B&H not shipping chemicals anymore?

[hacked - sepiareverb]

Just for kicks, I put 20 each of Xtol, Dektol and Fixer in the basket at both Unique and Freestyle to see what shipping would be. Freestyle was $40 to my address buried in the mountains and Unique was $74.

Just did 6L of liquids like my Freestyle order this evening. $15 shipping to Vermont from California for Freestyle, $14.25 from NJ for Unique. But they don't have the variety of Freestyle. No R09, No Moersch, not even Microphen.

 

[Kirks518]

If it is a shipping issue, I would be interested to know what new regulation went into effect today that was not in effect yesterday, if any. Then I would know whether to stomp my feet at B&H or the regulators. Somehow these chemicals are being shipped from the factory to B&H and other retailers, including the few remaining brick and mortar retailers across this great land of ours.

I doubt there were any new regulations that went into effect. My guess is based on (there was a url link here which no longer exists).

There is a good chance that there may have only been 1 or 2 certified employees that could sign the necessary paperwork, and maybe he/she/they quit, got fired, promoted, or whatever. B+H also may have realized that if one of the certified employees was out sick, there is a chance that things wouldn't get shipped.

Remember, it costs a company money to have an employee specially certified in anything. If you're that employee, you would want to be paid more for your certification, and rightfully so.

I think they (B+H/Adorama) felt it was easier and less costly to completely abolish shipping of all chemicals and anything that can fall under the IATA rules or within the CFR-49 regulations that could end up costing them thousands in fines if handled incorrectly.

Why so many of the posters in this thread feel that this is a slap in the face to analog customers is beyond me. It was a simple business decision, but I'll bet it wasn't an easy one to make for either company.

 

[Taylor.Nicholas]

Our photo dept. uses them too and will continue to for things that we can still get, business is business and within our teaching programs, we strive to mentor our students in a way that teaches them to be pragmatic and business like when it comes to happenings like these and then when to let emotions free in order to steer their visual voice.

I see a lot of the usual tantrums being thrown here and just like any other woe is me centric topic, some heady speculation. It is what it is folks, it's business and unless it is a mom & pop operation with an utterly transparent presence on a site like this, we are simply not privy to all the nuances of why things go down the way they do.

I'll continue to use B&H for what I use them for and find other suppliers for what are super niche products in a competitive world of retail / wholesale / online order fulfillment.

But the last thing I am going to do is take this personally.

I suppose that's all well and good, but when such a large supplier of materials you use every day suddenly, without warning drops support, it's really impolite and unnerving. That's on top of any local options being reduced to almost nothing; I'm lucky if our local store even carries D-76. They grumble and groan and don't really care for analog business though they say they support the local art school...which is all analog. So there are deeper issues than it seems, and one thing after another just hurts. It's one thing when there are many, many options, but truthfully there are too few for me to be comfortable with their change. Yes, the analog photography market is shrinking, but this isn't a manufacturer dropping out, it's our access to those supplies which is being reduced and without warning.

 

[hacked - sepiareverb]

at our school we have been using sprint chemistry for over thirty years. I like it very much for the following reasons: it works well, it is cheaper than either Kodak or ilford, however, I do not know the shipping cost for smaller quantities, it's all liquid and very easy to mix. they are also a great company to deal with. I only wish they still made color chemistry but that has been long gone. sprintsystems.com they are located in rhode island.

I've ordered my Fixer directly from Sprint for years. I have one un-opened cube in stock, just started another one two weeks ago. They have always shipped to me by UPS IIRC.

 

[hacked - sepiareverb]

Why so many of the posters in this thread feel that this is a slap in the face to analog customers is beyond me. It was a simple business decision, but I'll bet it wasn't an easy one to make for either company.

Not feeling slapped, worried that I will not be able to keep supplies in stock with any reliability. This is what happened to me with C-printing seven or eight years ago. I now shoot an M9 for color.

 

[Ai Print]

Foot stomping? I don't think so. This is one of the top two players in the market completely dropping out, without warning. There is surprise and worry that our other suppliers will follow suit. Moving from twenty years of having anything at my door in two days to a week or ten day plus delivery time is a change I will need to keep on top of for a while. Especially since I can't get anything photographic locally. Seriously, not even a roll of 35mm color print film.

I get that, really I do, especially considering the closest film from me is a 3.5 hour drive away. But there is no way that they would just kick customers to the proverbial curb when they add up to income unless there were forces at work that we are simply not privy to....and like it or not...we are not privy to that info.

B&H is huge and they have never been known to make announcements of any kind regarding things like inventory, price changes or any of that in the 30 years I have been dealing with them.

You never know, they may actually be trying to rectify this as we speak...but it is business and none of that is any of our business.

 

[Taylor.Nicholas]

I get that, really I do, especially considering the closest film from me is a 3.5 hour drive away. But there is no way that they would just kick customers to the proverbial curb when they add up to income unless there were forces at work that we are simply not privy to....and like it or not...we are not privy to that info.

B&H is huge and they have never been known to make announcements of any kind regarding things like inventory, price changes or any of that in the 30 years I have been dealing with them.

You never know, they may actually be trying to rectify this as we speak...but it is business and none of that is any of our business.

I see that makes sense. I guess that with the analog photography world being fragile, a simple business move is all it takes to cause an earthquake of terror.

 

[MattKing]

I see that makes sense. I guess that with the analog photography world being fragile, a simple business move is all it takes to cause an earthquake of terror.

AI Print isn't going to like this response
More generally though, the real problem is that sources like B & H effectively drove almost all the local sources out of the business, and in many cases actually out of business entirely.
And now, they stop supplying the market that remains.

 

[Ai Print]

AI Print isn't going to like this response
More generally though, the real problem is that sources like B & H effectively drove almost all the local sources out of the business, and in many cases actually out of business entirely.
And now, they stop supplying the market that remains.

LOL, I'm easy, and yeah, once online ordering became all the rage, B&H had the biggest chops to make hay of that sunshine....and there was carnage.

Freestyle will see more biz because of this and we will pay more. That is what happens when you get spoiled by the giant with free shipping.

 

[MattKing]

That first part of my post (ending in "inven") was edited out, but somehow made its way back in. If you could take it out of your quote Dan, I'd appreciate it.

 

[brofkand]

More generally though, the real problem is that sources like B & H effectively drove almost all the local sources out of the business, and in many cases actually out of business entirely.
And now, they stop supplying the market that remains.

This is the whole kit and caboodle I think. How many local shops closed up over the past 2 decades, not solely because of B&H but certainly B&H played a large part in their demise. Who knows when B&H decides that there's more money in Apple watches, Yamaha guitars, and flat-screen TVs and stops selling cameras. It sounds crazy, but I'm sure people didn't think 10 years ago that B&H would stop selling D-76 before Kodak did!

I have gone through a season of sourcing USA-made goods in my life recently where possible, and shopping small businesses, so I think I'll use this opportunity to shift my buying power, small as it may be, to suppliers who support our chosen medium: Freestyle and/or Ultrafine, both of who have been APUG sponsors for many years now.

 

[mshchem]

Just for kicks, I put 20 each of Xtol, Dektol and Fixer in the basket at both Unique and Freestyle to see what shipping would be. Freestyle was $40 to my address buried in the mountains and Unique was $74.

Don't doubt it Colorado is a lot closer to California than New Jersey . Call up Freestyle and ask them for C-41 chemistry with separate bleach and fixer . This could be a great thing . B&H is like Walmart they can bankrupt suppliers . Maybe what comes out of this is we pay a little more and have more real options?
I buy from Freestyle , Unique , B&H, and my local guys . All the stuff B&H has listed for chemistry can't be supported by walk in business . I think they are just exiting the chemistry part of the business . Especially this time of year they want to focus on high margin, high dollar technology sales
Best Regards Mike

 

[MattKing]

Especially this time of year they want to focus on high margin, high dollar technology sales

Which certainly doesn't include much to do with still photography - due to the "high margin" criteria.

 

[mshchem]

Which certainly doesn't include much to do with still photography - due to the "high margin" criteria.

Agreed they can go jump in a lake full of LED TV's
Best Regards Mike

 

[Ozxplorer]

Well, we've given B&H enough of a free marketing & sales promotional leg up for the day... Time now to maybe quiz Harman about how this move by a dominant retailer of their product range is likely/might impact the future national distribution plus availability of their product range going forward. After all, the Ilford brand is well considered... And, I suspect the major supplier of photographic product internationally. A recent forum dealt with the issue of Ilford pricing in Japan. Is this beginning of a trend designed to disrupt film photography supply chain? Or, maybe it is time for Harman to widen the scope and reach of their UK based online store - Harman Express and sell direct into worldwide markets? Who knows... I'm easy... I will support whomever is prepared to support me with a good range, pricing and availability of wanted product. Fred

 

[mshchem]

Well, we've given B&H enough of a free marketing & sales promotional leg up for the day... Time now to maybe quiz Harman about how this move by a dominant retailer of their product range is likely/might impact the future national distribution plus availability of their product range going forward. After all, the Ilford brand is well considered... And, I suspect the major supplier of photographic product internationally. A recent forum dealt with the issue of Ilford pricing in Japan. Is this beginning of a trend designed to disrupt film photography supply chain? Or, maybe it is time for Harman to widen the scope and reach of their UK based online store - Harman Express and sell direct into worldwide markets? Who knows... I'm easy... I will support whomever is prepared to support me with a good range, pricing and availability of wanted product. Fred

Darn good question , you can bet that B&H will still sell film . The big question is can Ilford and Alaris and others figure out a business model where a retailer must sell the entire line ? I remember when Kodak protected their dealer networks , studios couldn't buy direct from Kodak (in the US ) then along came Fuji and that all changed .
This may be a good thing , it's anyone's guess . Best Mike

 

[Helinophoto]

Possibly the expectation is that this decision will drive "foot traffic" into the store?

I don't think so, I think 80% of their business comes from the Internet.
Don't forget that B&H also is a mainstay for photographic supplies to EU and many Asian countries.
Also, remember that the EU-area has 500 - 740 million people (depending on how you count), that's up to twice the US population

We can't all show up in NY

I suppose fotoimpex and macodirect, as well as the uk sites will get business from me in the future then.
- For analog, it's been a 70/30 in favor of the European and UK sites anyway, usually a better selection there.

 

[Wallendo]

FREE SHIPPING, chemicals are heavy low priced and a pain to deal with. IF B&H would charge for shipping chemicals then they would be Freestyle. They don't want to fiddle with it. I would be amazed if all of darkroom together amounts to more than 1% of their business.

Best Mike

I suspect that that is the real issue. Film chemistry is such a very small part of their sales that it is not profitable to meet the regulatory requirements to ship hazardous materials.

As I primarily use HC-110 and Rodinal, I already order most of my chemistries from Freestyle.

I am somewhat saddened by the recent changes, but there are still other leaner companies who will still find shipping chemistry profitable. Sales may be down, but there is still enough demand for photo chemistry to allow Freestyle and Photographers Formulary to sell their own house brands.

 

[PatTrent]

I suggest that APUGers give their money to the folks who sponsor the forum and have made commitments to our chosen medium - Ultrafine, Freestyle, and of course ILFORD.

Absolutely. Yes.

 

[paul ron]

wasnt there a B&H member on APUG? im surprised he hasnt chimed in yet.

it would be nice to get the facts from the source?

.

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

wasnt there a B&H member on APUG? im surprised he hasnt chimed in yet.

it would be nice to get the facts from the source?

.

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

 

[Born2Late]

Does anyone know the name of the Top Dog at B&H? I would like to return the last catalog that they sent me with a nice note explaining why they won't need to send any more.

 

[Sal Santamaura]

Does anyone know the name of the Top Dog at B&H?...

The post just above yours

(there was a url link here which no longer exists)

identifies APUG user henryp, who is Henry Posner. I've emailed Henry, the B&H Director of Corporate Communications, for many years, always finding him to be forthright and helpful.

If you're interested in going all the way to the top, you need to reach Blimie and/or Herman:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B&H_Photo_Video​

I've no idea what means of communication would be effective to accomplish that.

 

[Leigh B]

If you're interested in going all the way to the top, you need to reach Blimie and/or Herman:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/B&H_Photo_Video​

I've no idea what means of communication would be effective to accomplish that.

Certified Mail with Restricted Delivery will get it to the secretary.

- Leigh

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Well, that's a shame. I was about to place a large order of christmas stuff for shipping to Canada in the next while and was planning to tack on more chemistry as well. I liked ordering from B&H because they went the extra mile to reliably cover the import correctly rather than me having to deal with surprise fees. I liked that the company put the extra bit of effort into making my life easier.

However if they're going to stand by this change and not make an attempt to continue to make my life easier, then I'll take all of my photo related business elsewhere.

IMO, it is shame to be Canadian resident and not to buy chemicals from argentix.ca. They do have chemicals which I can't buy locally.