A76 vs S76 batteries with Nikon Cameras...your experience.

[Robert Ley]

Yesterday I picked up my Nikon FA to load with some of my new Kentmeer 200 and the camera was DOA. I couldn't get it to fire and the meter wasn't working. I hadn't checked the batteries recently so I pulled the batteries out and replaced them with some new A76 batteries and the camera worked as it should, so dead batteries were the culprit.

I then decided to check my FE2 which uses the same batteries and has been consistently over exposing by one to two stops and replaced those batteries with new A76 batteries and sure enough the camera reads the same as my FA, so the batteries seemed to be affecting the exposure. Both my FA and FE2 use the onboard battery to run the shutter so I suspect that they use more battery than a camera that just uses the battery for the exposure meter only.

When I first got a Nikon camera that used these batteries they were all the silver S76 and you would put them in the camera and pretty much forget about them as they seemed to last forever and they would give you good accurate exposures until they died.

My question to members is what has been your experience with A76 batteries with Nikon as well as other brands of cameras?

 

[Chan Tran]

I found the A76 doesn't last at long but found no differences in meter readings or shutter speeds. These cameras don't need precise battery voltage.

 

[fstop]

I have a FA that gobbles batteries, other FA's don't for some reason.Probably has a bad cap somewhere.I have others to use so not investigating it.
Minoltas are pretty frugal with batteries.

 

[xkaes]

Check the user manuals. I bet the cameras were made for S76 batteries. You can use A76 batteries -- they are cheaper -- but with many cameras designed for S76 batteries you can run into problems. I used A76 batteries for years, but have switched back to S76 if the camera is designed for them -- longer life and more stable voltage. In the scheme of things, batteries are cheap -- why screw around with batteries that the camera was not designed to use (unless you have no other option)?

 

[Chan Tran]

There should be no problem using any of the 3 options. FE2 manual

 

[Robert Ley]

Does the drop in voltage that I saw with the A76 batteries in the FE2 have any affect on the function of the meter or shutter in this camera?

I ordered some S76 batteries that came today and I will probably swap them out.

I remember the old mercury batteries that would maintain there voltage right up until they gave up the ghost. anyone have any thoughts on the stability of the voltage and whether it drops when it ages?

 

[BrianShaw]

Voltage profile over time is rather standard part of battery specification sheets.

 

[Robert Ley]

Voltage profile over time is rather standard part of battery specification sheets.

I took your advise and with google found a PDF spec sheet for the Energizer A76 battery

https://data.energizer.com/pdfs/a76z.pdf

I don't really have the experience reading these charts and I don't know how it relates to the function of my camera.

Maybe I should post in the camera repair forum?

 

[blee1996]

I have used both A76 and S76 batteries with Nikon FA, and did not notice any functional differences.

The only concern is that, if you forget about the battery in the camera for a very long time, the alkaline batteries tend to leak terribly and ruin the entire battery compartment. Silver Oxide batteries seem not have the same issue.

 

[Chan Tran]

Battery voltage of both the S76 and A76 battery drops overtime but the FE2 was designed to work with voltage of 2.5V or higher. So as long as the the voltage is higher than 2.5V there is no difference in meter reading. Below that the camera simply stops working. So the A76 only not last as long as the S76 but should not cause any differences in operation.

 

[xkaes]

As I recall, the S76 and A76 are SLIGHTLY different in size. In most cases this makes no difference at all, but in a few devices (these batteries are used in many devices other than cameras, like PH meters), the A76 batteries won't fit.

 

[BrianShaw]

As I recall, the S76 and A76 are SLIGHTLY different in size. In most cases this makes no difference at all, but in a few devices (these batteries are used in many devices other than cameras, like PH meters), the A76 batteries won't fit.

The confusing and not-so-standard battery nomenclatures makes it difficult to remember equivelancies at times, but I think the A76 and S76 packages are identical. It is possib;e that you are thinking of the minor height difference between the 357/303/SR44/etc and 386/301/SR43/etc cells.

 

[BrianShaw]

I took your advise and with google found a PDF spec sheet for the Energizer A76 battery

https://data.energizer.com/pdfs/a76z.pdf

I don't really have the experience reading these charts and I don't know how it relates to the function of my camera.

Maybe I should post in the camera repair forum?

The major differences to compare, specific to your question, are probably cell discharge pattern (flat versus declining curve) and cell life. The spec sheets need to be interrogated to ensure that the test conditions were similar/same and the data is being presented in a directly comparable format. It's a lot to think about...

The experience in a device is sometimes a different story that cannot be directly assessed from the spec sheets as cameas and meters aren't generally continuous discharge devices. @Chan Tran has shown that either cell is acceptable per the manufacturer. Probably the only difference you might notice is cell life, where the silver cell will live longer than the alkaline cell.

Personally... I only use silver cells in my cameras and meters because of manufacturer statements like this: This battery will bulge as it is discharged, but will not exceed the maximum height shown on the battery drawing. To me, that means there is an increased chance of the container (can, cap, or gasket) failing and leaking into my device.

 

[chuckroast]

Does the drop in voltage that I saw with the A76 batteries in the FE2 have any affect on the function of the meter or shutter in this camera?

I ordered some S76 batteries that came today and I will probably swap them out.

I remember the old mercury batteries that would maintain there voltage right up until they gave up the ghost. anyone have any thoughts on the stability of the voltage and whether it drops when it ages?

Alkaline batteries slowly lose their voltage over time. A small difference doesn't matter much but, if you don't catch it in time, it will typically give you increasingly faulty meter readings.

Silver Oxide batteries are this strongly preferred because they hold voltage until they "fall off a cliff". Another option is a CR1/3N lithium battery that replaces two of these i one stack.

 

[Robert Ley]

Battery voltage of both the S76 and A76 battery drops overtime but the FE2 was designed to work with voltage of 2.5V or higher. So as long as the the voltage is higher than 2.5V there is no difference in meter reading. Below that the camera simply stops working. So the A76 only not last as long as the S76 but should not cause any differences in operation.

Thanks for this information. It looks like my fears of low battery voltage were unfounded.
I will probably use these A76 batteries for a while, but replace them with the S76 before they are completely dead.

 

[chuckroast]

Thanks for this information. It looks like my fears of low battery voltage were unfounded.
I will probably use these A76 batteries for a while, but replace them with the S76 before they are completely dead.

The problem is that Alkalines lose voltage subtly and slowly so you do not suddenly notice bogus meter readings ... until you do For anything like this, I use SR44s or the aformentioned lithium replacement.

Happy shooting.

 

[Robert Ley]

The major differences to compare, specific to your question, are probably cell discharge pattern (flat versus declining curve) and cell life. The spec sheets need to be interrogated to ensure that the test conditions were similar/same and the data is being presented in a directly comparable format. It's a lot to think about...

The experience in a device is sometimes a different story that cannot be directly assessed from the spec sheets as cameas and meters aren't generally continuous discharge devices. @Chan Tran has shown that either cell is acceptable per the manufacturer. Probably the only difference you might notice is cell life, where the silver cell will live longer than the alkaline cell.

Personally... I only use silver cells in my cameras and meters because of manufacturer statements like this: This battery will bulge as it is discharged, but will not exceed the maximum height shown on the battery drawing. To me, that means there is an increased chance of the container (can, cap, or gasket) failing and leaking into my device.

Brian, thanks for your reply and it is kind of what I was thinking after looking at the data sheet.
Until recently I always used the silver batteries and I think I will go back to that.

 

[Robert Ley]

The problem is that Alkalines lose voltage subtly and slowly so you do not suddenly notice bogus meter readings ... until you do For anything like this, I use SR44s or the aformentioned lithium replacement.

Happy shooting.

chuckroast, your info confirms what probably happened with my FE2 and the erratic exposures. When I first got my FM2n I used the 3 volt lithium and had no problems.

 

[Vaughn]

I bought some A76 batteries in Japan -- one was faulty and eventually budged out quite a bit. I had it sitting on the kitchen table with the sun on it and it exploded. Put a dent in the ceiling and would have damaged an eye if I had been looking at it. Amazing, really -- a lot of energy stored in those things!

 

[Chan Tran]

The problem is that Alkalines lose voltage subtly and slowly so you do not suddenly notice bogus meter readings ... until you do For anything like this, I use SR44s or the aformentioned lithium replacement.

Happy shooting.

Cameras like the FE2 were design to work perfectly within a range of voltages. The FE2 speifically designed to work with voltage from 2.5V and up and there is no bogus readings if the voltage is 2.5V or higher. Silver Oxide and Lithium battery voltage drops with use too. The problem with battery voltage only applied to old designed where the battery voltage is used as a reference. The only bad thing about alkaline is that they leak. The newer Alkalines tends to leak more often than old Alkalines.

 

[blee1996]

The only bad thing about alkaline is that they leak. The newer Alkalines tends to leak more often than old Alkalines.

This is certainly the case with modern alkaline batteries.

Another repeat offender is zinc-air hearing aid batteries (typically substitute for mercury battery PX625 with appropriate adapters), they also leak terribly. I have set a reminder to replace them every 6 months, otherwise the whole battery compartment becomes green.

 

[BrianShaw]

I bought some A76 batteries in Japan -- one was faulty and eventually budged out quite a bit. I had it sitting on the kitchen table with the sun on it and it exploded. Put a dent in the ceiling and would have damaged an eye if I had been looking at it. Amazing, really -- a lot of energy stored in those things!

I had a can of treacle explode from similar circumstances. It's amazing how some seemingly benign items can be dangerous under less than ideal conditions.

 

[Vaughn]

I had a can of treacle explode from similar circumstances. It's amazing how some seemingly benign items can be dangerous under less than ideal conditions.

Similar experience in a bunkhouse in the US Forest Service -- someone took a paper can of orange juice concentrate out of the freezer, put it on top of the fridge and forgot about it. Hot summer, no air conditioning...we heard a soft explosion from the kitchen. Orange concentrate over all the ceiling and the rest of the room.

I have heard that silver oxides batteries tend to maintain power better in the cold than other alkalines...not one has mentioned it yet, so what is the word on that?

 

[chuckroast]

This is certainly the case with modern alkaline batteries.

Another repeat offender is zinc-air hearing aid batteries (typically substitute for mercury battery PX625 with appropriate adapters), they also leak terribly. I have set a reminder to replace them every 6 months, otherwise the whole battery compartment becomes green.

For my devices that use 625 form factor batteries, I have switched to using voltage dropping MR-9 adapters with silver oxide batteries inserted in them. Works great, albeit at the cost of the MR-9 adapters.

Another strategy is to get a non-voltage dropping battery adapter that looks somewhat like an MR-9 and inserting the silver oxide batteries in them. This does mean your meter will get 1.5V not 1.3V delivered to it BUT, you can mostly adjust this away with your exposure compensation dial or even cranking down the ASA setting on the camera. This works pretty well, though it is not guaranteed the meter will retain its linearity when fed the higher voltage.

In no case would I recommend those zinc-air batteries. They are overpriced, have a short life, and - by your experience - have leakage problems.

The old camera meters really were not that great in the first place. Even back in the 1970s with a new Photomic FtN meter, I pretty much always used as Luna Pro, which was way more sensitive and likely to be correct. These days I carry either a Sekonic L-408 or Pentax Digital spot meter for absolutely consistency. The only regular exception to this is when I use my Leica M5. It has an onboard spot meter and I had the camera recalibrated by DAG to take 1.5 volt batteries (via an adapater as described above).

 

[runswithsizzers]

Just now, I almost bought a used Konica FC-1, but when I asked for a photo of the battery tray it showed the old LR44 batteries still loaded, and green corrosion forming at the contacts. The seller was unwilling to test it with fresh batteries, and she does not accept returns, so I did not buy the camera.

Would the use of SR44 batteries have saved this camera? I don't know.