AGFA APX 400 @800 in Rodinal development question

[mr. mohaupt]

Hey gang,
I checked out digital truths website and they don't have a time listed for APX 400 pushed to 800 developed at 1+50. I want to cut down some of the contrast and I think diluting Rodinal will help. Based on the other times I have deduced 21 mins anyone tried this?

Thanks in advance,
~M

 

[piu58]

Rodinal is not an appropriate push developer. It tends to blocked highlights (more than other developers like Microphen.) I hope you know that you cannot get "real" 800 ASA from a 400-ASA film. You will the lose shadows.
To keep the highlights in a printable range you need a solvend developer with high amount of sulphite.

 

[P C Headland]

If you want to cut the contrast, you can cut down the agitation and increase the dilution.

You could try 1+100 and stand development - agitate gently for the first 30 seconds or so, then leave it alone. Some people like to agitate with a couple of inversions at the half way mark, some don't. Have a read through the various stand techniques discussed in this forum.

Good luck

 

[MaximusM3]

Careful with that because APX400 is realistically 200-250 at best so you're really pushing more than one stop. I would try stand development with Rodinal 1:100 for one hour but be ready for a decent amount of grain.

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

Careful with that because APX400 is realistically 200-250 at best so you're really pushing more than one stop. I would try stand development with Rodinal 1:100 for one hour but be ready for a decent amount of grain.

And, tons of base fog... I did this a while back with Agfa 400 that was a year or two out of date, and ended up with a negative that was VERY high in base fog, very grainy, and I didn't even push it...
You are probably better off using a developer such as Xtol of Ilford DD-X.

If it's the last generation APX400, after they re-formulated it, you will have trouble developing the negative to full contrast even at box speed using Rodinal. I think the 1+25 time in Agfa's data sheet suggested something like 20 minutes. Pushed one stop, you'll be there all day long, because it doesn't seem like you will ever be able to build contrast beyond a gamma higher than 0.7 no matter how long you develop.

See the figure in the middle column on page nine in the PDF linked below, and you'll see what I mean.

http://www.agfaphoto.com/appc/_upload/2008_36/Datasheet_F_PF_E4.pdf

I'm pretty sure there is no recommendation to use Rodinal to push APX 400 for a reason.

- Thomas

 

[mr. mohaupt]

Thomas,
Thanks for that link, pretty interesting stuff there. I do know its the latest generation film, I bought it 5-6 years ago (bulk roll) and have been using it whenever I run out of 120.

I guess I will experiment with PC Headland and Max's suggestion and do a 1+100 try. I don't mind the grain, I think it suppose to be there lol.

I guess you can't just extrapolate development times then huh?

~Mike

 

[Thomas Bertilsson]

Yeah, grain isn't the issue.

Getting enough contrast from the negative, regardless of developing method, is the issue.

With 1+100 you might get enough density into the negative, but you will NEVER get enough contrast.

I just plain don't recommend it. If you have to shoot APX400 at 800 - look to other developers. I strongly recommend using Xtol at 1+1, agitate every two minutes, and develop for 16 minutes. That's as close as you're going to get to getting somewhat normal negatives.

But you should try it, for sure, to validate that Agfa's data is correct, and that Rodinal, even at 1+25, isn't able to build enough contrast in your negative, let alone 1+50 or 1+100.

 

[mr. mohaupt]

So I finally developed my roll of APX 400 pushed to 800 but I did it with some changes. I followed the Mass Dev Chart and went with EI 800 1+25 for 14 mins. I agitated for the first 30 seconds of the first minute then from minute 2 to 14 it was 10 seconds of agitation every 3rd minute. Here are the results:

Dead Link Removed


This is a central crop from a 35mm image. Note this was also scanned using my v500 as I won't be able to get into the darkroom for a few weeks (work, always interfering with my darkroom time ). I was pretty impressed the grain is very pronounced more so then I usually see with dilutions of say 1+50 but what I really liked with the tone range I captured considering I pushed this film and developed it in unconventional "pushing" developer.

~M