Airport Sheet Film Procedure

[bvy]

I'd like to find the post where a member reported a first hand case of carry on scanner damage. I've seen reports of what people thought was scanner damage that turned out to be film fog due to light leak, but so far every report I've seen has turned out to be second hand (or third or fourth) or fogging due to light.

@winger reported an instance of this happening to her. I expect she'll thank me for dragging her name into this...

 

[AgX]

Then we have two cases...
Still only two.

 

[bvy]

Then we have two cases...
Still only two.

Out of how many?

 

[winger]

@winger reported an instance of this happening to her. I expect she'll thank me for dragging her name into this...

Thanks @bvy Mine was not done at an airport, though. I'm fairly sure mine happened at a castle in England on the way in before a tour. The bag got stuck in the scanner and they had it on the whole time (not The rolls affected were only the ones in the bag at that time (some had been left in the car and some I bought after that) - and it was only the 400 color film. The B&W was all fine (even the 400). Of the rolls that were affected, some shots were fine, but others not so much. It was also back in 2002 (before I'd found APUG).

 

[Mike Bates]

I'm not an authority on the danger to film from airport scanners. Nobody should take my word for the safety of your film. I remain skeptical of film being damaged by CARRY ON scanners based on my own experience sending film through them. If I was carrying film I felt was extremely important, I'd err on the side of caution and ship it ahead. I wouldn't attempt to rely on hand inspection. Whole bag scanners for checked luggage are an entire 'nuther ballgame. Checked luggage scanners are much more powerful.

The last time I asked for hand inspection, I was carrying about 20 rolls of 120 film in new sealed boxes. Admittedly, the screening area was busy at the time I went through. I had my film in a gallon sized Ziploc bag and I asked for it to be hand inspected. The lady didn't even look up. "If it's less than 800 speed film, it can go through." I was ready for that response and told her I was carrying it on several legs of flights and since the effect is cumulative, I'd like it hand inspected. She rolled her eyes and yelled, "Hand inspection here." I guess nobody heard her the first time and she had to yell it again. Eventually, a guy takes my film and I go through the scanner myself and join him inspecting my film.

The TSA inspector opened every single box and removed the film (in the foil wrapper). He swabbed each individual roll, one at a time, and placed the swab in the machine to be checked. It took at least 20 minutes, maybe more, to swab and check each roll of film. I could tell he was in no hurry at all. When he was finally done, he left me a tray of twenty empty boxes and twenty rolls of film to put back together myself. They made their point. I haven't asked for hand inspection since.

Kodak issued a Technical Information Bulletin in 2003 warning about the dangers of airport scanners to unprocessed film. They didn't specifically address carry on scanners. The damage examples they show were from checked baggage scanners. BTW, the damage they show looks like this:

That was 14 years ago and scanner technology has no doubt changed since then, but I wouldn't know if any changes were better or worse for film. I send my film through the carry on scanners, but I'd never send unprocessed film through checked luggage scanners.

 

[removed account4]

ive never had trouble and have had film scanned 10+ times / trip and since then, including iso 800 film/
just put it through the carry on scanner nothing will happen to it.

 

[Henry Yorke]

Resurrecting an old post….

For years, my experience was the same as most folks in this post; film was not damaged going through carry-on x-ray scanners.

I’m curious, though, if anyone has had any experience with the new CT scanners and sheet film.

Were you able to get a hand inspection? And if so, how did you deal with sheet film in boxes?

 

[koraks]

In terms of x-ray damage, sheet film won't be any different from roll film. The damage with CT scanners is likely. There's a long thread about airport x-ray issues if you search for it.

Hand inspections: I think you're entitled to these in the US and the UK, but not in Europe. Whether you'll be granted a hand inspections in the EU will depend on the airport and possibly even the individual security guard you encounter.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Hi all:

I have been a traveling 120 roll film user for almost 20 years, and going through security in US airports with such film is still relatively easy with a few more minutes of time: you ask for a hand inspection, they wipe a fabric all over the films (usually still in the wrapper) and then place the swabbed fabric in a machine to test for explosive residue.

I have now moved up to 8x10, and soon the time will come to pass through airport security with exposed and unexposed film in a box, and possibly still in the holders after exposure. For those who travel with 8x10 film, what do you do? Do they just swab the outside of the box? Do you open up your changing tent and hand them nitrile gloves? Or do you just let them x-ray the film, and just make sure that any batch of film only goes through the airport once?

As far as film sensitivity, I primarily shoot FP4, but surely traveling with 8x10 HP5 and Portra 400 is in my future too. I intend for up to 5x enlargement (40x50") of the negatives.

Thanks!
-Jarin

I've successfully approached someone from the flight crew and asked them to carry it through for me.

 

[Anaxagore]

Better let them go through the scanner just once. TSA agents are certainly not the most educated people and what they may do always freaks me out.
A few years ago in New Orleans after asking for a hand check, one of the films returned a false positive (no idea why as I always keep all my films together). Of course the very idea of a false positive and re-running the test is above their pay grade. They trashed the film and ran the swab over almost my whole body.. needless fo say, I now prefer a film slightly fogged to a film trashed.
Another time I was traveling with my folder, and they ordered me to open it, then ran the swab over the coated lens… it’s not even worth it to file a complaint in this case, one only gets an automated answer.

 

[Henry Yorke]

In terms of x-ray damage, sheet film won't be any different from roll film. The damage with CT scanners is likely. There's a long thread about airport x-ray issues if you search for it.

Hand inspections: I think you're entitled to these in the US and the UK, but not in Europe. Whether you'll be granted a hand inspections in the EU will depend on the airport and possibly even the individual security guard you encounter.

Thanks - yes - I've read most of those threads - but because there wasn't much mention of sheet film handling in regards to the CT scanners (mostly 120 and 35 from what I could tell), I thought I'd ask as part of an old thread.

 

[koraks]

There's no reason to expect sheet film will be any different from roll film in terms of how it's handled by security staff or how vulnerable it is to x-rays. The differences in packaging won't play a huge roll either way.

Frankly, at this point I'd think twice of flying sheet film through airports with CT scanners. I've even had film visibly x-ray fogged a few months ago with a regular x-ray scanner.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I'm not an authority on the danger to film from airport scanners. Nobody should take my word for the safety of your film. I remain skeptical of film being damaged by CARRY ON scanners based on my own experience sending film through them. If I was carrying film I felt was extremely important, I'd err on the side of caution and ship it ahead. I wouldn't attempt to rely on hand inspection. Whole bag scanners for checked luggage are an entire 'nuther ballgame. Checked luggage scanners are much more powerful.

The last time I asked for hand inspection, I was carrying about 20 rolls of 120 film in new sealed boxes. Admittedly, the screening area was busy at the time I went through. I had my film in a gallon sized Ziploc bag and I asked for it to be hand inspected. The lady didn't even look up. "If it's less than 800 speed film, it can go through." I was ready for that response and told her I was carrying it on several legs of flights and since the effect is cumulative, I'd like it hand inspected. She rolled her eyes and yelled, "Hand inspection here." I guess nobody heard her the first time and she had to yell it again. Eventually, a guy takes my film and I go through the scanner myself and join him inspecting my film.

The TSA inspector opened every single box and removed the film (in the foil wrapper). He swabbed each individual roll, one at a time, and placed the swab in the machine to be checked. It took at least 20 minutes, maybe more, to swab and check each roll of film. I could tell he was in no hurry at all. When he was finally done, he left me a tray of twenty empty boxes and twenty rolls of film to put back together myself. They made their point. I haven't asked for hand inspection since.

Kodak issued a Technical Information Bulletin in 2003 warning about the dangers of airport scanners to unprocessed film. They didn't specifically address carry on scanners. The damage examples they show were from checked baggage scanners. BTW, the damage they show looks like this:

That was 14 years ago and scanner technology has no doubt changed since then, but I wouldn't know if any changes were better or worse for film. I send my film through the carry on scanners, but I'd never send unprocessed film through checked luggage scanners.

What about putting your film in those lead sheets and putting it in your checked baggage.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

In terms of x-ray damage, sheet film won't be any different from roll film. The damage with CT scanners is likely. There's a long thread about airport x-ray issues if you search for it.

Hand inspections: I think you're entitled to these in the US and the UK, but not in Europe. Whether you'll be granted a hand inspections in the EU will depend on the airport and possibly even the individual security guard you encounter.

Is there a way to request inspection by hand in advance before you get to the airport. Also, some airlines tickets above coach have separate PSA check in lines. Maybe those are more amenable to hand checking?

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I've successfully approached someone from the flight crew and asked them to carry it through for me.

Yikes. That's the one no-no flight crews and even passengers are not suppose to do. Carry through someone else's bomb. I can imagine a crew member getting fired for that. As a passenger I'd support their firing.

 

[grain elevator]

Better let them go through the scanner just once. TSA agents are certainly not the most educated people and what they may do always freaks me out.
A few years ago in New Orleans after asking for a hand check, one of the films returned a false positive (no idea why as I always keep all my films together). Of course the very idea of a false positive and re-running the test is above their pay grade. They trashed the film and ran the swab over almost my whole body.. needless fo say, I now prefer a film slightly fogged to a film trashed.
Another time I was traveling with my folder, and they ordered me to open it, then ran the swab over the coated lens… it’s not even worth it to file a complaint in this case, one only gets an automated answer.

I was told by a German airport security guy that false positives were expected with Instax film. So they swiped it, ignored the beeping and waived me through, with an additional swipe of my backpack or something IIRC.

 

[grain elevator]

Yikes. That's the one no-no flight crews and even passengers are not suppose to do. Carry through someone else's bomb. I can imagine a crew member getting fired for that. As a passenger I'd support their firing.

Agreed. Not so much because of potential bomb threat but because such unreflected risk-taking just generally disqualifies from such a position.

 

[Sirius Glass]

In terms of x-ray damage, sheet film won't be any different from roll film. The damage with CT scanners is likely. There's a long thread about airport x-ray issues if you search for it.

Hand inspections: I think you're entitled to these in the US and the UK, but not in Europe. Whether you'll be granted a hand inspections in the EU will depend on the airport and possibly even the individual security guard you encounter.

When I politely asked for a hand inspection in France, the response was belligerent and rude. When I complained, even the inspector's coworkers and supervisor agreed that the inspector had stepped into it and was up to his ears but I still did not get a hand inspection.

 

[koraks]

Is there a way to request inspection by hand in advance before you get to the airport. Also, some airlines tickets above coach have separate PSA check in lines. Maybe those are more amenable to hand checking?

I'm not very optimistic about this. In my experience, European security personnel are impatiently polite at best, at least in most cases. I don't expect much of anything will come out of an advance request for a manual check. Most airports probably don't even have a way to contact security departments for this kind of thing.
I'm not familiar with separate check in lines. The airports I've gone through all have the same flow all travelers go through. The only difference is that there's an additional queue for checked baggage. It's well understood that checked baggage is not a good way to transport your film.

 

[Sirius Glass]

When I politely asked for a hand inspection in France, the response was belligerent and rude. When I complained, even the inspector's coworkers and supervisor agreed that the inspector had stepped into it and was up to his ears but I still did not get a hand inspection.

I'm not very optimistic about this. In my experience, European security personnel are impatiently polite at best, at least in most cases. I don't expect much of anything will come out of an advance request for a manual check. Most airports probably don't even have a way to contact security departments for this kind of thing.
I'm not familiar with separate check in lines. The airports I've gone through all have the same flow all travelers go through. The only difference is that there's an additional queue for checked baggage. It's well understood that checked baggage is not a good way to transport your film.

We are in violent agreement!

 

[koraks]

I'm afraid so, yes! Granted, I've had some really nice experiences at Eindhoven Airport in The Netherlands where staff have always been really friendly to me. But that's the exception rather than the rule.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

When I politely asked for a hand inspection in France, the response was belligerent and rude. When I complained, even the inspector's coworkers and supervisor agreed that the inspector had stepped into it and was up to his ears but I still did not get a hand inspection.

Well, it was France.

 

[Alan Edward Klein]

I'm not very optimistic about this. In my experience, European security personnel are impatiently polite at best, at least in most cases. I don't expect much of anything will come out of an advance request for a manual check. Most airports probably don't even have a way to contact security departments for this kind of thing.
I'm not familiar with separate check in lines. The airports I've gone through all have the same flow all travelers go through. The only difference is that there's an additional queue for checked baggage. It's well understood that checked baggage is not a good way to transport your film.

They used to have pre check notes on the airline tickets sot the line attendant separates you out into a different line where less PSA checks are made. Then there's pre-check PSA that costs around $100 to join. There were also different lines for the Eurorail train I took from London to Paris. Since I don;t shoot film when I travel anymore., I don't know what differences these things make if you are carrying film.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Well, it was France.

And that is the only country that I have ever complained about for this specific problem or any other problem.

 

[MTGseattle]

I've heard from 3 professionals lately and all of them now try and source and process film in the country they are traveling in. I realize that this isn't necessarily an option for us mere mortals, but in the bigger cities, I could see this as being an option. If you're a "famous" working pro, I imagine a local network of potential helpers builds up and makes the logistics of this much easier as you return year after year to a given location.

In 2017, I had success getting a film hand check in Seattle, then failed getting a hand check in Dublin. I didn't even try on the return flights. Those were Delta 100 and 400 in 120 size. No ill effects, but all were carry-on scanners.