5x7 Lens Selection

[Marygk46]

Hello,

I'm new to the community and really appreciate the opportunity to join in.

I've been thinking of getting into large format photography for several years now, and I've finally decided to step into the water and see how it goes. I'm ordering a 5x7 camera in the next few days and would like some recommendation about a lens to start with. If everything goes well, I expect to add a couple more to add more flexibility to my system.

The camera front rise is 72mm, fall is 24mm, and rear rise is 45mm. Those are the movements I'm most interested in, and I would like to pick out a lens that would give good coverage of the available movements.
Below are couple of lenses that I'm considering, and I'd like to get some feedback about those or any other recommendations. While I want to have good coverage, I'd like to keep from spending extra dollars and adding extra weight for little gain. I'm not getting any younger.

Nikon Nikkor M 300mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor W 210mm f/5.6
Rodenstock APO-Sironar S 210mm f/5.6
Fuji Fujinon-A 240mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor-SW 120mm f/8.

Thanks for looking,
Mary

 

[retina_restoration]

Hello,

I'm new to the community and really appreciate the opportunity to join in.

I've been thinking of getting into large format photography for several years now, and I've finally decided to step into the water and see how it goes. I'm ordering a 5x7 camera in the next few days and would like some recommendation about a lens to start with. If everything goes well, I expect to add a couple more to add more flexibility to my system.

The camera front rise is 72mm, fall is 24mm, and rear rise is 45mm. Those are the movements I'm most interested in, and I would like to pick out a lens that would give good coverage of the available movements.
Below are couple of lenses that I'm considering, and I'd like to get some feedback about those or any other recommendations. While I want to have good coverage, I'd like to keep from spending extra dollars and adding extra weight for little gain. I'm not getting any younger.

Nikon Nikkor M 300mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor W 210mm f/5.6
Rodenstock APO-Sironar S 210mm f/5.6
Fuji Fujinon-A 240mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor-SW 120mm f/8.

Thanks for looking,
Mary

Mary, this is a good place to start: https://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses5x7.html

 

[BradS]

....Below are couple of lenses that I'm considering, and I'd like to get some feedback about those or any other recommendations.

Nikon Nikkor M 300mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor W 210mm f/5.6
Rodenstock APO-Sironar S 210mm f/5.6
Fuji Fujinon-A 240mm f/9
Nikon Nikkor-SW 120mm f/8.

Thanks for looking,
Mary

Any one of those is probably fine. I'd recommend against starting with a wide angle (the 120mm in this case) however. I think I'd start with a 210mm lens in a modern copal shutter. Don't overlook the shutter. I'd stay well away from old shutters - they can be fine but can also need service or be finicky, etc..not something you need when starting out. Prefer the modern copal shutter with the black dial.

As for alternatives, really any one of the following is gonna be fine.

210mm f/5.6...
Schneider Symmar-S, Schneider APO-Symmar, Schneider APO Symmar L
Rodenstock Sironar-N,
Nikon Nikkor-W
Fuji made good lenses too but their nomenclature is confusing so, just avoid them to start.

Welcome and let us know what you get and come back with questions, comments, and photos!

 

[Marygk46]

Mary, this is a good place to start: https://www.largeformatphotography.info/lenses5x7.html

Thanks, good information there!

 

[Marygk46]

Any one of those is probably fine. I'd recommend against starting with a wide angle (the 120mm in this case) however. I think I'd start with a 210mm lens in a modern copal shutter. Don't overlook the shutter. I'd stay well away from old shutters - they can be fine but can also need service or be finicky, etc..not something you need when starting out. Prefer the modern all copal shutter with the black dial.

As for alternatives, really any one of the following is gonna be fine.

210mm f/5.6...
Schneider Symmar-S, Schneider APO-Symmar, Schneider APO Symmar L
Rodenstock Sironar-N,
Nikon Nikkor-W
Fuji made good lenses too but their nomenclature is confusing so, just avoid them to start.

Welcome and let us know what you get and come back with questions, comments, and photos!

Thanks. I'm sure I'll be coming back with more questions and comments. I expect it will be some time before I'll be able add any photos!

 

[Ian Grant]

I'd agree with @BradS, start with a f5.6 210

Maybe add a 90mm something like a 90mm f5.6 Super Angulon or Nikkor SW, and go for a faster 240mm, I use a f5.6 Nikkor SW. However I'm multi format 5x4, 7x5, & 10x8, so the 240mm Nikkor SW is a great medium wide angle. Aside from the 300mm f9 Nikkor N avoid slower lenses unless you do a lot of backpacking, I have a light weight 5x4 set up.

A lot depends on your budget, personally I buy carefully, the best value for lenses in excellent condition. I have just bought a 300mm f4.5 Xenar Xenar it's in near mint condition despite being over 60 years old, and the price was good. There are excellent second hand lenses out there.

Welcome to Photrio BTW.

Ian

 

[GregY]

Mary, check out Kerry Thalman's excellent selection of info on LF lenses. Definitely worth the read. If you'll primarily be photographing outdoors you don't need to go for large aperture plasmat lenses. Any of the major brands are good...in 5x7 there's lots of film real estate and you'll get fine results without going for high dollar 'sharpest ever' lenses. Fuji lenses are as good as any.
As far as selection, I wouldn't get as wide a lens as 90mm....
Most shutters can be serviced...& beautiful images have been made (& continue to be made) with Dagors, & Commercial Ektars
Kerry's lineup:

Lightweight Lenses

 

[Ian Grant]

Mary, check out Kerry Thalman's excellent selection of info on LF lenses. Definitely worth the read. If you'll primarily be photographing outdoors you don't need to go for large aperture plasmat lenses. Any of the major brands are good...in 5x7 there's lots of film real estate and you'll get fine results without going for high dollar 'sharpest ever' lenses. Fuji lenses are as good as any.
As far as selection, I wouldn't get as wide a lens as 90mm....
Most shutters can be serviced...& beautiful images have been made (& continue to be made) with Dagors, & Commercial Ektars

Lightweight Lenses

Why not as wide as a 90mm, I use a 65mm for 5x4, although these days prefer and use a 75mm far more. 90mm on a 7x5 camera is not an extreme wide angle, it's equivalent to a 24mm on 35mm or a full frame DSLR. Of course, it depends on where & what you are shooting, here in the UK I'm often shooting in tight spaces.

But your point about older lenses is very valid, Commercial Ektars and late Goerz Am Opt Dagors are excellent lenses, and that's forgetting the 203mm (8") f7.7 Elktar. I use a 12" (305mm) f6.8 Dagor, it came with a 1940 10x8 camera, and I was told it was useless, actually it's an amazingly good lens.

Commercial Ektars and Goerz Am Opt lenses were never sold here in the UK,unfortunately. Kodak Ltd sourced lenses from UK manufacturers (after WW1) and the only LF lens they made was the 203mm f7.7 Ektar, it differs slightly from the US version as it's Epsilon, Prontor, Compur, #0 compatible. I now use a late US version in a Compur (Graphex) #1.

I would add a point, it's not really format related. We buy a camera and lens, and then we realise we need a different lens, it might be wider or longer focal length. So we expand to meet our needs.

Ian

 

[Vaughn]

I think a Fuji W 180mm and a Fuji W 250mm would be a nice pairing. The newer Fuji W 180 and 250 with lettering on the outside of the barrel will all cover 5x7 nicely, the older ones with lettering on the inside of the barrel give more coverage and are often more expensive than the newer. The older Fuji W 250/6.7 covers 8x10 easily, for example.

That's my bias (and the lenses I own and use on 5x7 -- along with a heavier Computar 210/6.3 that is staying home most of the time)...I usually do not need anything wider. The Fuji W 150mm/5.6, inside lettering, would cover 5x7 according to the specs.

 

[GregY]

Why not as wide as a 90mm, I use a 65mm for 5x4, although these days prefer and use a 75mm far more. 90mm on a 7x5 camera is not an extreme wide angle, it's equivalent to a 24mm on 35mm or a full frame DSLR. Of course, it depends on where & what you are shooting, here in the UK I'm often shooting in tight spaces.

But your point about older lenses is very valid, Commercial Ektars and late Goerz Am Opt Dagors are excellent lenses, and that's forgetting the 203mm (8") f7.7 Elktar. I use a 12" (305mm) f6.8 Dagor, it came with a 1940 10x8 camera, and I was told it was useless, actually it's an amazingly good lens.

Commercial Ektars and Goerz Am Opt lenses were never sold here in the UK,unfortunately. Kodak Ltd sourced lenses from UK manufacturers (after WW1) and the only LF lens they made was the 203mm f7.7 Ektar, it differs slightly from the US version as it's Epsilon, Prontor, Compur, #0 compatible. I now use a late US version in a Compur (Graphex) #1.

I would add a point, it's not really format related. We buy a camera and lens, and then we realise we need a different lens, it might be wider or longer focal length. So we expand to meet our needs.

Ian

When you're starting out in LF (as the OP is)...the very wide lenses or very long lenses are specialty items outside what's normally used or needed. Once you get the hang of the medium, other choices present themselves....
As for origin....with so much Ebay shopping the LF world gives lots of choice. As it happens the OP is in the USA, and there is a very wide selection in N America in general.

 

[grahamp]

The nice thing about 210mm lenses is that they are popular with 4x5 as well, so there are plenty around. At the long end, remember that your maximum bellows extension will set the upper limit of focal length.

Don't forget film holders!

 

[retina_restoration]

Mary, when a question such as this gets asked, you're going to get a lot of people offering an opinion about their favorite lens(es), and that's fine. But the fact is that you could choose almost any lens made by any of the Big Four (Fuji, Nikon, Schneider and Rodenstock) and have an excellent lens. (I would suggest that some of the Kodak large format lenses are also superb, like the 8&1/2" Commercial Ektar)

It's smart to pick one "normal" lens for the 5x7 format, work with it a while, and then decide if you need something else. You might find that you are happy with a single lens in the normal length (200mm-240mm range).

One of my personal favorites is the Kodak 203mm Ektar, which is a tiny lens (adds very little weight to your kit) and is still regarded as one of the finest lenses produced for 4x5/5x7 work. However, on 5x7 it doesn't have a very large image circle, so camera movements will be quite limited. The 8&1/2" Commercial Ektar would be better in that respect. I have both and really like both)

 

[GregY]

Another sleeper lens is the earlier G Claron / (Dagor formula). The 210 can be identified by the 40.5 mm filter size.
A spectacular lens for B/W

 

[Marygk46]

Thanks to all for the wealth of information you’ve kindly shared. I’ll have to spend some time going through your replies before I make a decision.

Mary

 

[lobitar]

If you state what you primarily endeavor to photograph you might get shorter answers? Just saying...
(did I miss something?)

 

[Marygk46]

If you state what you primarily endeavor to photograph you might get shorter answers? Just saying...
(did I miss something?)

Good point. I’m mostly interested in landscape, architecture, still life, and closeup photography. Most of the work will be done outdoors, but I enjoy studio work in the winter months.

 

[abruzzi]

Architecture tends to require the most movements, and frequently a short lens. Macro needs a lot of bellows, many people shoot macro with a short lens to make the most of the bellows you have. So you may want to start with something like a 150 or shorter.

 

[Marygk46]

Thank you. My addiction to shooting architecture is why I included the rise and fall of the camera in my original post. I want to be sure that I select lenses that cover the movements available.

 

[abruzzi]

something like the Nikkor SW 120 will be very wide and have about 100mm total rise/fall (or 50mm rise or fall from center.) its field of view on 5x7 will be similar to a 24mm on 35mm/full frame digital. I don't know how good it will be at macro shots--its not a macro specific lens. Nikkor also made the AM 120mm, which does cover 5x7 but with much less movements, but it is specifically a macro lens.

Landscape is more forgiving, and doesn't usually require nearly as much movements. My landscape lens preference tends to be normal to slghtly long, so I would be doing a 120 on 5x7. Probably something around 250, but I also love the Kodak Ektar 203mm which is usually very cheap and is a tiny and amazing lens.

 

[xkaes]

While I want to have good coverage, I'd like to keep from spending extra dollars and adding extra weight for little gain.

Lots of people buy lenses that have way more coverage than they need -- which typically means more money and greater size and weight, and bigger filters. As mentioned, a lot depends on what type of work you do, and what lenses you want to work with. You may discover that you are using lenses that have too much movement or not enough. We all end up in that situation. There's nothing wrong with trading in a lens because its don't have enough coverage -- or way too much. I plead guilty.

And lots of us have traded in cameras for similar reasons. On this charge, I'm innocent -- and lucky.

So compare all the specs before you buy.

 

[koraks]

I'd agree with @BradS, start with a f5.6 210

Another one here. Obvious place to start with 5x7.

At the same time, also this:

the fact is that you could choose almost any lens made by any of the Big Four (Fuji, Nikon, Schneider and Rodenstock) and have an excellent lens.

So don't sweat it and just see what pops up/passes by and get on the train if you like its destination.

Welcome aboard @Marygk46 !

 

[Ian Grant]

When you're starting out in LF (as the OP is)...the very wide lenses or very long lenses are specialty items outside what's normally used or needed. Once you get the hang of the medium, other choices present themselves....
As for origin....with so much Ebay shopping the LF world gives lots of choice. As it happens the OP is in the USA, and there is a very wide selection in N America in general.

You make a good point, the North American market is a lot larger, and prices are lower than the UK/Europe. Unfortunately the now high cost of shipping and far greater enforcement of Import Duty, then VAT, compounded on top of the item price and the shipping, make it less feasible for us to buy from the US.

There's one suggestion we are overlooking, the Classified Section of this Forum. I've bought (& sold) quite a few lenses and I think 3 LF cameras via this Forum, many of them from the US.

The Wanted section is particularly useful. I bought a really cheap Super Graphic, it was listed here and also 2 UK forums but had issues. A wanted advert here and a few months of patience, and I was offered the parts. I also placed a Wanted advert for a 135mm lens for that camera and was offered & bought a superb lens.

I can't remember how long, or how many posts it is, before @Marygk46 !has access to the Classifieds. I bought my 210mm Symmar S from a Moderator via the classifieds, it's a great resource.

Ian

 

[Marygk46]

I'm considering a Fujifilm 250mm f/6.3 W in Copal 1.
Any thought would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Mary

 

[Rick A]

I'm considering a Fujifilm 250mm f/6.3 W in Copal 1.
Any thought would be appreciated.

Thanks,
Mary

I have one that I used on my 8x10, excellent lens. It has ample coverage for 5x7 but barely covers 8x10. It now occupies a slot in my 4x5 kit. If I were keeping my 5x7 it would be in that kit.

 

[xkaes]

I'm considering a Fujifilm 250mm f/6.3 W in Copal 1.

There's always been a bit of confusion about Fuji's 250mm lenses. There are actually THREE. The first is the W f6.7. It's loved by many because of its 398mm image circle.

There there is the NW f6.3 version -- which is simply marked "W". It adds EBC coating but has a smaller circle of 312mm.

There is a later CM-W f6.3 model with a circle of 320mm.

All of them will work well with 5x7, but each is different in optical design, lens coating, weight, size, filter thread, cost, availability, etc.

http://www.subclub.org/fujinon/byfl.htm