6x7 or 4x5

Ai Print · Nov 10, 2015

markbarendt said:
If a shot is real important, shoot two sheets. If not just shoot one.

I only really setup and shoot if it is good and that means at least 2 sheets, if it is a real keeper then up to 6 is not uncommon. Film is is cheaper than the other combined costs, CYA....

Richard Man · Nov 10, 2015

I shoot color films so two sheets are $10! Makes it expensive as I have two 4x5 portrait projects going. It works to some advantages though - I tell the sitters that I am poor and can only afford two sheets and they really work with me on them.

Roger Cole · Nov 10, 2015

Sirius Glass said:
A can of Dust Off! can go a long way to combat dust.

It's better than not using it, but a long way from a solution in my experience.

There are ways of dealing with dust on film - lightly scrape off the emulsion of the black spot on the print (rarely satisfactory) or spot out the dust on the negative then spot the resulting white spot on the print. That's probably the best solution but if you aren't very, very careful you get a resulting white spot roughly the size and shape of Texas.

Of course if you scan and print in hybrid mode it's a non-issue. Clone stamp cures a world of ills.

Black Dog · Nov 10, 2015

I tend to spot the negs...luckily I've got a steady hand!

BetterSense · Nov 10, 2015

I would shoot 4x5 if I could still get quick loads. There is no point in slightly better prints if the sky is full of black spots from dust. As an analog printer I can't just clone out dust spots, and I don't just stay in the studio where it's easier to keep everything clean. Roll film wins because it is a giant leap in lower defectivity versus sheet film.

M Carter · Nov 10, 2015

Man, you're really talking two very different shooting styles, etc. I'd choose 4x5 for large large prints, shots I needed movements, etc.

But I shot tons of color catalog 4x5 in the film days, and never had dust issues. Clean darkroom, brush out the holders with a static brush, blow 'em out, clean the dark slides, put a clean cloth down, lights out and load.

ColColt · Nov 10, 2015

Unfortunately, dust has always been around and always will be. I've spotted more than one print because of it despite careful cleaning of the negative prior to putting it into the negative carrier and a final "sweep" after that. A scratch has to be carefully done with Edwal No-Scratch but easily eliminated with PP. It's all the nature of things.

color is another item that's been around forever or at least as far back as I remember...since when, maybe 1935? Even the old comics in the "funny papers" were color...Dick Tracy, Joe Palooka, Moon Mullins, L'il Abner, but I think Mutt & Jeff were B&W.

Ai Print · Nov 10, 2015

ColColt said:
Unfortunately, dust has always been around and always will be. I've spotted more than one print because of it despite careful cleaning of the negative prior to putting it into the negative carrier and a final "sweep" after that. A scratch has to be carefully done with Edwal No-Scratch but easily eliminated with PP. It's all the nature of things.

Soooo....how have you dealt with the black spots in snow or in a cloud that were made by dust that was on the film *during* the exposure...? Because that is exponentially harder to deal with than just spotting a print unless you are not going full analog and will employ some form of "PP".

ColColt · Nov 10, 2015

I haven't had to deal with black spots in snow or clouds. All my film is roll film. Any dust on the negatives have been after the exposure. I haven't as yet experimented with 4x5.

Black Dog · Nov 10, 2015

The damp in Britain is great for keeping the dust at bay!

DREW WILEY · Nov 11, 2015

I find MF SLR's more prone to dust than sheet film in a view camera because you've got internal motion from the mirror and shutter curtain
close to the film, switch lenses in close proximity too, etc. I learned how to prevent dust on sheet film over thirty years ago.

ColColt · Nov 11, 2015

Switching lens is the biggest gamble but, I turn the camera upside down to aid in the hopeful elimination of dust getting on the mirror or inside the baffle.

Roger Cole · Nov 12, 2015

DREW WILEY said:
I find MF SLR's more prone to dust than sheet film in a view camera because you've got internal motion from the mirror and shutter curtain
close to the film, switch lenses in close proximity too, etc. I learned how to prevent dust on sheet film over thirty years ago.

You must live on a different planet.

I'm lucky if I can get one out of three sheets completely dust free, if I really look carefully for the black spots on prints. I have never had dust on film during exposure with my M645 Pro. (Or Yashicamat but you did say SLR.)

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk and 100% recycled electrons - because I care.

Roger Cole · Nov 12, 2015

ColColt said:
Switching lens is the biggest gamble but, I turn the camera upside down to aid in the hopeful elimination of dust getting on the mirror or inside the baffle.

I take no such special precautions with roll film but don't get dust. I go to pretty extreme measures with sheet film and still get dust.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk and 100% recycled electrons - because I care.

dpurdy · Nov 12, 2015

All this stuff aside, the difference between 4x5 and 6cmx7cm is not really about grain, sharpness or image quality, it is about the difference in using a spontaneous camera or a thoughtful camera. The Crown or Speed graphic is theoretically a hand held spontaneous camera so it is different from other "view" cameras. However if your goal is spontaneity, you should opt for a roll film camera with a 90º prism. If you are trying for large prints with a street photography feel, the Speed Graphic. My opinion.

Sirius Glass · Nov 12, 2015

DREW WILEY said:
I find MF SLR's more prone to dust than sheet film in a view camera because you've got internal motion from the mirror and shutter curtain
close to the film, switch lenses in close proximity too, etc. I learned how to prevent dust on sheet film over thirty years ago.

I have not had any problems, you describe, with dust any camera including 4"x5" Graflexes and Graphics.

Ian Grant · Nov 13, 2015

DREW WILEY said:
I find MF SLR's more prone to dust than sheet film in a view camera because you've got internal motion from the mirror and shutter curtain
close to the film, switch lenses in close proximity too, etc. I learned how to prevent dust on sheet film over thirty years ago.

I find that odd, in over 40 years shooting MF with a variety of cameras including Mamiya TLRs and SLRs, Bronica DLRs I've never seen a single dust issue with MF film, and I've shot many thousands of rolls.

Ian

Roger Cole · Nov 13, 2015

Drew lives on another planet, guys.

Sirius Glass · Nov 13, 2015

Same universe, right?

markbarendt · Nov 13, 2015

Roger Cole said:
Drew lives on another planet, guys.

Or he is very good at keeping sheet film clean.

Roger Cole · Nov 13, 2015

markbarendt said:
Or he is very good at keeping sheet film clean.

Well yeah. I think he's said he has a lab grade clean room set up for that.

I run a HEPA air cleaner, spritz down the table, blow out the holders with canned air and then brush with an anti-static brush. I've even tried blasting the loaded film with canned air just before closing the darkslide. Nothing seems to be 100% proof, or even "clean film most of the time." I did buy that Zone VI electric anti-static brush and I'll try that next time I load holders.

markbarendt · Nov 13, 2015

I do get an occasional speck but I've been pleasantly surprised by how few. (And I don't have a clean room like Drew.)

shutterfinger · Nov 13, 2015

I wonder if those having dust problems with their equipment is due to static electricity. A low humidity environment and synthetic materials in carpets, rugs, and clothing will aid the charge build up. Cotton and cotton blend materials will help reduce or prevent static buildup.
I wipe my holders down with a heavyweight microfiber cleaning cloth which helps. I also have a Staticmaster brush which I use rarely.

DREW WILEY · Nov 13, 2015

When I go true cleanroom mode, everything gets swabbed down. No fiber-based printing in there. I wear a true cleanroom smock - 100% long-fiber dacron. No rugs, no cotton clothes etc. Big sign on the door: Cats Keep Out! (hope they can read). Have an industrial anti-static air cleaner and triple-filtered air lines. That's pretty much necessary for doing precision film work or color printing prep. I still have other enlargers in a different room if I need to do basic fiber-based black and white printing at the same time. Unfortunately that second room is
a mess right now because I've just moved in another big enlarger, and it will take awhile to get it all cleaned and tuned up. But I can get the inner room clean enough very quickly for ordinary filmholder loading. Color printing per se involves a lot of pieces of glass and pieces of registered film to all be immaculate. But all that work is nowhere near as bad as color spotting. Spotting black and white prints is far
easier, but not exactly fun either.

MattKing · Nov 13, 2015

Roger Cole said:
Drew lives on another planet, guys.

Sirius Glass said:
Same universe, right?

Actually, a parallel universe

6x7 or 4x5

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency