results

That's great, there is nothing more satisfying than removing the film off the spiral at the end and seeing those beautiful jewels ... colour transparencies! (Negatives are ... well ... negative!)