4 months the same fixer and still doing well.

[marciofs]

I am about 4 months, but probably more, using the same fixer for developing film negatives and it is still working as fresh new.

I use a browm bottle, a good bottle cap and I filter the amount of developer that was used before store it again in the bottle. Although sometimes I skip the filtering process.

Still, in the bottle I could see silver grains being acumulated. I just filtered it all and replaced the bottle. I used it to fix some negatives I have developed and works fine.

The same thing for the stop solution. But the stop solution I never filter. Since the fixer seems fine until now I assume the stop solution is fine too. But I decided to use a fresh stop solution yesterday. Just in case.

I plan to keep using the fixer and how knows next year I will celebrate its birthday!?

I usually always change for fresh fixer and stop solution when printing, because I think it is portant to use it fresh for print, and keep using it for films until comes the printing time again.

Soon I will start my printing process, and I am thinking on using this same fixer that I have being using for about 4 months, but maybe more. Just to see if after that I can keep using for films process and it will keepworking as fresh or not.

What is the longest time you could use your fixer without feel the need of replace it?

 

[bernard_L]

What is the longest time you could use your fixer without feel the need of replace it?

I've answered that question several times. Do a search on apug for: clearing posted by: bernard_L. Not to say other members did not give equally valid or better answers...

 

[Dali]

Fixer is cheap and is not worth taking to risk to badly fix a film.

 

[darkosaric]

If it more than a month old - then I don't use it for films any more. I will use it for papers, if something goes wrong - I can print it again, if the film goes wrong - it is more problematic.

 

[Harry Stevens]

I made a 500ml bottle up and never used it for a year it is in a clear glass bottle room temperature but in a dark closed cupboard and it as had about six films through it over the last month and performed perfectly, it fixed a colour film yesterday in it and it works a treat though I do test it. I suppose it is down to the number of films going through it. I strongly believe in one shot use developer though.

 

[John Wiegerink]

Longevity might also depend on what fixer you are using.

 

[Doremus Scudder]

Geez, how many times do we have to go over this?

Fixer has a capacity and a shelf life. Capacity is given in throughput, i.e., the number of rolls or prints or sheets you can fix per liter. It should be on the instructions that came with the fixer. Don't exceed this unless you want to risk your negatives or prints going bad in the future.

Also in the instructions should be the shelf life of the fixer. Fixer gradually goes bad with age even if the capacity has not been reached.

As mentioned above, for film you need to do clearing tests to be sure your fixer is active enough before you use it. I'll go over it again:

Before you fix any films at all, clip a piece of film (film leader works well, or a bit of a sacrificed sheet), put a drop of fixer on it, wait 30 seconds and then submerge it in the fixer with agitation. Do this with the lights on and observe how long it takes the film to clear; it is clear when you can no longer tell the difference between the location of the initial drop and the rest of the film. Note this time: it is your clearing time for fresh fixer for that film and serves as your benchmark.

Fix for at least twice the clearing time (a bit more for film will not hurt). Personally, I like three times the clearing time.

Before every batch of film, do a clip test to find the fixing time for that film and the partially-exhausted fixer.

When the clearing time for a given film reaches twice that in fresh fixer, the fixer is exhausted and should be discarded. Mix a new bath for the next batch of film.

When fixing prints, keep track of the number of prints through your fixing bath and discard the fix when the recommended capacity has been reached. If you want to go to the next level, learn how to do residual silver testing using the Kodak ST-1 test or selenium toner (search here; it comes up all over). For fiber-base prints many, including me, use a two-bath fixing procedure. In this case, you keep track of the number of prints through bath 1. When capacity has been reached, discard bath 1 and replace it with bath 2. Mix a new second bath.

If you keep a working solution of most fixers for a year, it will go bad. Here are Ilford's recommendations for their Rapid Fixer (other rapid fixers are similar):

6 months in full tightly capped bottles
2 months in a tank or dish/tray with a floating lid
1 month in a half full tightly capped bottle.
7 days in an open dish/tray.

See here for the Ilford tech sheet: http://www.ilfordphoto.com/Webfiles/2006130218312091.pdf . Pay attention to the sections on capacity and shelf life.

If you haven't reached the fixer capacity in throughput yet and have been storing the fixer carefully (and doing clip-tests), you may well have a fixer that is still perfectly active. Just make sure you don't exceed the capacity or the shelf life. If your fixer starts to turn cloudy or starts to precipitate out flakes of sulfur, then it is bad and should be discarded. If a clip-test yields a clearing time twice that of fresh, the fixer should be discarded. If in doubt, toss your fixer and mix new; better safe than sorry. No one gives awards for fixing more film than anyone else in a liter of fixer.

Best,

Doremus

 

[miha]

@marciofs: how many rolls of film have you done already in your 4 months old fixer?

 

[marciofs]

I guess there is no risk. If you see the fixer is getting weak, just mix a new one and fix again the negative.

As doremus said, 6 moths seem to be the shelf life in my case. I am almost there. The fixer is starting getting a bit foggy but just a little bit. Not very noticeble.

I am just impressed because I didn't know it could last that long. It used to last no more than 1 month when I was storing it with plastic bottle that was note well closed and tight. I always refixed my negative when I could see the older fixer was working weaker.

The fixer is not going to stop working completly to the point of making any film loss. The film is not well fixed, mean it is time to change the fixer and refix the film. Not a big deal.

 

[marciofs]

@marciofs: how many rolls of film have you done already in your 4 months old fixer?

Hard to tell but I would say one per week more or less.

 

[marciofs]

+1000

This kind of goal (ie how long can I use a working solution) is false economy, and helps explain the subsequent threads "why are my negatives stained, pink, dirty, screwed up etc. etc." I don't know of a single good darkroom practitioner who uses chemicals this way.

Please follow the manufacturers' instructions for both throughput and shelf life and stop this nonsense.

All subject is always new for somebody.

 

[Vonder]

Do you have a 3 year old condom in your wallet too that you trust?

 

[miha]

Hard to tell but I would say one per week more or less.

So about 16. Ilford sasy you can go up to 24, I use it one shot, negs are too preciuos to me.

 

[marciofs]

So about 16. Ilford sasy you can go up to 24, I use it one shot, negs are too preciuos to me.

Fixer may be cheap, but you guys have no idea how pour I am. I will keep saving.

 

[Rudeofus]

I would like to point out that fixer longevity is strongly dependent on fixer pH. Lower pH drastically reduces shelf life. Since almost all fixers were acidic in the past, I understand, that the common sentiment is "don't store fixer for too long".

You'll get incredible working solution shelf life with TF-3, TF-4 and TF-5. The last time I threw fixer out before it was exhausted was because it grew mold after some months in hot summer, other than that it would have lasted even longer.

 

[Ko.Fe.]

Fixer and stop for few months on film? No big deal and no brainier either.
I'm making new film fixer once it is not effective as it should and stop solution I'm using have color indication to change it.

 

[RalphLambrecht]

Fixer is cheap and is not worth taking to risk to badly fix a film.

I lost moreprecious negatives to overusing fixer than to any other processing mistake

 

[marciofs]

I lost moreprecious negatives to overusing fixer than to any other processing mistake

How?

I have never lost negatives because of fixing proccess.

 

[Doremus Scudder]

How?

I have never lost negatives because of fixing process.

Wait a while...

Badly-fixed negatives often do not show immediate defects. With time, however, they will stain and fade. That's because there are silver compounds remaining in the negative that were not completely fixed and washed out. The only way to really know if your negatives are fixed properly is to test for residual silver. In lieu of that, use the throughput and shelf-life guidelines supplied by the manufacturer; they've done the testing.

I'll repeat: if your fixer is cloudy it's on its way out. Toss it and mix new. Find the capacity (films/prints per liter) of your fixer and keep track. Same for shelf-life. And do clip-tests to determine your minimum fixing times for each bath. If you follow these guidelines, you are fairly well assured of adequately fixing your materials.

It's not rocket science, just good practice. And I don't see how needing to refix negatives or risking underfixing is economical. If you want to save time and money, do it right the first time.

Don't misunderstand me: keeping fixer and reusing it is a common practice (although I try to use fixer one-shot). You may well be able to store a working solution of fix for six months and not exceed either capacity or shelf-life. Just be aware that just because your negatives "look alright" after fixing doesn't mean they are properly fixed. You need to keep track of capacity, shelf life and make sure you fix long enough.

Best,

Doremus

 

[LAG]

Excuse me Marciofs

using the same fixer for developing film negatives and it is still working as fresh new

I doubt it very much. Not to be able to appreciate differences on the negative doesn't mean it is.

Since the fixer seems fine until now I assume the stop solution is fine too. But I decided to use a fresh stop solution yesterday. Just in case.

I plan to keep using the fixer and how knows next year I will celebrate its birthday!?

You have renewed the stop bath, and on the other hand however you plan to celebrate fixer birthday ... ??? Strange priorities

What is the longest time you could use your fixer without feel the need of replace it?

In my opinion (and experience), there is not a concrete date, because it depends on many factors (...), but with the appropriate and previous quality strip or time testing you should know it seriously, not only to find out the time to replace it, but to use it properly, even degraded.

 

[marciofs]

Do you guys throw away food that is not overdated because "it may be bad", just because its packing was opened Yesterday?

My fixer is still in its shelf like so I don't see reason to doubt about my fixing practice or to worry about one shot fixer. It is economical for me so I do it. Save me time and money.

I am often looking at my negatives from 5 years ago and they are still fine.

If I ever had any bad experience with reused fixer or food from openned packing, I sure would do one shot only. But I have had good experience so far as my fixer and food is well stored, looks good and is still in its shelf life.

If any of you want throw things away, please give to me. I accept fixer used once or twice, overdated film negatives, even food from opened packing. Old cameras and lenses are also welcome... You never know when they are going to stop working, get new ones.

 

[Harry Stevens]

Well how about this for a double or treble act a 120 roll of Kodak TR-X that expired in September 1978 and fixed in year old fixer and developed in two year old opened bottle of stock Promicrol developer then diluted 1+14 to use. Taken on 25/08/2016 and developed on 26/08/2016. I expected fog fog fog

Nearly forgot the camera is at least sixty years old as well..
Rolleicord with 16 adapter fitted.

 

[darkroommike]

Any fixer, but especially "rapid" fixers will continue to clear film well past their "safe-to-use" date, this in no way means that those films are archivally fixed and good for the long haul. The only way to be sure is to test your fixed film for residual silver and your washed film for residual fixer. There are at least four different argentothiosulfate compounds created during the fixing process. Some are very soluble and move out of the emulsion readily during the fixing and washing, others like to stick around. As you agitate film in fresh fixer almost all the argentothiosulfates are converted to the soluble, washable, "good" type. Old fixer doesn't do such a good job of conversion and leaves more of the "bad" less soluble argentothiosulfates in the emulsion. These will eventually sulfurize and turn yellow spoiling your film. At this point re-fixing will not "fix" (used in the sense of repair) anything.

 

[RPC]

Shouldn't the test be for residual silver halide, not residual silver? The image is made of silver, so such a test would go off the scale. Color, that's where you test for residual silver.

 

[Bob Carnie]

I see a lot of film , specifically 1950 onward , I can say that its obvious after 30 or 40 years if the film was fixed properly or not.

Since this is an International site discussing film photography many here have the position of archival process techniques like Post #7 , I follow this line of thought from day one, I do one shot
chemical process on all steps, maybe over board.

Clearly the OP likes the way he is working and time will tell if his frugality will pay off.

If you want archival quality , there are steps to get there. If you do not care then yes of course you can maximise and speed up your process.