Affordable MF with WLF plus General MF Questions

[Roger Cole]

Roger Cole, thank you kindly for the thorough response. I've read it but I'll reply with follow up questions at a later time.

I noticed the link I posted to the large format forum meter for sale is for a LunaPro, not an SBC. Here's a selection of used meters:

Dead Link Removed

Stay away from the spot meters for now. Using one is not exactly difficult once you understand metering but that's for later. (I have a spot meter and consider it essential for shooting with my 4x5 camera, but never use it for medium format myself.)

 

[Simonh82]

I would second Mamiya C220/330, both can be found at a decent price and I think they are great cameras. They are the only TLRs that have interchangeable lenses all of which are very high quality. I've bought mine though ebay or other online sites, but they seem much cheaper that a lot of MF kit.

 

[CGW]

Dude, I have used Google. Thanks. I actually have been lurking on this site for a while and have searched some even on APUG. I registered because I couldn't find everything out there on what I was looking for in terms of info. If you're going to mention some concept, and the recipient of your message doesn't understand, you should be able to explain yourself or give a link to a place where information can be gathered. Otherwise, you shouldn't be mentioning it because you aren't going to explain yourself. You shouldn't assume everybody will know everything about photography. At least, that's the way I look at it.


Think you've got some entitlement issues. I wish I had 50 bucks for every photo-related URL I've bookmarked and forum posting I've made over the past decade. Try "how to use a light meter" and take it from there. Don't get the ADHD post-literate avoidance of research. Good luck.

 

[h.v.]

Except I know how to use a light meter, so that search would be pointless. What I am curious of is how the handheld works, specifically how it detects light and how you know it is metering the part you actually want to have metered. I could probably do more research in this particular area, but I figured it'd be easier to just ask and on the limited research I had done, I didn't find much. If you've got URLs bookmarked that would be worthwhile for me to know about, then feel free to post 'em.

The community here is pretty good - I certainly wouldn't hesitate to share my shipping address with anyone who has posted a few times.

As I look at it, it really is no different then giving your shipping address to a store, or a magazine, or a credit card company, or your local, friendly taxation authority.

If you see something you are interested in, communicate with the seller using either PM or email (check their APUG profile). Work out any terms that are acceptable to both of you, and proceed.

The risks involved are the same as any long distance transaction. If you are buying from someone who has been here for a while, that can give you some comfort. I've bought and sold here, and have had excellent experiences (sales as far away as UK and Australia!).

You may never have purchased long distance from an individual. If so, your concerns are understandable, but you need to know that many people transact business regularly that way, with generally good results.

And as for Craigslist, I have had excellent results (sales and purchases). Of course, it really helps to know what you are buying or selling and what the value is. In addition, due to the fact that things like moderate value used film cameras aren't exactly the most popular items, there is less likelihood of buying something that turns out to be stolen or purchased using a stolen credit card.

In your case, as you don't really know what to check for, it might be hard for you to evaluate the condition of something on Craigslist. But you could always post a link to the ad here and ask for specific advice.

And as for "brokerage" charges - $50+ isn't unusual from UPS or Fedex. If it goes via USPS and Canada Post, there is usually no "brokerage, but sometimes it is $10 (+ GST).

To me it is completely different using an established business and using a private individual that you don't know. Businesses can gather up reputations from thousands upon thousands of people and they have incentive to not scam people. That incentive is that the person being scammed could report them or make it public and their business base would be ruined.

Perhaps in time I'll warm up to using the APUG Classifieds. Especially if I start looking at more of them more closely. Thanks for the information.

I would second Mamiya C220/330, both can be found at a decent price and I think they are great cameras. They are the only TLRs that have interchangeable lenses all of which are very high quality. I've bought mine though ebay or other online sites, but they seem much cheaper that a lot of MF kit.

Yeah, they seem like swell cameras. Except that all of them I see listed on KEH are out of my price range.

I noticed the link I posted to the large format forum meter for sale is for a LunaPro, not an SBC. Here's a selection of used meters:


Stay away from the spot meters for now. Using one is not exactly difficult once you understand metering but that's for later. (I have a spot meter and consider it essential for shooting with my 4x5 camera, but never use it for medium format myself.)

Thanks again for all the info and advice. Again, I'll reply to your longer post not yet, but soon.

Buying a camera is a tricky thing. it's like buying a car, shoes, choosing a long-term (or short-term) mate. What works for me won't work for you. Or what works for me works for you, but for completely different reasons. Face it, you will not 'know' about a camera until you use it. The more cameras you use, the easier these decisions become, but even after 40 years of cameras i need to hold a camera and take it out before I 'know' about that particular camera. Decades ago my two favorite cameras were a TLR and a 35mm rangefinder. 30 years later, I am right back to these, except that the rangefinder is a 6x9 because I like medium format negatives. But no one could have convinced me that I didn't need to use a MF SLR or a 4x5 view camera or a three different 35mm SLR systems or 6 different digital cameras in the meantime. Buying and selling cameras is usually part of the process.

The TLR being sold by LyleB can be sold for what you pay him if it doesn't work out. That may sound cruel or short-sighted, but it's the reality. I bet most people here have been through a few cameras over the years. So it isn't a waste of money. Think of owning many of these cameras as simply renting them until you sell them on.

A problem for you is that $250 is not a lot to spend. Most MF cameras are old and need maintenance or repair. So even if you get a Bronica ETR series with a 50mm and 120 back, there is a decent chance that the back will develop a leak in the next year, the shutter could freeze up, etc. That's a chance with any of these cameras. So condition is very important. This is where buying from a place like KEH, a known entity or place like here where people identify with their sales, or locally, becomes helpful.

One thing I haven't heard mentioned- the reversed image of a WLF. On both TLRs and SLRs, the image will be upright but reversed. Some people, maybe most, get used to this very quickly. But it does take time, especially on the street where you often want to react but find yourself moving the wrong way or such.

You're right, what works for me may not work for you. But I explained what works for me, so naturally I'd assume you'd cater your response to that based on your experience. For example, some have stated in this thread they don't do much street, but they can still say what may work and what has worked for the little street that they happen to do.

Regardless, I am merely looking for advice and information. I am noting peoples suggestions for light meters and cameras and whatnot, but that doesn't mean I have to take said suggestions. I will take the products suggested and look into it a bit more myself. Just because someone says get a Yashica 124, doesn't mean I'll get it.

I know I will not "know" a camera until I have it in my hands and play with it a bit, but that doesn't mean I wouldn't want to "know" as much as possible about the cameras so that I can make the most informed decision for myself possible. Hence my questions.

And again, I cannot pay LyleB right now anyways for the camera advertised, I am still needing to save up. Oh, and I don't buy into the doctrine that cameras are disposable and thus just something to rent until you're bored with it. I want something that will last. A camera that, if it is a camera that suits me well, I can use still 10 years from now.

Thanks for mentioning the WLF. I had heard this about 35mm SLRs with WLF, but didn't know this was also so with medium format. That would take some getting used to.

 

[CGW]

Except I know how to use a light meter, so that search would be pointless. What I am curious of is how the handheld works, specifically how it detects light and how you know it is metering the part you actually want to have metered. I could probably do more research in this particular area, but I figured it'd be easier to just ask and on the limited research I had done, I didn't find much. If you've got URLs bookmarked that would be worthwhile for me to know about, then feel free to post 'em.

LOL. I think if you knew your way around a handheld meter you'd know how they work and what they read. Just too needy...

 

[h.v.]

Of course if I knew my way around a handheld meter I would know how they work. That's kind of the definition of "knowing my way around" something.

 

[EthanFrank]

h.v., what CGW was saying was that if you know how to use [any kind of] meter, you'd have no trouble using a [handheld] meter. I'll sum it up for you to the best of my ability, though:

A handheld reflective meter works just like the one in your camera. You point it at the object you want to meter. No need for a laser or viewfinder, as the area it measures will have a relatively large radius. By contrast, an incident meter works almost in reverse: you hold the meter in front your subject and point it towards your camera lens. This measures the light falling on the subject, rather than the light reflected off of it. This negates the need for an 18% grey card in many (if not all?) cases. A spot meter was mentioned before - this is just a really accurate reflective meter, allowing you to meter a much smaller radius.

I think that what CGW was getting at is that using a handheld meter will teach you about metering in a completely different and, in the end much more in-depth way than using an in-camera meter ever could.

To his point, though, much of the above info is pretty easy to find. I think my first source with all of this was Wikipedia, actually. Some hands-on time with a meter will teach you far more than reading every could, though. If you have a DSLR (I know, I know...), try throwing it in manual mode and metering with a handheld meter. This will let you bracket and get a feel for metering without burning through yards of film and gallons of developer.

Good luck.

 

[olleorama]

Look at youtube for using a light meter. Maybe you can find something on TLRs there too?

 

[EthanFrank]

Gotta love YouTube. I'll restate my Wikipedia suggestion, as well.

 

[h.v.]

Okay, sorry all for the late response ...

As someone said, yeah, just buy LyleB's 124G. The G is fine, the 124 might be cheaper if you see one.

I really hope this is the last time I have to mention that I don't currently have the funds for LyleB's 124G.

I don't feel like pasting all that I'd need to paste to answer these inline so:

1. Luna Pro SBC is just what I have. The Luna Pro F is the same, except it also works as a flash meter. There are many other good meters available. The earlier Luna Pro was designed for mercury cell batteries that are no longer available. There are work arounds to use them but the SBC uses a 9v battery, available anywhere. The point is to just be sure you can get batteries for your meter. The Luna Pros are very large though. Definitely a hand full, and for street shooting you might want to get something smaller. There are many on the market. Watch the classifieds here. Also as a direct answer to your question:

http://www.largeformatphotography.info/forum/showthread.php?t=84013

But as I said, that's a pretty physically large meter. Take a look at some currently available new:

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/sc_search.php?rfnp=2600&q=meters&rfnc=2609&

EDIT: Oops, that's an older LunaPro, not an SBC. My mistake.

Something like this is small and should work fine:

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/40120...cident-and-Reflective-Light-Meter?cat_id=2609

Or if you prefer digital:

http://www.freestylephoto.biz/4006-Gossen-Digisix-Light-Meter?cat_id=2609

You can get a good meter for less money used, of course.

Thanks for the suggestions, but those are really expensive. I searched "Sekonic" on KEH and looks like a lot of EX+ for $7-25. I think that may be a better option. I'll also check local stores to see what they have to offer me.

They do look strange to people who aren't photographers and most will have no idea what they are or what you are doing. But I never stick my meter in the face of someone I don't know well enough, either. Just meter something else in the same light - but it sounds like you are new enough to manually metering that this may take some practice. It's easy.

Well, I guess if the meter is small enough, many wouldn't even notice. Anyways, I usually don't even meter the person before I take their picture with my 35mm camera as that would take to long and the moment would pass. I usually just meter the sidewalk and unless there is new lighting (such as shadows being cast) that generally works. The exposure isn't always right in the middle of the camera meter, but with the high dynamic range and whatnot, it turns out completely fine. I would assume that this is no different for 120 or 220.

2. Any 124 or 124G will have a lens. The lens is not interchangeable so they don't list it separately. Likewise the WLF. It's an 80mm f/3.5, roughly equivalent to a 50mm on a 35mm camera. They also all have a WLF. That's just how they are made - it's built in. The Yashica also has a pop out magnifier that, by holding your eye close to the magnifier, gives an enlarged view of the ground glass. It also has a "sports finder" which is really just a framing aid. You can focus separately then use the sports finder to frame a shot from eye level.

Yeah the 124/124G seems like a great camera (though I have a few questions about it posted at the end). After reading a bit more about the camera, and TLRs in general, I found the Mamiya TLRs are the only one with interchangeable lenses. Odd, but I guess Yashicas and Rolleis have high quality glass anyways, so it's not some cheap Kodak or Nikon electronic zoom lens for a point and shoot. Besides, I don't think I'd need anything other than 80mm, because I love 50mm in 35mm terms. If I need wider, I can always pull out another camera.

The magnifier doesn't give a zoom effect. You can see all the way to the edge of the ground glass and the edge of your image, it just makes what you see look larger and thus easier to judge critical sharpness.

Am I right in thinking the "ground glass" is the lower of the two lenses, or the one closest to the ground? If you're doing that, then what's the point of the top/upper lens?

Download the manual if you're really interested in these cameras. It will make a lot of things more clear. The 124 and 124G also differ in how the pressure plate is set for 120 or 220 film. I have a 124 so I don't recall how the G works, but both will use both 120 and 220 film. This isn't a big thing nowadays as not much film is available in 220, though the excellent Kodak Portras ARE.

Will most definitely look at the manuals. I was excited to learn more about 220 film, only to find out there is hardly any 220 film available. Oh well.

Manual can be downloaded here for the 124:

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/yashica/yashica_mat_124/yashica_mat_124.htm

here for the 124G:

http://www.butkus.org/chinon/yashica/yashica_mat124g/yashica_mat_124g.htm

Thanks!

3. Metering - you don't "point a laser" at anything! For a reflected light reading you point the meter at the subject, or more specifically at a part of the subject you wish to render as a medium gray shade. An incident reading is taken (with a different meter or by setting a versatile meter for such) by holding the meter at the subject, pointing it at the camera, and reading the light falling on, rather than reflected off, the subject. By taking a reflected reading of a calibrated gray card (available online) you get the same reading as an incident reading and you're sure you're measuring a value that is the shade the meter is giving you an exposure for. By "metering for prevailing light" I just mean, well, just that. Meter a medium gray value, or a gray card, in the light like the subject and if the light is about the same you don't have to take another reading for each shot. I often just keep a guesstimate exposure set and "wing it" if I don't have time to meter it. This does take some practice and experience, though.

What do you mean by medium grey shade? I'm assuming it has to do with the grey card. I had been informed years ago about grey cards but they were extremely hard for me to wrap my head around. I think that had to do with trying to understand the technology and thought behind it. Anyways, if I'm remembering correctly, you take this card of grey shade out with you and you meter off that to get the best possible exposure numbers. That incident meter seems more complex and annoying, so I think I'll look out for the reflected sort.

If it's really important to have more than 12 shots (or 15 for a 645 format camera) you can get 220 film in the Portras and some Fujis (mostly aimed at those wedding photographers who still use film) with twice as much film and thus exposures on the roll. A roll of 120 is a bit cheaper, usually, than 36 exposures of 35mm but not greatly as it has nearly the same surface area coated with emulsion. You can also, as discussed here, carry an extra back, pre-loaded inserts, or just an extra camera depending on the type of camera.

Well, there is apparently a local lab that will do 220 film, so I guess 220 is an option after all. I'd just have to get the film from out of province, I think. But hopefully I can get the hang of rewinding and loading so that it isn't the hassle that it sounds like it'll be. Then I can just bring multiple 120s.

Because the Yashica Mats appear to be all in one, I wouldn't be able to bring an extra back pre-loaded with film , I suppose.

4. The reason MF has less depth of field has to do with the lenses. A normal lens for 6x6 cm, like on my Yashica, is 80mm. It will have the same DOF as an 80mm lens would on a 35mm camera but that would be a short tele on a 35mm but normal on a 6x6. A 50mm lens on a 6x6 camera like the SQ-B would have the same depth of field as a 50mm on a 35 camera, but it would be a wide angle instead of a normal, and would have less depth of field than the 28mm lens on a 35mm camera that would give about the same amount of subject in the frame.

I've bought a fair amount of stuff from KEH and never had a problem. But I think it would help you a lot to see some of this gear, if there's a local club or something where you could meet others that shoot MF.

Thanks, that makes sense.

h.v., what CGW was saying was that if you know how to use [any kind of] meter, you'd have no trouble using a [handheld] meter. I'll sum it up for you to the best of my ability, though:

A handheld reflective meter works just like the one in your camera. You point it at the object you want to meter. No need for a laser or viewfinder, as the area it measures will have a relatively large radius. By contrast, an incident meter works almost in reverse: you hold the meter in front your subject and point it towards your camera lens. This measures the light falling on the subject, rather than the light reflected off of it. This negates the need for an 18% grey card in many (if not all?) cases. A spot meter was mentioned before - this is just a really accurate reflective meter, allowing you to meter a much smaller radius.

I think that what CGW was getting at is that using a handheld meter will teach you about metering in a completely different and, in the end much more in-depth way than using an in-camera meter ever could.

To his point, though, much of the above info is pretty easy to find. I think my first source with all of this was Wikipedia, actually. Some hands-on time with a meter will teach you far more than reading every could, though. If you have a DSLR (I know, I know...), try throwing it in manual mode and metering with a handheld meter. This will let you bracket and get a feel for metering without burning through yards of film and gallons of developer.

Good luck.

Thank you for the in-depth explanation. So, if I use a reflective handheld meter, I must download that grey card and use that as well otherwise the meter would be rendered moot? As for DSLRs, I always do manual mode and manual metering (with in camera meter), same with 35mm SLRs. But I like your idea of trying the meter first with the digital to sort of learn my way around it before I start wasting film. Maybe with that in mind, I should look at buying the meter prior to the camera, because I know once I get the camera in my hands, I'd want to start using it rightaway, regardless of whether or not I've mastered my meter.

Look at youtube for using a light meter. Maybe you can find something on TLRs there too?

That's actually a brilliant idea. How did I not think of that?

----

Ok, some new stuff...

120 developing

So, I don't yet even process 35mm film, but I would eventually like to, probably in the coming months. I would probably like to do this as well with 120. Based on what I've read, it seems like the development process is similar, it's just that you need to use more chemicals per roll and that it's much trickier to reel off the roll of film. So my question is this: is it really that tricky? Is it something you get the hang of quickly?

The Yashica Mat 124/124G

So I read the 124G only has shutter speeds between 1 and 1/500. How do you guys make do with such limiting shutter speeds? 1/500th a second is surely not fast enough for getting big apertures when it's sunny outside. And I'd rather not forceably limit myself to shaded areas or overcast days, so is there still good depth of field at f/8 or higher? It's pretty medicore when used on my current systems. Even f/3.5 isn't really that great. I usually like f/2.8 or lower, but when it's sunny out I don't mind going up to f/5.6 or so.

Anyways, I think the 124G is my top choice currently, followed by the Minolta Autocord.

Thanks, everybody.

 

[agfarapid]

Am I right in thinking the "ground glass" is the lower of the two lenses, or the one closest to the ground? If you're doing that, then what's the point of the top/upper lens?

In any twin lens reflex, the top lens is the one you actually see through. The bottom lens is the one that takes the picture. Look at a close up picture of any Mamiya twin lens and notice that the shutter and aperture ring is on the bottom or "taking" lens. The film is positioned directly behind the taking lens. There is a stationary mirror in the body of the camera positioned behind the "viewing" lens. Both the taking and the viewing lens will focus together at the film plane. The mirror mentioned above is stationary, unlike the mirror in any slr which moves out of the way to allow the film to be exposed. Light entering through the viewing lens (remember--there is no shutter or iris aperature blocking the light path) bounces of the stationary mirror and is reflected upward to the ground glass of the waist level finder. If you have the opportunity, try holding and looking at any brand of tlr; this will give you a much better idea of how this thing works. In your previous post you asked "how do you know that you've taken a picture" since there is no moving mirror and consequently no mirror blackout. Quite simply, you listen to the sound of your shutter going off. Theoretically, with far fewer moving parts, the time lag from pressing the shutter release to exposing the film should be far shorter than with any slr which has to raise up the mirror, stop down the aperture from it's natural wide open viewing and open the shutter before the film is exposed. In the tlr or rangefinder for that matter, you press the shutter release, the leaf shutter opens, the film is exposed and the shutter closes--that's it. Hope this helps in your decision making process.

 

[DWThomas]

One thing I don't think I saw mentioned (although there is a lot of text here!) is that the MF SLRs tend to be noisy because of all the mirror mechanism and size. I have a Bronica SQ-A and it sounds like a gunshot being fired compared with the little click out of my Yashica 124G. I have never used a Hasselblad or the Mamiya RB67, etc, so I can't compare to those. Not to be too negative, but I'd say your budget is a bit thin for medium format. With patience you can probably get something for that, but it may be a little more worn out. Many of these cameras are 20 to 30 years (or more) old, and were often used by commercial photographers, so they could suffer a bit in that process. In the Bronica SQ series, for reasons I have yet to understand, a body can often be had for less money than a WLF.

I agree with the other comments about the virtual invisibility of TLRs -- maybe they're associated with grandparents or elderly uncles -- or maybe folks don't understand where they are pointed. I don't really do serious street shooting, but on the few occasions out in public where anyone has noted my Yashica, it was taken as an opportunity to reminisce about the good old days.

DaveT

 

[h.v.]

I should probably mention that I think I'm going to focus on a TLR vs MF SLR. Aside from the Bronica, they seem rather clunky and expensive. The Yashicas and Autocords I've seen are within my price range and still in good working condition, plus the TLRs just seem so neat and better suited for street photography. Based on the photos I've seen, both the 124G and Autocord have great image quality, even though I don't recall ever seeing either used by pros or for high art stuff (always Rollei if it's a TLR, it seems).

Agfarapid: Yeah, that's how I read TLRs worked. So what is this "ground glass" thing? I kind of assumed that you could hear a quiet leaf shutter clicking with a TLR to know you have taken a picture. I was just kind of stating it based on my background. I'm used to the screen blacking out, so if a camera isn't doing that then I'm immediately thinking, well then how on earth do you know if you've taken a picture? Obviously, you can tell by pushing the shutter and then the click of the shutter.

 

[Dan Daniel]

Get an Autocord. Send it to Karl Bryan who will overhaul it, clean it up, get it working smoothly. And then go shoot for the next ten years or so. For real fun, scab a Hasselblad NC-2 prism on top. This shows a Yahsica-Mat with the prism, but the prism is now on an Autocord. The lever focusing on the Autocord is very quick and responsive, and the prism gives a corrected view-



The first 36 of the first group and all of the second group were shot with this setup-
http://dandaniel.zenfolio.com/p92646000
http://dandaniel.zenfolio.com/p311823083

A shutter release has a feel. A good release will have a bit of loose travel, a bit of resistance, and at some consistent point the shutter fires. After you use a camera a bit, you get a handle on just where the actual release moment is in the travel, what it feels like, etc. Both TLR and rangefinder cameras have no mirror black-out. Neither do view cameras. Or Brownies and folders. And most Polaroids.

 

[lxdude]

So what is this "ground glass" thing?

The ground glass is the focusing screen-the translucent matte surface upon which appears the image you look at while focusing, framing and composing.

 

[Dan Daniel]

Part 1 of the following might be helpful. Ignore the second cut-away image's second lower eyeball; the lower viewing system is exclusive to Rolleiflex-
http://www.butkus.org/chinon/rollei/automatic_rolleiflex/rolleiflex_automatic.htm

 

[h.v.]

Thanks Dan and lxdude, really appreciate any and all help.

I still have to read a bit more about the Minolta Autocord but from what I've read, it does sound like a cool camera, hence it being my 2nd choice currently. I don't like the idea of buying an Autocord and then sending it to Mr. Bryan for it to be perfected. The result may be awesome, but this just seems very time consuming and complicated (especially when I keep hearing about how simple loading/rewinding is more of a pain). This may be rather lofty, but I kinda want it to just work properly and be in a good condition so that it'll last right out of the box, like my 35mm cameras.

I'll read more into it, but I'd still love to hear people's experiences with Yashica's really limited shutter speeds that I was talking about earlier. 1/500th just isn't fast enough for low f-stops in sunny light. Hell, 1/4000th is hardly enough for f/5.6 (which I would barely consider low f-stop). I'm guessing this is similar with all TLRs, but I will research specifically for models such as the Autocord. Oh, and there's the 120 developing.

Anyways, thanks again for the info and links. That butkus one looks like it'll be informative, I'll get to reading it shortly.

 

[agfarapid]

1/500th just isn't fast enough for low f-stops in sunny light. Hell, 1/4000th is hardly enough for f/5.6 (which I would barely consider low f-stop).

If you are coming in from the digital world, shutter speeds of 1/8,000s and ISO's to 4000, shutter speeds of 1/500 sec. and max ISO of 400 might seem very limiting. However in the days of film, your max ISO was usually 400, coupled with apertures down to f64 so it was and is fairly easy to accommodate bright sun on the beach (just don't bring Delta 3200 !). I've been shooting M/F for quite a few years and I can't remember when last I had an exposure problem like that.

 

[h.v.]

I've never used 1/8000th a second before. Both my 35mm SLR and DSLR go up to 1/4000th. On film, I've yet to go above ISO 400, but I didn't know you couldn't do ISO 800 on a TLR, thanks. I always assumed you can always bump up the f stop to a smaller aperture like f/11 or f/22 or f/64 or what have you, as you say, but I like shallow depth of field, so unless things are really different with a TLR, I'm not going to get that above f/7.1. Maybe I would just need to get used to less shallow depth of field.

 

[ColdEye]

Iso 400 speed film with a max shutter speed of 1/500 is not that limiting at least for me. You can always rate it to 200 and change your dev times accordingly. Dont be afraid to use f8 or f11.

 

[ColdEye]

Get an Autocord. Send it to Karl Bryan who will overhaul it, clean it up, get it working smoothly. And then go shoot for the next ten years or so. For real fun, scab a Hasselblad NC-2 prism on top. This shows a Yahsica-Mat with the prism, but the prism is now on an Autocord. The lever focusing on the Autocord is very quick and responsive, and the prism gives a corrected view-

The first 36 of the first group and all of the second group were shot with this setup-
http://dandaniel.zenfolio.com/p92646000
http://dandaniel.zenfolio.com/p311823083

A shutter release has a feel. A good release will have a bit of loose travel, a bit of resistance, and at some consistent point the shutter fires. After you use a camera a bit, you get a handle on just where the actual release moment is in the travel, what it feels like, etc. Both TLR and rangefinder cameras have no mirror black-out. Neither do view cameras. Or Brownies and folders. And most Polaroids.

Wow, can I also put a prism on a Yashica D??

 

[MattKing]

h.v.:

More and more I think you need to find someone who can actually show you a medium format camera in action, because with even a little bit of hands-on context, I think almost all of the answers to your questions would be obvious to you.

I bet 15 minutes would do it.

 

[Roger Cole]

You hadn't said so much about not being able to afford the advertised 124G at the time I posted.

The shutter speeds I've never found limiting. In practice I carry several rolls of film of different speeds. With medium speed 100-125 film the 1/500th maximum can get you wide apertures in all but the brightest light. Black and white film is fine to expose at one stop slower than box speed and color neg. even more so. You can go slower with something like Pan F if you want. It's never really a problem. Remember too you only have 12 shots on a roll so it's less limiting to shoot an entire roll in given light and then load the next roll for whatever light you face then.

You aren't limited to ISO 400, that's just the max. speed the internal meter can meter for. You can set it to 400, meter, then set one less stop exposure for 800, two stops for 1600 etc. (Or if you need 640 set it to 320 and set one stop less etc.) plus the calculators on hand held meters usually cover a wide range of effective film speeds. I routinely shoot Delta 3200 at 3200 in my Yashica, metering with my hand held meter.

And what Matt said: You need to see some of this stuff IRL, and you also need to read some. If you were interested in large format I could recommend books, but I don't know of any "intro to medium format" books, and even less so for those coming from digital.

 

[h.v.]

I know that ISO 400 is just the max. because that's what agfarapid said. Also I'm not "coming from digital," I'm "coming from 35mm." I've said that I have a DSLR and do shoot digital, as I'm sure many do, but it's not like that's all I do and on a film forum I would think I would be considered a 35mm shooter, not a digital shooter, just like it says in my description. I agree, however, that looking at one of these and playing with it in real life would be a big help. Unfortunately, I know of no such place or person that I could do that at/with. The only place I've seen a TLR locally is behind glass, preserved in a museum-esque state at a local camera shop, and that's just Rollei and Ricoh, not Yashica and Minolta.

 

[lesm]

h.v.:

More and more I think you need to find someone who can actually show you a medium format camera in action, because with even a little bit of hands-on context, I think almost all of the answers to your questions would be obvious to you.

I bet 15 minutes would do it.

This is sage advice. When you're entering a new field like this it's very easy to get too much information, ask too many questions and end up thrashing around with no satisfactory outcome. To be honest, when you talk about wanting a perfect MF camera which you won't need to get serviced for 10 years but you only have a tiny budget it seems to me you're headed for disappointment. You might get lucky, but any of the experienced members here will tell you that's unlikely. Before you spend any money at all, I'd strongly urge you to follow Matt's advice. Look for a camera club, make friends at your local art school, talk to an art teacher from your local high school, ask at your local camera store, just do whatever it takes to find someone to help you with some hands-on experience. And if you have a decent library, ask them to get you some books on interloan, such as Michael Freeman's "Cameras and Lenses," which has a ton of information and lots of illustrations. Librarians are knowledgeable and usually really willing to help.