Apparent Confusion about Artistic Expression

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donald --

i never really think about why am photographing and making photographic images. for me i think it is about telling some sort of story. i don't mind failing, and know that failure only leads to something better down the road.

i haven't really answered your questions very well ...
 

Andy K

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billschwab said:
Uuuuhhhh.... Pete Seeger only covered it as well. Go back... wayyyy back.

Bill

Ok, if we're going to split hairs, the song was written by Pete Seeger. The original 'verse' was taken from some old book or other written in antiquity.
 

jd callow

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gr82bart said:
What she said. I like what I like. End of my philosophy.

Art.

I have met phenomenal artists who probably couldn't say that much about what they produce. It is OK to operate on autopilot and just as legitimate to try and get a grip on what you do and why.

I would guess that as much analysis is done in retrospect as is done prior. One will still take their perspective with them when they shoot and I would argue that it is better to pursue improvement and definition than it is to wait to get caught by it.
 

Tom Reardon

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BWGirl said:
so, sorry, I am just a person who loves photography, shoots what she likes, and hopes that she will have a nice photo or two after the first 10,000.

Ditto - I photograph because I can't not do it, and hope some others enjoy the result
 

Lopaka

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BWGirl said:
I have this really strong aversion to endless 'navel-gazing'. ....I am just a person who loves photography, shoots what she likes, and hopes that she will have a nice photo or two after the first 10,000.

Thanks, Jeannette, you said it for me and I think many others. I am not a fan of art school motivation platitudes or of psycho-babble. Me, I'm just an old psycho-ceramic. (cracked-pot )

I love the tactile sensations of the whole process....swatting mosquitos in the woods.... getting bruises from the rocks in river gorges.... spilling chemistry... burning myself on the dry mount press... it's FUN!

Bob
 
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Donald Miller

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Thank you, each and every one of you, for your responses. I have not taken the time to read them all because the tone that I have observed by those I have read is really not constructive to maintaining any type of future relationship.

I think that I have the picture and believe me, I have no problem with my self expression. I haven't had for a pretty long time.

I will leave it that this is a subject that is best not discussed here. I will find those who have enough self awareness and who think about these things. There are those who do. I have found them before. Some people just are not in the same places and do not see things the same way.

No more stated judgements are warranted or needed.
 

jimgalli

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Andy K said:
Ok, if we're going to split hairs, the song was written by Pete Seeger. The original 'verse' was taken from some old book or other written in antiquity.

Same guy who wrote:

"That which has been is that which will be, and that which has been done is that which will be done. So, there is nothing new under the sun." Eccl. 1:9

which also pertains to this discussion.
 

jimgalli

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gr82bart said:
I wonder if God thinks what He created was art or craft or was it just a Sunday pastime hobby?

Art.

Not sure, but we know that since He created Art, He has a grand sense of humor.
 

Lopaka

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Andy K

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jimgalli said:
Not sure, but we know that since He created Art, He has a grand sense of humor.

Didn't he create grafitti too? The writing on the wall thing?
 

Jorge

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darr said:
Donald I am disappointed! I offer you the opportunity to show us what you got when it comes to creative philosophies and you choose to hide. All talk and no action just as I had predicted.

Jeeezz....so if you did not like what he had to say to you, were you going to accuse him of sexual harrasement like you did to me in the LF forum?

I get the feeling Donald did not respond and critiqued your picture out of kidness, but since you decided to take a pot shot at me in the past it is time I return the favor.

Your picture is tired and trite, you can see many of them in photography books from the seventies, you know the kind, the grainy soft look of a ballerina looking demure gazing down at her feet in pastel colors. Or how about the same technique but with the woman sitting with a guitar? Sound familiar?
The treatment of your subjects and the techniques bring nothing new to the table.

So while I understand that this is your art and your taste, please dont use it to "show" us new treatments of the same ol, same ol, leave that to Schwab or Callow. I beleive this is the point Donald was trying to make, same old stuff regurgitated as new and fresh in the hopes people will fall for it. Frankly there are few people who have the talent to show us fresh new images of old subjects and IMO only a 3 or 4 in this forum. So, get off your high horse, you are not even close yet.

PS. You love to dish it out, I hope you are as good taking some of it this time.
 

jimgalli

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Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy! Jorge's back.
 

Andy K

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jimgalli said:
Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy! Jorge's back.


 

Jorge

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jimgalli said:
Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy Oh Boy! Jorge's back.
Not really back Jim, I am on my way to my treatments, but got tired of this person putting down people in this forum like she was some kind of photographic genious. I miss Helen b, at least she could take it as well as dish it out and damm the woman is smart....
 

Dave Parker

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Glad to see you around Jorge, hope things are going well with the treatments.

R.
 

photomc

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Hey Jorge....hang in there, this is where it gets tuff. You will be fine, just vent once in a while...It's good for you

Funny, was thinking last night I was missing Helen's input on this one. Like you said...the woman is smart!!
 

jd callow

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Jorge said:
... leave that to Schwab or Callow.

Damn I'm blushing.

Get better soon Bubba.

As an italian girlfriend would tell me when I was facing it: "Forza!"




'It' being a tough go of it.
 

blansky

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I've read most of this thread and I feel it conveys a lot about APUG. There are many here who are at a point in their life, and I suggest that Donald is there, who are trying to use the medium of photography to add greater meaning to their life. So to put it rudely, they are navel gazing.

The problem is eveyone here is here for a different reason, some to learn, some to teach, some to have fun and some like Donald who are attempting to use this site as a place to discuss the philosophical aspect of art, and it's motivation.

I feel the group is far to diverse and large to attempt this endeavor and it is just leading to frustration.

We all have very different reasons to photograph anything. Some do it for the art, after having learned the craft. Some do it, copying their heroes, to learn the craft and hope that it becomes art. Some have no art whatsoever in their soul and do it, and do it but can penetrate the art barrier. Some have the art part down, but don't have the patience or the skill to get the craft part down. And lastly some do it to get away from the old lady for a few hours.

I have played hockey at a medium level for many years and depending on the mood that I go to play in, I have, when frustrated at the play of someone on my team, yelled at them for making a stupid play. On one occassion, one of the recipients of my yelling said, "shut the fuck up, the scouts have all left the building, 20 years ago."

I have to remember that occasionally when I get pissed.

Most here photograph for fun/entertainment/expression and they are neither at a place of artistic excellence, or philosophical reflection in their work.

Some are, but they work more by instinct/intuition and do not engage in a lot of deep self reflection.

I respectfully submit that subjects like this are better discussed with an intimate group and usually there needs to be alcohol involved.


Michael
 

bill schwab

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blansky said:
I respectfully submit that subjects like this are better discussed with an intimate group and usually there needs to be alcohol involved.
Very well said Michael. It would save a lot of time as well!

Bill
 
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