Advice needed: Building a DIY camera for in-camera Anthotypes and Cyanotypes (A6)

[Chreger]

Hi everyone


For my final school project I am building a large format camera from scratch. I want to keep the process as organic and low tech as possible.


The Concept:


I plan to do in-camera exposures using Anthotypes (plant based) and Cyanotypes. I am aware of the extremely long exposure times but I want to embrace that slowness as part of the art. The target image size is roughly A6. I intend to use a simple magnifying glass as a lens to achieve a soft vintage aesthetic. A leather bellows is a central part of my design for both its iconic look and functionality.


My Challenge:


I have a strong vision but very little experience in camera mechanics. I am at the very beginning of the technical design regarding focusing light proofing and the tripod mount.


Do you have any tips for a beginner? What are the biggest donts when building a bellows for the first time? How would you handle focusing with a simple magnifying lens on A6 paper?


Any advice on materials or construction would be greatly appreciated.


Best regards

 

[koraks]

Welcome to Photrio @Chreger!

You say you're aware of the slow exposures, but keep in mind that with anthotypes, you're looking at exposures that can easily reach several days or weeks in a contact printing frame. Through a lens, this would take much longer, still - which means the exposures may not actually finish at all. Cyanotype is a little more feasible.

For your first attempt I'd suggest to construct a simple cardboard box, or actually two boxes that slide into each other, so you can focus it (to an extent) without having to construct a bellows. This can serve as a proof of concept and give useful input for the real camera you could build next.

How would you handle focusing with a simple magnifying lens on A6 paper?

Simply put: not. You need a ground glass of some sort, but you can substitute a piece of transparent plastic that you roughen up with e.g. sandpaper.

 

[tezzasmall]

For your first attempt I'd suggest to construct a simple cardboard box, or actually two boxes that slide into each other, so you can focus it (to an extent) without having to construct a bellows. This can serve as a proof of concept and give useful input for the real camera you could build next.

I agree with Korak's points made, and the sliding box idea is one that I've done in the past. The box along with a home-made pinhole at the front would give you a simple camera. Then using some darkroom photo paper, you can produce a working negative to invert either in PS or a darkroom with another sheet of paper.

It's good that you are pushing yourself with the two processes that you mention, but as Korak said, VERY LONG exposures would be needed and probably aren't actually practical. I'd do the above pinhole experiment and THEN try a cyanotype exposure if you still want to. It's an interesting idea that I've thought about doing as well, so it would be great to hear and see your result if you or someone else beats me to it!

Terry S
UK

 

[koraks]

@tezzasmall's suggestion of trying paper negatives is a great idea, really! Coincidentally, 10x15cm is a popular paper format (e.g. Fomaspeed) which is close to A6, so it would be a nice size to aim for.

Btw, anthotypes came up recently: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/how-to-protect-for-life-plant-based-alternative-prints.219542
@fgorga and @cliveh responded based on their hands-on experience with the medium. @cliveh also echoed what I said about exposures - i.e. days, for a regular contact-printed anthotype. I've done anthotypes that took up to several weeks to exposure, but as I recall this was not in summer.

 

[Chromium VI]

Hi everyone


For my final school project I am building a large format camera from scratch. I want to keep the process as organic and low tech as possible.


The Concept:


I plan to do in-camera exposures using Anthotypes (plant based) and Cyanotypes. I am aware of the extremely long exposure times but I want to embrace that slowness as part of the art. The target image size is roughly A6. I intend to use a simple magnifying glass as a lens to achieve a soft vintage aesthetic. A leather bellows is a central part of my design for both its iconic look and functionality.


My Challenge:


I have a strong vision but very little experience in camera mechanics. I am at the very beginning of the technical design regarding focusing light proofing and the tripod mount.


Do you have any tips for a beginner? What are the biggest donts when building a bellows for the first time? How would you handle focusing with a simple magnifying lens on A6 paper?


Any advice on materials or construction would be greatly appreciated.


Best regards

You can also try Physautypes (based on plant resigns), I did a few experiments and it works with quite fast exposure times (30min-1h)

 

[fgorga]

@tezzasmall's suggestion of trying paper negatives is a great idea, really! Coincidentally, 10x15cm is a popular paper format (e.g. Fomaspeed) which is close to A6, so it would be a nice size to aim for.

Btw, anthotypes came up recently: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/how-to-protect-for-life-plant-based-alternative-prints.219542
@fgorga and @cliveh responded based on their hands-on experience with the medium. @cliveh also echoed what I said about exposures - i.e. days, for a regular contact-printed anthotype. I've done anthotypes that took up to several weeks to exposure, but as I recall this was not in summer.

The fastest material I have found for anthotypes is paprika extracted into iso-propanol (rubbing alcohol). Exposures are still a couple of hours under direct summer sun in a typical contact printing frame. (If my memory serves, I can't find my notes on this process... arrgh!)

Turmeric is less sensitive than paprika... exposures take most of a day.

Paprika anthotypes are unstable even if stored dark, so they must be scanned if you want them to last.

Turmeric anthotypes, 'fixed' with a alkali (sodium carbonate, sodium bicarbonate or borax; all of which give slightly different results) are very stable.

For most other plant extracts use for anthotypes (see, for example, https://www.alternativephotography.com/anthotypes-anthotype-process/) photograms are, as mentioned above, exposed for days, weeks or even months!

That said, here is a report on one person's experience making an in camera anthotype... https://www.alternativephotography.com/in-camera-anthotypes/

Additionally, there is one other variation of anthotype that is reported to need only 15-20 minutes of exposure to make a photogram, see: https://www.alternativephotography.com/negative-anthotypes-fast-exposure-aloe/.

I have not had direct experience with either of the last two of these ideas so I can't vouch for the reliability of these reports.

 

[fgorga]

You can also try Physautypes (based on plant resigns), I did a few experiments and it works with quite fast exposure times (30min-1h)

Any references/links to "Physautypes"? (Google does not give any relevant information.)

Also, I imagine that you meant "plant resins" and not "plant resigns", is this correct?

Thanks.

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

If you are on Facebook, you may want to check the design and instructions given by Rene Smets on bellows making.

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

Any references/links to "Physautypes"? (Google does not give any relevant information.)

Also, I imagine that you meant "plant resins" and not "plant resigns", is this correct?

Thanks.

Physautotype - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

The physautotype process – AlternativePhotography.com

www.alternativephotography.com

 

[NedL]

A simple tripod support for box or can cameras is here: https://www.photrio.com/forum/threads/join-“worldwide-pinhole-photography-day-2016”-april-24th-and-show-us-your-results.135153/post-1786650

That idea originally came from Joe Van Cleave.

It's easier to make a fixed focus camera. You can set it for infinity or close to it, aiming at a distant streetlamp or bright light helps set this focus. Or you can set it a fixed distance in front of the camera. If you set it a fixed distance in front of the camera, you can attach a string that reaches to just that distance and use that to set the focus when using the camera. To make the fixed focus camera, there are a couple of easy ways to adjust it and get the focus right: if the top is removable, then you can just put a piece of white paper in there and look at the projection as you adjust the distance from the lens to the paper. A decent sized magnifying glass will easily make a bright enough projection for you to set the focus this way ( I've done it, it's not hard! ) If the camera design makes it so that you must look through the back, scotch tape on glass works fine for a quick "ground glass" just to set the lens in place.. then close the back with something light proof. Dollar store picture frames are an inexpensive source of glass for this.

If you decide to use a bellows or sliding box for focusing, then you need a way to check the focus ( a ground glass ) and a way to lightproof the camera after it's in focus. That makes the camera design more difficult with more things that can leak light. If you make a sliding box, that stick-on felt can help reduce light leaks in the sliding section. Also the fluffy side of stick-on velcro around the edges can help.

I've made a lot of simple box cameras that are used "1 shot". Put the photo paper or cyanotype or anthotype or whatever inside, make the exposure, then open the box in a dark/dim room to change the paper. The most difficult part of a homemade camera is the film holder part for changing the paper and keeping the exposed paper in the dark. Especially with pinhole, I think it's easier to just make a few simple 1-shot cameras rather than solve that problem. Especially since your exposures will be long, it's a good simplification. Black mat board and black duct tape are good construction materials and the mat board is stiff enough that the cameras last ( I still have and use a few that I made 10 or 15 years ago ). If you have trouble with light leaks, that thin aluminum foil tape is great for sealing and blocking light ( put on the outside of the camera! ).

If you look a few posts above that link I gave, you can see the tripod "platform" in action with some different sized boxes, a "pihnolaroid" instant film pinhole camera, and a can. I've used it with fixed-focus lens box cameras and sliding box cameras too. Handy!

Have fun!

 

[Chromium VI]

Any references/links to "Physautypes"? (Google does not give any relevant information.)

Also, I imagine that you meant "plant resins" and not "plant resigns", is this correct?

Thanks.

I was confident that google still likes us Photographer and would give proper results... My references where the same that Raghu Kuvempunagar gave above.
I used in my experiments Pine Tree resin prom the hardware store, I am still to try the lavender oil... It contact prints in around 1/2 hour and exposes in camera around 8h in the sun. Use 96-100% ethanol, "blue alcohol" (methylated) also works but it's not clean working and not as homogeneous results

 

[koraks]

Huh, that's nice. I have violin rosin here, I'm sure I have a broken piece somewhere as well. Also, pine resin is pretty easy to collect around here; lots of pines around. Would be kind of cool to be able to make a print using self-collected pine resin.

 

[Chromium VI]

Huh, that's nice. I have violin rosin here, I'm sure I have a broken piece somewhere as well. Also, pine resin is pretty easy to collect around here; lots of pines around. Would be kind of cool to be able to make a print using self-collected pine resin.

That will be very nice. I guess that other resins will also work very well. A good way to melt the resin is with soda can upside down. Cut the side of the can and put a candle inside, then use the concave bottom of the can to melt the resin.

 

[koraks]

Melting violin rosin is easy; we always used to do it in a conventional oven.

 

[Chreger]

Hi everyone


I am honestly overwhelmed by the support. Thank you @tezzasmall @koraks , @fgorga , @Chromium VI , @Raghu Kuvempunagar and @NedL for taking so much time to help me with my project. This thread has become a goldmine for my research.


The suggestion from @koraks and @tezzasmall to start with a simple cardboard box as a proof of concept is very smart. I will do that to test the mechanics before I start working with the final wood and leather materials.


The mention of Physautotypes by @Chromium VI is a huge breakthrough for me. One of my main research questions is how to handle the extremely long exposure times of alternative processes in camera. Using pine resin or violin rosin seems to be a perfect answer to that problem.


One last technical question for my thesis: Since I will be using the resins @Chromium VI mentioned, does anyone have a tip on how to get the most even coating on the paper? I want to avoid the layer becoming too brittle or sticky for the A6 holder. Also, if you have any advice on how to judge the exposure time without opening the camera, that would be great.


I will give every one of you full credits in my final work as your expertise is helping me immensely. Once the camera is finished and I have the first results, I will share them here with you.


Best regards

 

[Sirius Glass]

Welcome to Photrio!

 

[koraks]

Oh, one more piece of advice....have loads of fun!!

 

[cliveh]

You don't need a camera to make Anthotypes or Cyanotypes.

 

[mzjo]

Sorry that I am coming a bit late to the party; I read the thread a while ago but forgot to look where it was on the site.
Having done a couple of cardboard box pinhole cameras I would advise looking at attaching them firmly to whatever support you use. Mine used (still use until I fix up something better) a pair of rubber bungees around a simple platform fixed to a tripod.I think that even in a light breeze the camera is going to move enough to blur the image a bit. I appreciate that the cardboard box stage is only testing concepts but nicer if the results reflect the concept as closely as possible. If you are in the USA finding a 1/4"UNC nut to make a tripod fixing (if you go that way) shouldn't be too difficult (asking for one in central France is a different matter; fortunately I have a tap that works!).
https://standardcameras.com/pages/how-to-make-a-bellows is the Standard Cameras manual for making a bellows for one of their 5X4 camera kits. I don't know how it compares to the other resource upstream - you would need to adapt the measurements to your size of camera for example - but it looks fairly comprehensive (caveat, I have never built a bellows).
I would agree with NedL that using several identical cardboard boxes for pinhole cameras is easier than using one and also cheaper than finding filmholders. I used a filmholder for mine because I wanted it (them) for Pinhole Day and taking more than one shot before stripping the camera was better.

Since reading this thread I am wondering if it would be possible to make a helical focussing mount out of some plastic waste pipe fittings (the little screwed inspection covers for example) but that's not relevant to your project.

Cheers Jo

 

[Chromium VI]

One last technical question for my thesis: Since I will be using the resins @Chromium VI mentioned, does anyone have a tip on how to get the most even coating on the paper? I want to avoid the layer becoming too brittle or sticky for the A6 holder. Also, if you have any advice on how to judge the exposure time without opening the camera, that would be great.

You don't. For Physautotypes you need glass or silver/gold or chrome plated metal w/mirror finish (aluminum polished to mirror works but quickly oxidizes and loses the shine and image). The image is formed by very small particles of resin (almost like aquatint grain) on the surface of the glass/metal. With glass, the image is visible with black card-stock or back velvet behind (almost like acollodion ambrotype). Paper doesn't work for two reasons: 1. The resin gets soaked on the fibers and the turpentine/white spirit (I personally prefer pure kerosene) fumes are unable to melt it. 2. The resin particles are virtually invisible, but on reflective/transparent surfaces they scatter light (seeming white). A good option for support is also black acrylic or obsidian glass.