Advice Needed: Modifying 620 Kodak Vigilant for 120 film

[tnp651]

I have a Vigilant Six-20 in great shape but even cutting and sanding my 120 film it's awfully stiff. It seems possible to take out the film cradle that holds the unexposed film by removing three rivets. Has anyone done this and what do you think of the plan?
Tom Nelson

 

[Donald Qualls]

I have a pseudo-TLR (Ansco 75?) that I've done that kind of mod with. It works very well with some cameras, but you will usually still need a 620 spool for takeup (because of space, and the inside key in a 620 camera won't reliably engage a 120 spool).

In your case, with rivets that need to be drilled out, I'd want to be sure where the inside ends of those rivets will wind up. You'll also need to add something to replace the function of that spring leaf, intended to keep slight tension on the film (keeps the film flat in the focal plane, and avoids fat rolls and associated light leaks).

 

[tnp651]

Thanks, Donald. I also worry about taking out the roller. The film would drag across the lip of the film gate.

 

[Donald Qualls]

Ah. I didn't notice that the roller was part of the caddy. The one I've taken out also hinged out to ease inserting the roll and removing the empty spool. Looks like your best bet might be laying in a supply of 620 spools and getting good at respooling, followed by buying the 620 from Film Photography Project or B&H (they respool for you, onto new plastic 620 spools).

 

[tnp651]

I'm considering taking the part out and making a wider version from sheet aluminum. The film well is wide enough for 120 spools but the insert crimps it in. I'd still need to trim the lip of each spool, but that's easy to do. BTW the rivets attach to a flat spring in the film well; I should be able to retrieve the cut-off rivets.

 

[Sirius Glass]

Get 620 spools to use as take up reels and be careful to save the reels when you develop film to reuse the 620 reel as a take up reel.

 

[Donald Qualls]

I'm considering taking the part out and making a wider version from sheet aluminum. The film well is wide enough for 120 spools but the insert crimps it in. I'd still need to trim the lip of each spool, but that's easy to do. BTW the rivets attach to a flat spring in the film well; I should be able to retrieve the cut-off rivets.

I've used a piece of brass rod (hobby brass from a model airplane shop) to fabricate a replacement for a missing roller some years ago (I did have a small lathe, which simplified the job a great deal). You'll probably need to do something similar, since the extra length to hold a 120 spool will keep the old roller from fitting correctly. Either that, or you'll need to bend in the roller support ears, which may be a problem with clearing the 120 spool flanges.

 

[Denverdad]

I'm considering taking the part out and making a wider version from sheet aluminum. The film well is wide enough for 120 spools but the insert crimps it in. I'd still need to trim the lip of each spool, but that's easy to do. BTW the rivets attach to a flat spring in the film well; I should be able to retrieve the cut-off rivets.

If only I had read your post earlier - my Kodak Monitor that has the same film cradle assembly as your Vigilent, and I too discovered that the rivets only hold on the spring plate on the back (the carrier is not riveted to the camera body). I was lucky though as I accidentally found I could apply persuasion in the just the right way and the whole assembly to just popped out of the camera, with the spring plate still attached. Anyway, here's a picture of both cradles from my Monitor for reference, with the right one showing how the spring plate is attached:


If you're handy with sheet metal fabrication, I think your idea of making up a new cradle might prove to be practical. I'm considering something like that myself. You should be able to re-use the roller - I'm thinking holes or slots in your fabricated piece should enable you to pop it in just like the old one. Heck, now that the spring piece is removed you could even consider attaching this to the new part so as well so it has the same flex to it as the old one.

Jeff

 

[tnp651]

If only I had read your post earlier - my Kodak Monitor that has the same film cradle assembly as your Vigilent, and I too discovered that the rivets only hold on the spring plate on the back (the carrier is not riveted to the camera body). I was lucky though as I accidentally found I could apply persuasion in the just the right way and the whole assembly to just popped out of the camera, with the spring plate still attached. Anyway, here's a picture of both cradles from my Monitor for reference, with the right one showing how the spring plate is attached:
View attachment 271237

If you're handy with sheet metal fabrication, I think your idea of making up a new cradle might prove to be practical. I'm considering something like that myself. You should be able to re-use the roller - I'm thinking holes or slots in your fabricated piece should enable you to pop it in just like the old one. Heck, now that the spring piece is removed you could even consider attaching this to the new part so as well so it has the same flex to it as the old one.

Jeff

Thanks a bunch, Jeff, you may have hit on the solution.
Tom