Just did 6L of liquids like my Freestyle order this evening. $15 shipping to Vermont from California for Freestyle, $14.25 from NJ for Unique. But they don't have the variety of Freestyle. No R09, No Moersch, not even Microphen.
Just for kicks, I put 20 each of Xtol, Dektol and Fixer in the basket at both Unique and Freestyle to see what shipping would be. Freestyle was $40 to my address buried in the mountains and Unique was $74.
If it is a shipping issue, I would be interested to know what new regulation went into effect today that was not in effect yesterday, if any. Then I would know whether to stomp my feet at B&H or the regulators. Somehow these chemicals are being shipped from the factory to B&H and other retailers, including the few remaining brick and mortar retailers across this great land of ours.
I suppose that's all well and good, but when such a large supplier of materials you use every day suddenly, without warning drops support, it's really impolite and unnerving. That's on top of any local options being reduced to almost nothing; I'm lucky if our local store even carries D-76. They grumble and groan and don't really care for analog business though they say they support the local art school...which is all analog. So there are deeper issues than it seems, and one thing after another just hurts. It's one thing when there are many, many options, but truthfully there are too few for me to be comfortable with their change. Yes, the analog photography market is shrinking, but this isn't a manufacturer dropping out, it's our access to those supplies which is being reduced and without warning.Our photo dept. uses them too and will continue to for things that we can still get, business is business and within our teaching programs, we strive to mentor our students in a way that teaches them to be pragmatic and business like when it comes to happenings like these and then when to let emotions free in order to steer their visual voice.
I see a lot of the usual tantrums being thrown here and just like any other woe is me centric topic, some heady speculation. It is what it is folks, it's business and unless it is a mom & pop operation with an utterly transparent presence on a site like this, we are simply not privy to all the nuances of why things go down the way they do.
I'll continue to use B&H for what I use them for and find other suppliers for what are super niche products in a competitive world of retail / wholesale / online order fulfillment.
But the last thing I am going to do is take this personally.
at our school we have been using sprint chemistry for over thirty years. I like it very much for the following reasons: it works well, it is cheaper than either Kodak or ilford, however, I do not know the shipping cost for smaller quantities, it's all liquid and very easy to mix. they are also a great company to deal with. I only wish they still made color chemistry but that has been long gone. sprintsystems.com they are located in rhode island.
Why so many of the posters in this thread feel that this is a slap in the face to analog customers is beyond me. It was a simple business decision, but I'll bet it wasn't an easy one to make for either company.
Foot stomping? I don't think so. This is one of the top two players in the market completely dropping out, without warning. There is surprise and worry that our other suppliers will follow suit. Moving from twenty years of having anything at my door in two days to a week or ten day plus delivery time is a change I will need to keep on top of for a while. Especially since I can't get anything photographic locally. Seriously, not even a roll of 35mm color print film.
I see that makes sense. I guess that with the analog photography world being fragile, a simple business move is all it takes to cause an earthquake of terror.I get that, really I do, especially considering the closest film from me is a 3.5 hour drive away. But there is no way that they would just kick customers to the proverbial curb when they add up to income unless there were forces at work that we are simply not privy to....and like it or not...we are not privy to that info.
B&H is huge and they have never been known to make announcements of any kind regarding things like inventory, price changes or any of that in the 30 years I have been dealing with them.
You never know, they may actually be trying to rectify this as we speak...but it is business and none of that is any of our business.
AI Print isn't going to like this responseI see that makes sense. I guess that with the analog photography world being fragile, a simple business move is all it takes to cause an earthquake of terror.
AI Print isn't going to like this response
More generally though, the real problem is that sources like B & H effectively drove almost all the local sources out of the business, and in many cases actually out of business entirely.
And now, they stop supplying the market that remains.
More generally though, the real problem is that sources like B & H effectively drove almost all the local sources out of the business, and in many cases actually out of business entirely.
And now, they stop supplying the market that remains.
Don't doubt it Colorado is a lot closer to California than New Jersey . Call up Freestyle and ask them for C-41 chemistry with separate bleach and fixer . This could be a great thing . B&H is like Walmart they can bankrupt suppliers . Maybe what comes out of this is we pay a little more and have more real options?Just for kicks, I put 20 each of Xtol, Dektol and Fixer in the basket at both Unique and Freestyle to see what shipping would be. Freestyle was $40 to my address buried in the mountains and Unique was $74.
Which certainly doesn't include much to do with still photography - due to the "high margin" criteria.Especially this time of year they want to focus on high margin, high dollar technology sales
Agreed they can go jump in a lake full of LED TV'sWhich certainly doesn't include much to do with still photography - due to the "high margin" criteria.
Darn good question , you can bet that B&H will still sell film . The big question is can Ilford and Alaris and others figure out a business model where a retailer must sell the entire line ? I remember when Kodak protected their dealer networks , studios couldn't buy direct from Kodak (in the US ) then along came Fuji and that all changed .Well, we've given B&H enough of a free marketing & sales promotional leg up for the day... Time now to maybe quiz Harman about how this move by a dominant retailer of their product range is likely/might impact the future national distribution plus availability of their product range going forward. After all, the Ilford brand is well considered... And, I suspect the major supplier of photographic product internationally. A recent forum dealt with the issue of Ilford pricing in Japan. Is this beginning of a trend designed to disrupt film photography supply chain? Or, maybe it is time for Harman to widen the scope and reach of their UK based online store - Harman Express and sell direct into worldwide markets? Who knows... I'm easy... I will support whomever is prepared to support me with a good range, pricing and availability of wanted product. Fred
Possibly the expectation is that this decision will drive "foot traffic" into the store?
I suspect that that is the real issue. Film chemistry is such a very small part of their sales that it is not profitable to meet the regulatory requirements to ship hazardous materials.FREE SHIPPING, chemicals are heavy low priced and a pain to deal with. IF B&H would charge for shipping chemicals then they would be Freestyle. They don't want to fiddle with it. I would be amazed if all of darkroom together amounts to more than 1% of their business.
Best Mike
Absolutely. Yes.I suggest that APUGers give their money to the folks who sponsor the forum and have made commitments to our chosen medium - Ultrafine, Freestyle, and of course ILFORD.
wasnt there a B&H member on APUG? im surprised he hasnt chimed in yet.
it would be nice to get the facts from the source?
.
The post just above yoursDoes anyone know the name of the Top Dog at B&H?...
identifies APUG user henryp, who is Henry Posner. I've emailed Henry, the B&H Director of Corporate Communications, for many years, always finding him to be forthright and helpful.(there was a url link here which no longer exists)
Certified Mail with Restricted Delivery will get it to the secretary.If you're interested in going all the way to the top, you need to reach Blimie and/or Herman:
I've no idea what means of communication would be effective to accomplish that.
Well, that's a shame. I was about to place a large order of christmas stuff for shipping to Canada in the next while and was planning to tack on more chemistry as well. I liked ordering from B&H because they went the extra mile to reliably cover the import correctly rather than me having to deal with surprise fees. I liked that the company put the extra bit of effort into making my life easier.
However if they're going to stand by this change and not make an attempt to continue to make my life easier, then I'll take all of my photo related business elsewhere.
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