Backup systems - correct dating of image and scan files

Alan Edward Klein

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I'm using My Passport from Western Digita on my Windows 10 system. But the backup program only saves with the backup date. So every file has the same date, the date the original date of saving in the desktop computer. The original dates of the files are gone on the backup drive. So if you have a number of images or scans where edits were done, you want to be able to see the creation or original filing date for each one to determine which is the latest. Now, they're all dated the same backup date.

Is that a mistake on my part? Am I just missing how to show them? Do other backup devices and software also show the original dates only or are there any that keep the original dates??
 

BrianShaw

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How are you moving your files between devices? If copying, I think you'll always lose the original file date. If cut-and-paste... I'm not sure. You might want to ask at the Western Digital site about their proprietary backup software.

With Windows 8 I used Microsoft's free utility, SychToy, to back up to an external WD hard drive and the original file dates were preserved. Loved that because it was quick and effective. Apparently that is not possible with Win10 so I'm now using cloud backup via Norton, which seems to preserve the original fie dates. But the initial backup takes days; the incremental backups are quick but sometimes it seems to omit some files unless specifically marked to include in the backup. I'm not 100% happy with this backup solution.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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If I do a straight backup .et's say from the hard disk in the desktop to a memory card or DVD, all the original dates are preserved. It's just when you operate the backup program from Western Digital that makes the backup eternal drive that it stores only the backup date on all files. Somebody's got to have a better way other than the cloud?
 

BrianShaw

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I totally agree. I'm searching for that too. Haven't made a dedicated search, however.

Have you explored this option? I have not yet, but it looks like a potential solution.


https://support.microsoft.com/en-us...3-ed18-52ef2b88cbef#WindowsVersion=Windows_10

Since I don't keep my external drive connected, I'm seeking an option where I can command it to backup whenever I remember to do a backup. This might be it but haven't tried it yet. I'm doubting that it does incremental backups. Any guesses?
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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I didn;t see an Windows explanation of what happens on the second backup. Does it overwrite the first? Or does it save a second file of only those files that have changed? The latter is how backup programs usually work. Also, you want to have an automatic schedule for backup, let's say daily or weekly.. IF you do it only once a month, then all the data for the last month could be lost if your main computer burns up before the next backup.

I was just thinking how bad Western Digital backup can be. Although I never had a need to restore lost files on my desktop, what happens if you do? Let;s say you have 10 Lightroom libraries backed up which LR does each time when you close it. If creation dates are no longer there, how do you know which of the ten files to select for LR?
 

BrianShaw

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You are right about backup frequency. When I worked, I backed up at noon and at the end of the day... religiously. It saved my skin several times when there were hardware or system problems. In retirement, I don't make so much important files that anything more than weekly (and maybe even monthly) backup is really useful. Although... I may be kidding myself because I run a Norton backup to cloud almost every time I shut the computer off.

I'm guessing from what I've read in other resources about restoring using the Win10 capability, that it saves every new version of files. I'm assuming that teach version has the honest creation date. Although there may be some duplication, I suppose, when file names are changed or updated, as I sometimes do to correct filename typos or to "improve" the chance of finding them when keyword searching.

I have no knowledge of how the Lightroom libraries work in terms of dates of either the library or the individual image files. Wish I could help you there but can't.

My use of the backup I was keeping on external WD drive was rarely needed for file recovery, and was extremely useful when moving into a new computer. It made the process of moving in very convenient.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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The thing with backups is that it's the most recent stuff often that you suffer from if it gets lost. You spend all day drafting a letter or editing a video, The computer goes down and you lost all of it. If your saving monthly, then you just lost the entire last month of work. Yikes!.

Some software backup systems backup as you just created or changed as you go along. Then there's how many old files you want to save. So let's say you can set it for three revisions. The backup software saves for three times then on the fourth, the first gets dropped off. That way, should you need an earlier file before the latest changes, it's accessible. A neat feature.

I'm trying the Windows one to see what happens. Having trouble setting it up. Will get back.
 

BrianShaw

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Alan Edward Klein said:
Will Windows delete files on the backup drive if they were deleted on the computer such as if you wanted to make room on the computer?
Click to expand...
That is a great question. I would hope so. The old SyncToy software, I used in "echo" mode and not "synchronize", would do that when it did it's incremental backups.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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I gave up on the Widnows backup. First off it lists every folder that you have. You then have to delete each folder one at a time that you don't want backed up which takes too long as it resets and starts over listing them against each time. If you don;t want an entire folder, than you have to go to the Exclude folder section and click on every folder you don't want back up. This is all too complicated and inconvenient. Maybe OK if you want to back up your entire computer.
 

BrianShaw

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Sigh... that seems like a common problem setting up an initial backup capability. In my case, I keep all of my data files on a separate drive so I want all of that drive and only a few parts of the system files. I suppose I'll have to delete a tone of system files that I don't want to back up... or delete them all and the add in the few I want.
 

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Are you sure that the date assigned to the backup file is the same as the date on the data that you will end up with when you restore the data.
My backup software assigns the date of the backup folder/file it creates to that folder/file, but if I go into that folder/file and restore something within it from the backup to the original (or other) location, the restored data has the original characteristics - including date and time - of the data that was backed up.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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Do all the files inside the backup folder have the original date or the backup date? If it replaces the original date to the restored files, that would be good. But my software (WD Backup) only shows backup date in the backup drive on all files. I'll have to try Restore mode to see what happens.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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The other problem I have is that each time I save, about 10GB of additional data gets saved. Where is it coming from? I'm saving all folders and files under Users>Alan (see attached), plus the D drive which contains only data files like photos. There must be something in "Alan" that keeps changing and updating in the background. Any ideas?
 

Billy Axeman

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BrianShaw said:
... With Windows 8 I used Microsoft's free utility, SychToy, to back up to an external WD hard drive and the original file dates were preserved. Loved that because it was quick and effective. Apparently that is not possible with Win10 ....
Click to expand...

I'm still using SyncToy on my Win 10 PC, works perfectly. The download from Microsoft is discontinued in January 2021 though. Search 'SyncToy 2.1' and you can download it from alternative sites.
 

MattKing

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Alan Edward Klein said:
The other problem I have is that each time I save, about 10GB of additional data gets saved. Where is it coming from?
Click to expand...
Sounds like each time you are backing up files you are including your previous backups themselves!
How big is each backup?
 

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My PC Wallpaper
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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OK I tried a couple of tests with Western Digital Backup that comes with their external disks used for backup (My Passport). LAter revised files in the desktop computer overwrite (or seem to) the earlier files that were backed-up. If you delete a file subsequently on your desktop, the backup disk keeps the file on subsequent backups. It doesn't;t delete them. That's good. I was able to restore the file from the back-up disk to the desktop. It restores the original file date not the backup date. (all the files that were added in the backup show the last date of the backup. Files not changed show earlier backup dates. It;s all very confusing)
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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MattKing said:
Sounds like each time you are backing up files you are including your previous backups themselves!
How big is each backup?
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No, I don;t think so. It;s only between 8-10gb. The entire backup is around 736GB. There must be some programs that update all the time. So each time you save, it's adding to the backup file. I think also, the back up program may be saving all previous backups. It's not just replacing the earlier file but adding a new separate file. When you go to restore, they give a list of previous backups to select from. That tells me that you can select a previous file to backup not just the last one although there' 's no way I can tell which file is which. So what may be happening is that one program that always updates, keeps saving and there 8gb or so each time. I think I figure out how to find it. I have to look at the backup and see which files have the latest date.
 

BrianShaw

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Billy Axeman said:
I'm still using SyncToy on my Win 10 PC, works perfectly. The download from Microsoft is discontinued in January 2021 though. Search 'SyncToy 2.1' and you can download it from alternative sites.
Click to expand...
Well that’s interesting. I’d much rather do that than other options. Thanks for mentioning this!
 

BrianShaw

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Alan, make sure that you not backing up GoogleDrive and OneDrive. That could be some of the excess baggage.
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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BrianShaw said:
Alan, make sure that you not backing up GoogleDrive and OneDrive. That could be some of the excess baggage.
Click to expand...
Do you know where to find them?

I did find 1.294gb. Outlook is savings. So if there is one email, the whole folder is updated and saved. BUt that only would add if it doesn't;t replace the earlier one. I;m not sure that;s happening. I'm still looking.
 

BrianShaw

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In post #14, I see them in second and fifth columns. Also dropbox could have stuff you don't really want to backup
 
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Alan Edward Klein

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BrianShaw said:
In post #14, I see them in second and fifth columns. Also dropbox could have stuff you don't really want to backup
Click to expand...
The both have very little data and haven;t been updated in years. I could just live with the extra 10gb every save which would give me around 300 saves if no more data added. Then I could start over and re-write all saves. But then I could be missing something I deleted that I would need to make space on the computer. I think what I mgih try is start with just my personal files and add a few foilder until I notice something is not working right. What do other people do? DO they have all this extra data that gets backed up each time that;s just wasting space?
 

BrianShaw

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No matter what backup system I've used, I only back up the following in an attempt to only store what's important without excess baggage:

Favorites
Music
Pictures
Contacts
Desktop
Documents

That seems to have always done the trick. In Win10, however, I can't yet figure out where the Chrome bookmarks and Reading list are; they are not in Favorites, it seems. So I'm not sure those are really backed up... and those are very important to me. When I moved from old computer to this one, I think I lost all of my favorites in the process of going from IE to Chrome via Edge.

In the past I did that twice since I was running separate accounts for me and my wife, but she did me a favor and bought a Mac notebook. Since I seem to have forgotten everything I ever knew about Macs, she is on her own. But so am I.
 
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