Are ID-11 and D76 identical?

[skahde]

The material safety data sheets may give a clue to this question.

Thank you keith. This means that Kodak obviously doens't put D76 but something like D76d + sequestering agent into the bags.

Stefan

 

[fschifano]

For all practical purposes they are the same. Maybe Kodak has some "pixie dust" mixed into their formulation for this developer so that all the ingredients get along together in the same package, but I have never seen any evidence that it makes one iota of difference in the finished product. If there are differences they are very subtle and are easily swamped by all the other variables with inconsistent values that go into the making of a photograph. As someone else has already noted, published development times are simply departure points and nothing more. You need to work out the fine details. If you've done that for ID-11, they will work the same for D-76.

 

[gainer]

It may simply be that the British like a little more contrast in their negatives.

 

[skahde]

To summarize the data from the MSDS ID11 is made following to the published formula for D76 + a sequestering agent whereas Kodaks packaged D76 is the buffered version D76d + a sequestering agent.

With this in mind the follwing article is interesting to read:
http://groups.google.de/group/rec.photo.darkroom/msg/b291e9800290747c?hl=de
In a nutshell:
Freshly made D76/ID11 and D76d/packaged D76 differ only slightly in activity. After 35 days D76/ID11 needs 50% less time for the same CI. whereas D76d and supposedly also Kodaks packaged D76 increases only slightly in activity.

This means both is correct: ID11 and Kodaks packaged D76 work the same (when fresh) but also differ significantly in activity (with age).

best

Stefan

 

[bogeyes]

It may simply be that the British like a little more contrast in their negatives.

Thats right, the light is pretty dull and overcast," it's rough up north tha knows "

 

[Keith Tapscott.]

Thank you keith. This means that Kodak obviously doens't put D76 but something like D76d + sequestering agent into the bags.

Stefan

Whether the commercially packaged Kodak D-76 developer is the same as D-76d or a modified version, I wouldn`t be able to comment on.
What I will say is that D-76 is a very reliable and consistent product that still delivers a good all round yield and that is what matters the most. Most of the other processing chemicals and sundries that I use are Ilford products.
For those who like to make their own developers from the basic components may for reasons of curiosity, try making a hybrid type MQ developer by looking up the formula`s of D-76d and D-96 respectively. I`ll keep buying the E.K. D-76. Kodak have reformulated and improved an old classic.

 

[modafoto]

I am about to order some D76 and compared the prices on these two identical developers....ID11 is costs much more than D76.

Any idea why?

 

[Paul Howell]

At least in my market, Illford disappeared for several months and when the dry chemistry became avilable again the price really took a jump up.

 

[modafoto]

At least in my market, Illford disappeared for several months and when the dry chemistry became avilable again the price really took a jump up.

Ok, it might be that. But I remember it to costs about double the price of D76 even before the Ilford trouble.

 

[Tom Hoskinson]

I am about to order some D76...

APOSTASY!!!!

 

[srs5694]

I am about to order some D76 and compared the prices on these two identical developers....ID11 is costs much more than D76.

Any idea why?

At B&H, a big US mail-order outfit, Kodak D-76 to make 1 gallon (3.785 liters) costs $5.49, whereas Ilford ID-11 to make 5 liters costs $8.95. If you don't pay sufficient attention to the different sizes, that can make the ID-11 look more expensive, but the difference is much smaller when you correct for that. On a per-liter basis, D-76 costs $1.45, whereas ID-11 costs $1.79. Adding shipping raises both costs equally per package, which brings the per-liter costs to almost exact equality, to $2.75/liter for D-76 vs. $2.77/liter for ID-11, assuming you order nothing but one package of each developer and ship to my address, according to the B&H postage calculator. (The 1-liter packages from B&H cost $4.79 for both D-76 and ID-11, without shipping, so you'd be crazy to buy in that size unless you use very little of the stuff.)

If your actual per-liter costs are hugely higher for ID-11 than for D-76, my best guess would be it has to do with exchange rates. I don't follow these very closely, but the last I heard, the dollar/euro exchange rates made it cheap to import stuff from the US into EU countries, so you might be seeing the benefit of that. (This assumes that D-76 sold in Europe is made in the US and exported.)

 

[modafoto]

APOSTASY!!!!

I know...but I need it for fast film...

Otherwise I use GOD as developer.

 

[modafoto]

If your actual per-liter costs are hugely higher for ID-11 than for D-76, my best guess would be it has to do with exchange rates. I don't follow these very closely, but the last I heard, the dollar/euro exchange rates made it cheap to import stuff from the US into EU countries, so you might be seeing the benefit of that. (This assumes that D-76 sold in Europe is made in the US and exported.)

In Germany I can get D76 to make 3.8 (1 gallon) for 34 DKK, and ID11 to make 1 litre for 28 DKK. That would be about 9 DKK ($1.50) for 1 litre of D76 and 28 DKK ($4.50) for 1 litre of ID11. That is 3 times the price of D76! And the funny thing is...ID11 costs 28 DKK per litre if you buy the 1 litre pack...and 38 DKK if you buy the 2.5 litre pack Maybe they got it wrong about the amount on the 2.5 litre pack...maybe it should be 5 litre pack...

I guess it is the dollar/euro exchange rates.

 

[srs5694]

In Germany I can get D76 to make 3.8 (1 gallon) for 34 DKK, and ID11 to make 1 litre for 28 DKK. That would be about 9 DKK ($1.50) for 1 litre of D76 and 28 DKK ($4.50) for 1 litre of ID11. That is 3 times the price of D76! And the funny thing is...ID11 costs 28 DKK per litre if you buy the 1 litre pack...and 38 DKK if you buy the 2.5 litre pack Maybe they got it wrong about the amount on the 2.5 litre pack...maybe it should be 5 litre pack...

I guess it is the dollar/euro exchange rates.

Well, I certainly wouldn't compare the 1-gallon (3.785-liter) price to the 1-liter price; the latter will be much higher. a 1-gallon to 2.5-liter comparison is more sensible. For that, it's 8.98DKK for D-76 vs. 15.20DKK for ID-11, which is much closer to parity, although ID-11 is still close to 70% more expensive. My hunch is the price difference would shrink to almost nothing if you compared 1-gallon D-76 to 5-liter ID-11. (FWIW, B&H in the US doesn't offer 2.5-liter ID-11 packages, just 1-liter and 5-liter.) Unfortunately, these comparisons across measuring systems just complicate matters.

 

[mmcclellan]

Are ID-11 and D76 identical? Will D76 give me virtually the same results as ID-11 without too much experimentation and messing around?

Just looking for a short term solution here.

Cheers,
Kent

As with all film and developer combinations, it's best to run tests. Shoot two rolls or two sheets of the same subject on the same film, develop them in both developers for the same times and temperatures and agitations, then contact print the negs side by side on the same sheet. You'll know immediately if they're the "same" or not. Good luck!

 

[df cardwell]

For all normal purposes, ID-11 and D-76 are the same.

Mixed with distilled water, and diluted 1:1, and they are even samer.

Make a test with your ID-11 times, and agitation pattern, and make the inevitable small corrections. Have fun.

Don

"This suspense is terrible! I hope it will last."

 

[Markok765]

Otherwise I use GOD as developer.

Hows that working for you? fine grain, sharp, do you get the full film speed?

 

[glennfromwy]

In a nutshell, ID-11 uses (used?) the original D-76 formula. D-76 does not, now. Functionally identical.