ADOX Film.... Manufacturing, Shipping?

JWMster · Mar 23, 2021

I'm aware shipping is a mess at the moment. I'm also aware our film manufacturers continue to find operation a challenge. Doesn't seem to be any NEW stock of ADOX in virtually a single format here in the States. Hard as it is to top Ilford's FP4, I'd love to try a box of 4X5. Any insight into availability for US customers?

Sal Santamaura · Mar 23, 2021

Looks like around April 2:

https://www.freestylephoto.biz/127145-Adox-CHS-100-II-ISO-100-4x5-25-Sheets

Team ADOX · Mar 24, 2021

JWMster said:
I'm aware shipping is a mess at the moment. I'm also aware our film manufacturers continue to find operation a challenge. Doesn't seem to be any NEW stock of ADOX in virtually a single format here in the States. Hard as it is to top Ilford's FP4, I'd love to try a box of 4X5. Any insight into availability for US customers?

One shipment is currently on the way to Freestyle. And Freestyle has just placed another order, so another shipment will start soon here in Germany to the US.
Please have a bit patience.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.

THE BEST THINGS IN LIFE ARE ANALOG.

JWMster · Mar 24, 2021

Thank you for the update. As an outsider in the USA, news on Adox is hard to come by, and I don't find your website easy to filter through to determine which of your product lines are historic and which are currently in production, and in which formats for which markets (USA). Perhaps the only REAL way is to follow this is through B&H and Freestyle? Much as I understand that websites can be annoying to keep up-to-date, should I suppose a better place to follow developments at ADOX lies in your FACEBOOK page?

pentaxuser · Mar 24, 2021

Adox how additionally affected are you by the latest lockdown in Germany?

Thanks

pentaxuser

Sal Santamaura · Mar 24, 2021

pentaxuser said:
Adox how additionally affected are you by the latest lockdown in Germany?...

What lockdown?

https://www.dw.com/en/covid-angela-merkel-backtracks-on-easter-lockdown-after-uproar/a-56969820

AgX · Mar 24, 2021

JWMster said:
Much as I understand that websites can be annoying to keep up-to-date, should I suppose a better place to follow developments at ADOX lies in your FACEBOOK page?

Facebook is not continuously, if at all, open to non-members. Better to use a well-made own site.

Mirko once promised to put all news published on Facebook also on his own site.

JWMster · Mar 24, 2021

AgX: Agreed (and I'm "on" FB, but without a page these days) and I don't particularly like FB, but given that some can't maintain websites, FB is what they have. I'm there ONLY to follow companies and podcasts where this is their only web presence.

Team ADOX · Mar 24, 2021

JWMster said:
Thank you for the update. As an outsider in the USA, news on Adox is hard to come by, and I don't find your website easy to filter through to determine which of your product lines are historic and which are currently in production,

Generally all our products which are in production are listed on our homepage. There is only one "historic" film still presented on the homepage - ADOX Color Implosion - but this film is there clearly marked as discontinued.
When we have certain production interruptions, as for example with MCC/MCP, it is also explained on the homepage, either on the product page, and / or in the "News" section.
As we want new products to be as fast as possible in the hands of our customers, sometimes (but it is seldom) the product info is a bit earlier on the FOTOIMPEX page (our main global distributor) than on the ADOX homepage.

JWMster said:
....and in which formats for which markets (USA)

In general we don't have any regional market restrictions for certain products. We sell all products worldwide, directly to customers and to regional / local distributors. But of course distributors are completely free in their decisions which of our products they want to order and offer to their customers.
If you see only a part of our full line offered by your local distributor, then it is because of the distributor's business decision, and not because ADOX has regional restrictions.

JWMster said:
Perhaps the only REAL way is to follow this is through B&H and Freestyle?

Well, not really, as they don't offer our complete product programme. We have often made the experience that US customers are unaware of lots of film (related) products which are produced, but the US customers think that such products do not exist as "they are not offered by B&H or Freestyle".

JWMster said:
Much as I understand that websites can be annoying to keep up-to-date, should I suppose a better place to follow developments at ADOX lies in your FACEBOOK page?

The best is to follow the
- ADOX homepage and FOTOIMPEX shop page
- and news about new products are additionally announced also on the ADOX facebook and instagram page, here in the ADOX partner forum on photrio, and on the German FOTOIMPEX forum.

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.

THE BEST THINGS IN LIFE ARE ANALOG.

pentaxuser · Mar 24, 2021

Sal Santamaura said:
What lockdown?

https://www.dw.com/en/covid-angela-merkel-backtracks-on-easter-lockdown-after-uproar/a-56969820

Well Mirko has yet to answer and he may be the only person on Photrio in a position to say definitively how it will affect Adox , I got the impression that what Mrs Merkel has backed down on is the Easter break period. Other than that my impression was that Germany was experiencing a rise in Covid infections and what lockdown measures there are will at least continue if not get more restrictive

pentaxuser

Sal Santamaura · Apr 9, 2021

Sal Santamaura said:
Looks like around April 2:

https://www.freestylephoto.biz/127145-Adox-CHS-100-II-ISO-100-4x5-25-Sheets

In stock as of this morning. I just ordered some 5x7.

m00dawg · Apr 9, 2021

JWMster said:
I'm aware shipping is a mess at the moment. I'm also aware our film manufacturers continue to find operation a challenge. Doesn't seem to be any NEW stock of ADOX in virtually a single format here in the States. Hard as it is to top Ilford's FP4, I'd love to try a box of 4X5. Any insight into availability for US customers?

Referring to a box of CHS ii perhaps (you can also get CMS in sheets)? CHS ii is my current favorite sheet film, it's beautiful! Here's a recent example I took last weekend:

I feel like the color separation they mention is indeed pretty spot on. The above is a print so I did some stuff in the darkroom but the original negative is quite gorgeous as well. I can say I definitely recommend trying it out. Of note, if you don't mind a rather long wait, you can order it from FotoImpex directly and, as long as you order enough stuff, it can be cheaper than ordering it stateside. Be prepared for a long wait though, that's the trade-off.

Nodda Duma · Apr 9, 2021

When I ordered my boxes of CHS 100 II, I ordered from Fotoimpex. And I agree it’s a beautiful film.

I do want to ask them if whole plate format sized sheets are available.

Sal Santamaura · Apr 9, 2021

Nodda Duma said:
...I do want to ask them if whole plate format sized sheets are available.

I've toyed with asking that question, but hesitated due to an assumption that there would be some minimum quantity required for ADOX to say "yes." Initially with Ilford, the box size was a stumbling block, and ADOX might have the same issue.

In case Team ADOX reads this and wants to offer the new sheet size anyway, here's 2007 size information I used from Ilford and (indirectly) Kodak when working with Lotus to establish the modern de facto "standard" for whole plate holders:

From Ilford's cutting room manager:

Short dimension: 162.7mm to 164.3mm

Long dimension: 213.0mm to 214.6mm

From J&C, referring to Kodak TMY:

Short dimension: 163.1mm to 164.1mm

Long dimension: 212.9mm to 214.9mm

Chamonix holders are duplicates of the Lotus sample I sent their shop as a pattern. Any CHS 100 II that ADOX cuts within those tolerances should be a perfect match for modern (and usable in most vintage) whole plate holders.

m00dawg · Apr 9, 2021

Nodda Duma said:
When I ordered my boxes of CHS 100 II, I ordered from Fotoimpex. And I agree it’s a beautiful film.

I do want to ask them if whole plate format sized sheets are available.

Heya you're over here too! Of note, I _ALMOST_ shot one of your glass plates the day I took that! I decided to keep just in case fog rolled in the next day, which I thought would be well emphasized by the blue sensitive plates (though there both wasn't any fog that morning and we went home that evening). Won't be my last time up there thought and hope to capture that on a J Lane plate!

Nodda Duma · Apr 10, 2021

Yep. I ordered when they first announced availability. Took about two weeks to come over, which wasn’t bad at all.

urnem57 · Apr 19, 2021

Is Freestyle the only place in The USA to buy 4c5 CHS 100 II? I have checked most of the others that I know (B&H, Adorama, etc.) There must be others, I hope.

JWMster · Apr 19, 2021

Just got 4 boxes of 4X5 yesterday from Freestyle. Can't wait to give it whirl.
To answer urnem57's question... with another question: "I wonder why ADOX doesn't offer 100 sheet boxes like Ilford's FP4 and HP5 in 4X5? Cut the packaging cost and would likely make the US cost flat with the competition." Just saying.

m00dawg · Apr 19, 2021

urnem57 said:
Is Freestyle the only place in The USA to buy 4c5 CHS 100 II? I have checked most of the others that I know (B&H, Adorama, etc.) There must be others, I hope.

As far as I'm aware, Freestyle is the official distributor of Adox products so that's the place to go. You can also order direct from fotoimpex.com. That's Adox and, if you order enough, it can be quite a bit cheaper to order Adox products (and some other products like Rollei films too). The trade-off is painfully long shipping. It wasn't too bad pre-pandemic but it's pretty slow at the moment. Depending on how much you order at once though the savings can be significant (and more of your money goes to Adox directly).

urnem57 · Apr 19, 2021

Only 1 store in a nation of 350 million people? The reason I am asking is that Freestyle was out of the film for a few months (most likely Covid-shipping related) and as far as I could tell the only other option was to order it from Europe and wait a month to get it. It’s great film, but with only one place to buy it makes me hesitant to rely on it. Hopefully this changes as Adox adjusts. I listened to the podcast and better understand the challenges they are facing.
On another note, can someone please explain what orthochromatic/panchromatic emulsion means? I understand what Ortho (single) and Pan (multiple). What does this film have? Both at once? Two layers of emulsion (one of each?)
Does this mean that the film “sees” more wavelengths of light than either single emulsion can “see”? Thanks.

m00dawg · Apr 19, 2021

urnem57 said:
Only 1 store in a nation of 350 million people? The reason I am asking is that Freestyle was out of the film for a few months (most likely Covid-shipping related) and as far as I could tell the only other option was to order it from Europe and wait a month to get it. It’s great film, but with only one place to buy it makes me hesitant to rely on it. Hopefully this changes as Adox adjusts. I listened to the podcast and better understand the challenges they are facing.
On another note, can someone please explain what orthochromatic/panchromatic emulsion means? I understand what Ortho (single) and Pan (multiple). What does this film have? Both at once? Two layers of emulsion (one of each?)
Does this mean that the film “sees” more wavelengths of light than either single emulsion can “see”? Thanks.

One thing to consider, Adox isn't nearly the size of Kodak, Ilford, or perhaps even Fomapan. They're working with limited resources, doubly so due to Covid. This is why MCC hasn't re-appeared and why sometimes products disappear for a while as they work on making another product using their limited machinery (with limited access to their Swiss plant due to Covid). So the capability is less to due with a single vendor like Freestyle and more due to the size of the company and Covid. This is as I understand it anyway. If you like their products, the best you can do is support them by buying said products so that they can have more capital to do more (like perhaps investing in more production capacity and/or offering new products in new sizes, etc.).

Mirko and Lina's interview on Silvergrain's podcast is worth a listen. Mirko gets maybe a little overly sensitive to the Internet trolls but there's a ton of good info there and worthy of a listen as it addresses part of your concerns I think.

All told though, CHS ii is a BEAUTIFUL emulsion I think. I hope one day we can see HR50 in sheets too (for far-red/near-IR work) but CHS ii is easily my favorite 4x5 100 speed film.

Finally "orthopanchromatic" is another way of saying "reduced red sensitivity" - CHS ii, like Acros, doesn't reach out as far into the red spectrum as a typical panchromatic film. They still see red, just not as far out (in terms of wavelengths) as a full pancrohmatic film - and certainly more than an orthochromatic film (which typically doesn't see red at all). Likewise "superpanchromatic" means further red support (reaching out to near IR typically, Rollei IR 400, Streetpan 400, HR50, and Ilford SFX 200).

urnem57 · Apr 19, 2021

Nice. Thanks. I am doing my part I supporting Adox. I LOVE everything I have tried so far.

Sal Santamaura · May 5, 2021

Nodda Duma said:
When I ordered my boxes of CHS 100 II, I ordered from Fotoimpex. And I agree it’s a beautiful film.

I do want to ask them if whole plate format sized sheets are available.

Sal Santamaura said:
I've toyed with asking that question, but hesitated due to an assumption that there would be some minimum quantity required for ADOX to say "yes." Initially with Ilford, the box size was a stumbling block, and ADOX might have the same issue.

In case Team ADOX reads this and wants to offer the new sheet size anyway, here's 2007 size information I used from Ilford and (indirectly) Kodak when working with Lotus to establish the modern de facto "standard" for whole plate holders:

From Ilford's cutting room manager:

Short dimension: 162.7mm to 164.3mm

Long dimension: 213.0mm to 214.6mm

From J&C, referring to Kodak TMY:

Short dimension: 163.1mm to 164.1mm

Long dimension: 212.9mm to 214.9mm

Chamonix holders are duplicates of the Lotus sample I sent their shop as a pattern. Any CHS 100 II that ADOX cuts within those tolerances should be a perfect match for modern (and usable in most vintage) whole plate holders.

Team ADOX: can you provide any insight about whether you're considering offering CHS 100 II in the whole plate size? Thanks in advance.

AgX · May 5, 2021

urnem57 said:
On another note, can someone please explain what orthochromatic/panchromatic emulsion means? I understand what Ortho (single) and Pan (multiple). What does this film have? Both at once? Two layers of emulsion (one of each?)
Does this mean that the film “sees” more wavelengths of light than either single emulsion can “see”?

You are quite astray with your selfexplaining. It has nothing to do with emulsion layers. But instead is all about the spectral-sensitizing dye (dyes) or rather the spectrum they sensitize the emulsion for.

Orthochromatic, Orthopanchromatic, Panchchromatic, Superpanchromatic all these sensitizers start at Blue. The major difference is whether they reach red at all and if so to what extent on the spectral range (wavelength) and amplitude. Especially the amplitude (sensitivity per wavelenght) varied over the history. Thus a common panchromatic emulsion of today can be quite different (within same range) from what you see as example in textbooks of the 60's or so.
Thus take these terms with a grain of salt.
Orthopanchromatic is a european, german term.

Team ADOX · May 7, 2021

Sal Santamaura said:
Team ADOX: can you provide any insight about whether you're considering offering CHS 100 II in the whole plate size? Thanks in advance.

Well, not in the short and mid term. Demand is too low. And we are still fighting strongly against all the negative impacts of the current pandemic. It will take some time to overcome all these negative impacts of the last 14 months. We generally expect the situation to be improving from this summer on, but the improvements will be step-by-step, and it will take time. Probably 12-18 months to reach a "pre COVID level".

ADOX - Innovation in Analog Photography.

THE BEST THINGS IN LIFE ARE ANALOG.

ADOX Film.... Manufacturing, Shipping?

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