Albumen Questions

[vickersdc]

Read Reilly's book, which you can download from albumen.stanford.com

I found the book (actually at http://albumen.conservation-us.org/library/monographs/reilly/) and it's great!

I'm just on chapter 4, where it talks about coating the paper with the albumen solution. That solution calls for 1 litre of albumen... just how many eggs does that take?! I've got three chickens wondering around the garden, but they'd be hard pushed to produce enough!

Cheers,
David.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

You need enough albumen to fill the tray of whatever size you're using. I recommend flat bottom trays for all aspects of albumen printing to keep the solution quantities reasonable. You generally want to coat the paper one size larger than your print size and trim the coated, sensitized paper to the size of the neg. Some people like to have an oversized sheet of paper, but then remember you're gold toning all that excess space, and you'll go through toner faster.

I once figured out how many eggs you needed per liter, but it's been a while since I started from that point. I have a couple of jars of albumen and some stock of albumenized paper, and I just keep adding to them as needed. I think it's around 40 large egg whites per litre.

 

[RobertP]

About 5 dozen extra large eggs. So if you buy about 25 more good layers you should be all set. And don't forget a good rooster to keep those hens in line. With the yolks you can make cheese cake for all your neighbors too. John Coffer claims about 2 dozen per 500ml. But if I remember correctly 2 dozen came up a little short of 500 ml for me. Also make sure you remove all chalaza from the albumen. Edit....I spoke to soon, I just checked my notes and I was getting 30 ml per egg

 

[vickersdc]

Thank you for the speedy responses!

So apart from costing a small fortune in eggs can I make up my litre or so of albumen solution and then just keep coating papers until it has pretty much run out?

If I am to coat 8x10 sheets, or thereabouts, roughly how many sheets could I reasonably expect to coat? Are we talking 5 or 6, or nearer to 30-35? Or more?

I'm kind of tempted to try this with some medium format negs to start with, before moving on to printing the glass plates, just to minimise the variables for me!

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

You need a certain amount of surplus to float the paper on the albumen, so it depends on how you're counting. If you're coating 8x10 sheets for whole plate or smaller prints, you probably want at least 1.5l in the tray, and then you can coat at least 25 sheets, I'd guess. The limiting factor is usually drying space.

 

[vickersdc]

I'd be coating sheets to be used with 18cm x 24cm glass plates (using the FKD camera). Good point about the drying space though!

Still, the cost of eggs is nothing compared to the cost of silver nitrate! One thing is for sure, these alternative processes are not cheap! Still, one hopes the results are worth it, and the satisfaction gained from using an old process also makes it worthwhile.

And so, going from Reilly's book, here's what I have come up with so far...

Ammonium chloride (15g)
Glacial acetic acid (2ml)
Water - presumably distilled is better?
Albumen (40+ eggs)

The choice of paper seems to be fairly critical, and I'm thinking Arches Aquarelle, Strathmore Series 500 Drawing Paper or Saunders Waterford.

Sensitising solution consisting of 100g silver nitrate and distilled water. Perhaps a 5% shot of citric acid in that?

Now, before I do anything daft, like ordering all this, am I heading along the right lines please? Especially as it going to cost something in the order of £75 or so...

Thanks,
David.

 

[RobertP]

Are you double coating and hardening the first coat in alcohol?

 

[vickersdc]

Are you double coating and hardening the first coat in alcohol?

No, I wasn't planning to. Just a single coat, although I realise that might result in slightly uneven coating.

I guess from your question that you would highly recommend double coating? I'm certainly not averse to doing it - this method is clearly not the cheapest, and so I really do not want to invest in this method of printing only to regret taking a short-cut later.

 

[RobertP]

You can get very good images with a single coat. I just like a double coat because it gives you a little richer print, or so it seems from my experience. Your single coat should be plenty even enough.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

The advantage of double coating depends on the paper, I think. I single coat usually.

The paper most like that used most often in the era of albumen printing is Strathmore 500 Single-Ply Plate. Other papers work and may be interesting, but single-ply is easier to coat, I find. Heavier papers will curl more in the tray and can be harder to bend and float.

With albumen, you want to lay the paper on the surface of the albumen solution evenly and you want complete contact, no bubbles, and no albumen on the back of the paper.

When sensitizing, you want to lay the paper on the surface of the silver nitrate solution in one quick smooth motion to avoid wicking effects, again with no bubbles.

For both of these steps, thinner paper is easier. The vast majority of period albumen prints are on thin paper mounted to heavier cardstock.

 

[RobertP]

I mostly use the Strathmore 500 Drawing -plate surface- single ply as David indicated. You can also take a sheet and fold it in half and glue the 3 loose sides along the edges. Use a size, when folded will give you a size larger than what you'll need. Now you can submerge the paper packet in the albumen and avoid a lot of those pesky surface bubbles. Once the paper is dry you then cut away the glued edges and you have two sheets of albumen paper. You can also leave them glued and when you're ready to print submerge them in the silver nitrate solution, then cut them apart.

 

[vickersdc]

RobertP: what a great idea! I had to read it twice though; that's one of those really simple ideas that seems so obvious once it's pointed out!

However, might I ask a seemingly silly question..? What glue do you use, or doesn't it matter? Are we talking Pritt Stick / PVA here, or animal glues?

Thanks to everyone for all your helpful comments

David.

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

John Coffer uses the method of gluing and cutting, and I think he uses rubber cement. The seal can't leak, because you'll get a white spot on the print, if there is any albumen on the back of the paper.

 

[RobertP]

Not a silly question at all. I use "Best-Test" paper cement. It is an acid free adhesive. I bought it at the local art supply. I wanted to make sure I didn't contaminate my silver bath with any of the animal proteins. "Best-Test" is a natural rubber latex. Make sure you use a decent coat so as to seal the edges well. I have had good success with it so far.

 

[csant]

Hello, I am at the start of some albumen printing myself, and have been wondering about the amount both of albumen and silver nitrate needed for floating the sheets. In the Reilly book on Albumen, he mentions making a "boat" by bending up the edges of the paper sheet for easing an even floating. This got me thinking: would it make sense to make such a "boat", but in stead of *floating* the boat on the albumen and silver nitrate solutions, to *pour* the albumen and the sensitizing solution into the boat? I have not tried it yet, but have been wondering: wouldn't this a) prevent pesky bubbles in the albumen, b) ensure some fairly even sensitizing (provided one pours quickly enough), and c) significantly reduce the amount of required albumen and silver nitrate solution? What would speak against such an approach? I have not seen this mentioned anywhere, so somehow I feel there might be some drawback - but anybody has any experience to share already?

 

[juan]

I don't have significant bubble problems with regular floating. The paper needs some time floating, so I don't think pouring through would allow enough to soak in. Same with the silver nitrate. I've found that different papers require different amounts of silver nitrate. I use a Richeson brush for applying the silver, so maybe someone who floats for that would have more of an opinion. I'd be afraid pouring the silver nitrate would lead to very uneven coating.

But, I haven't tried it. You might and get good results.
juan

 

[David A. Goldfarb]

If you were to pour the albumen onto the sheet, I think you would have a very difficult time coating evenly and keeping it off the back of the paper.