3D printed Lensboard : FAIL

[Kino]

First try at printing a lens board and I almost got it right, but not quite.

I thought I had rounded the corners, but the radius somehow didn't make it into the file and I had one corner cool too quick and lift off the print bed.

Using PETG, so I'll try again once I get the model restyled and put down some glue stick to see if that will help with the lifting.

Takes 13 hours to print each one, so it's not a fast thing on my printer!

New to Tinkercad, new to printing with PETG and new to 3D printing in general. There's a lot to learn...

 

[koraks]

Using PETG

Yeah, that's always a little more challenging than PLA. PETG also has the disadvantage of being hygroscopic, so if you leave the filament on the printer exposed to air, it'll start to give issues in no-time. I've gone back to PLA for virtually all of my printing.
Try raising the bed temperature and use an adhesion spray; this can help in reducing the curl/lift problem. But PETG is liable to this anyway.

Takes 13 hours to print each one

What!? I have a cheap-a&& printer and mine print in a couple of hours for a big Sinar board.

 

[grahamp]

Looks like a Sinar board, so reasonably thick. Three base layers and three top layers, three walls, and 20-25% zig-zag infill. 50mm/sec maximum. I'd probably use some flat black acrylic paint on the inner surfaces to reduce secondary reflections and add a bit of extra density just on general principles.

I do not have a Sinar board on file, but my Galvin to Wista adapter at those settings is under 3 hours. It sounds like you are doing more infill than necessary?

I tend to use a lot of Sunlu's PLA+, and only move to something else if there is a good reason to do so - flexibility, stiffness, tensile strength. So much depends on layer adhesion and how the layers run in the object compared to the stresses when it comes to choosing the material.

 

[Donald Qualls]

There's a lot to learn...

Truth. 3D printing has about as much to learn as film photography, without the advantage many of us have of having done it for decades.

 

[Kino]

Looks like a Sinar board, so reasonably thick. Three base layers and three top layers, three walls, and 20-25% zig-zag infill. 50mm/sec maximum. I'd probably use some flat black acrylic paint on the inner surfaces to reduce secondary reflections and add a bit of extra density just on general principles.

I do not have a Sinar board on file, but my Galvin to Wista adapter at those settings is under 3 hours. It sounds like you are doing more infill than necessary?

I tend to use a lot of Sunlu's PLA+, and only move to something else if there is a good reason to do so - flexibility, stiffness, tensile strength. So much depends on layer adhesion and how the layers run in the object compared to the stresses when it comes to choosing the material.

It was supposed to be a 6x6 Calumet C1 (or Deardorf), 8x10 lens board with a Copal 1 hole.

I am using Sunlu PETG with default settings on a Sovol SV06+ and slicing on Cura and only a 10% cubic infill with a 4.0 nozzle.

Going through various tutorials to try to speed this printer up, but I am a rank amateur and it's going to take a while to get up to speed, so to speak.

Ordered the Klipper upgrade kit yesterday; maybe that will help.

 

[Kino]

Truth. 3D printing has about as much to learn as film photography, without the advantage many of us have of having done it for decades.

I was thinking that myself; another rabbit hole to go down...

 

[titrisol]

It was supposed to be a 6x6 Calumet C1 (or Deardorf), 8x10 lens board with a Copal 1 hole.

I am using Sunlu PETG with default settings on a Sovol SV06+ and slicing on Cura and only a 10% cubic infill with a 4.0 nozzle.

Going through various tutorials to try to speed this printer up, but I am a rank amateur and it's going to take a while to get up to speed, so to speak.

Ordered the Klipper upgrade kit yesterday; maybe that will help.

3D printer takes a bit to get used to
maybe a 0.3mm layer and a 30% star infill will be faster and equally strong (I use Prusa Slic3r)

For me the issue was getting the boards to be completely lightproof (thick enough), and a layer of flat black paint always helps

 

[Kino]

3D printer takes a bit to get used to
maybe a 0.3mm layer and a 30% star infill will be faster and equally strong (I use Prusa Slic3r)

For me the issue was getting the boards to be completely lightproof (thick enough), and a layer of flat black paint always helps

Yes it does take a while to get used to! Opening up Cura advanced settings almost caused me to toss the printer in the trash; overwhelming.

I see endless printing of test objects in my near future with the PETG and PLA filaments I have on-hand.

As for light tightness, I have sheets of adhesive backed black velvet flocking I plan to place over the surface after I paint it black.

Suspenders and a belt...

This topic seems only tangentially related to the current forum: should it be elsewhere or a new section established for this type of discussion? @Sean @koraks @MattKing

 

[titrisol]

Yes it does take a while to get used to! Opening up Cura advanced settings almost caused me to toss the printer in the trash; overwhelming.

I see endless printing of test objects in my near future with the PETG and PLA filaments I have on-hand.

As for light tightness, I have sheets of adhesive backed black velvet flocking I plan to place over the surface after I paint it black.

Suspenders and a belt...

Take it easy and go 1 step at a time. Flat prints like this, lens shades, etc are a great way to learn.
In many cases a sander or at least a sander sponge is a very very good friend.
PLA+ is a great material, much easier than PETG. Worth trying (and at $25 per roll is not too bad)

Then you begin playing in Thingiverse or cults3D and is off to the races!

 

[Donald Qualls]

PLA+ is a great material, much easier than PETG.

This is also very true. PETG has some preferable qualities, but I wouldn't try it until you can get PLA prints on the first try most of the time...

 

[grahamp]

I found 3D Printing Failures: 2022 Edition: How to Diagnose and Repair ALL Desktop 3D Printing Issues
by Sean Aranda (available in print and Amazon Kindle) to be useful. It digs into the materials and the controls (machine design, speed, temperature, etc) that have a bearing on various faults.

I have it as a regular loan item in my Kindle Unlimited list, and still dig into it if I seem to be having an issue I do not recognize.

 

[Donald Qualls]

There's also a 3D Printing Stack Exchange where many-many questions have been asked and answered -- and you can ask your own if searching fails to turn up what you need. These tend to be much more specific (often to brand and model) than the book mentioned above (which I bought when I got my Ender 3).

 

[titrisol]

This is also very true. PETG has some preferable qualities, but I wouldn't try it until you can get PLA prints on the first try most of the time...

I tried PETG a few years back to make utensils/shot glasses that were food grade.
It is a good material strong and shiny.
In my notes say to be careful with air draft and cooling. I made a cardboard box aorund the printer to prevent those pulled corners.
At the end, the advantages compared to PLA+ were minimal for most of my prints and I went back to the easier filament

 

[Donald Qualls]

the advantages compared to PLA+ were minimal

That was my conclusion as well. I tried PETG because it was safe for use in salt water aquariums (was printing a coral plug rack), and I got a good print of a test tube and reagent stand I designed, but PLA is easier to get good print quality. And there are black PLA filaments now that are plenty opaque for a lens board if you give 3-4 layer top and bottom, regardless of infill.

 

[reddesert]

There is a thread somewhere on Photrio about 3D printing. I personally have not mastered it, need to work on usual problems with bed/layer adhesion. I did make a couple of battery holders for the Bronica SQ-Ai, which show some of the promise of the technique (making small complex parts that serve a critical function).

For something like a lensboard, one is spending most of the print time printing a flat sheet of plastic. Would it be possible to design an outer frame that contains the shapes like the light trap rebate, into which a flat square of commercial plastic could be glued? I guess you'd still have to cut the circular hole, which is hard to do neatly without a drill press.

 

[titrisol]

That was my conclusion as well. I tried PETG because it was safe for use in salt water aquariums (was printing a coral plug rack), and I got a good print of a test tube and reagent stand I designed, but PLA is easier to get good print quality. And there are black PLA filaments now that are plenty opaque for a lens board if you give 3-4 layer top and bottom, regardless of infill.

Thanks for this
I went with 5layers top/bottom and black PLA+ it seems light proof.

 

[Kino]

I found 3D Printing Failures: 2022 Edition: How to Diagnose and Repair ALL Desktop 3D Printing Issues
by Sean Aranda (available in print and Amazon Kindle) to be useful. It digs into the materials and the controls (machine design, speed, temperature, etc) that have a bearing on various faults.

I have it as a regular loan item in my Kindle Unlimited list, and still dig into it if I seem to be having an issue I do not recognize.

I have that book in print form; ordered it with my printer and it is a valuable resource to get you started.

Only problem is that much of the information is largely outdated already and depends on extruders, hot heads and filament brands/types that are no longer offered or have changed formulation. Improvements are happening so fast in the 3D printing World that what I am trying to learn becomes obsolete and deprecated in the forums before I can become comfortable with the technology.

I bought my Sovol SV 06+ not a year ago and they just rolled-out a 3X faster printer that is 2 models beyond; the SV08!

When I realized this printer would be the one they will really push, I immediately went to their website and bought a bunch of spare parts and a Klipper Screen upgrade. It can't be long before they will stop or limit the replacement parts for my current machine, as the print head, extruder and motherboard have all changed with the latest offering.

This reminds me of the digital camera rush in the beginning; products were produced, ballyhooed and then unceremoniously dumped at a moment's notice.

Hopefully the Klipper upgrade will speed up my printing enough to make it bearable.

I can't keep buying a new printer every 6 months...

 

[titrisol]

I have that book in print form; ordered it with my printer and it is a valuable resource to get you started.

Only problem is that much of the information is largely outdated already and depends on extruders, hot heads and filament brands/types that are no longer offered or have changed formulation. Improvements are happening so fast in the 3D printing World that what I am trying to learn becomes obsolete and deprecated in the forums before I can become comfortable with the technology.

I bought my Sovol SV 06+ not a year ago and they just rolled-out a 3X faster printer that is 2 models beyond; the SV08!

When I realized this printer would be the one they will really push, I immediately went to their website and bought a bunch of spare parts and a Klipper Screen upgrade. It can't be long before they will stop or limit the replacement parts for my current machine, as the print head, extruder and motherboard have all changed with the latest offering.

This reminds me of the digital camera rush in the beginning; products were produced, ballyhooed and then unceremoniously dumped at a moment's notice.

Hopefully the Klipper upgrade will speed up my printing enough to make it bearable.

I can't keep buying a new printer every 6 months...

They arent updating as fast as in the beginning (some 10 yrs ago) but prices have dropped to commodity levels

I had a Prusa-style clone (Rapid-lite) which costed me around $700 in 2012, not a bad printer but the z-axis mechanism was not very stable. "Upgraded" to an Ender4 ($450) in 2018; which I expected to be X-Y type but the design is faulty and I can only print slow (50 mm/s) to get decent shapes.
I'll keep using it a couple more years until it dies and upgrade.

 

[Kino]

After a wild toboggan ride down the 3D rabbit hole, I am finally getting decent output in a reasonable amount of time.

Word of advice; if you just need a few parts, lens boards, tank caps, etc., just spend the money and buy them outright. I guarantee you will spend far more than what it is worth trying to make it yourself 3D printing.

However, if you want to continue to prototype and design new gear, be ready to invest time, money and brainpower in an ongoing fashion.

I really don't regret it, but let me tell you, it is certainly NOT "plug and play" as the manufacturers suggest unless you just want to print endless copies of a "benchy".

 

[grahamp]

One thing that 3D printing has done for me, is put some projects within reach that I could not do otherwise, or not easily. I watched the 3D printing world for a couple of years before I decided to get a printer - and by then I had put aside the funds.

My current project is to replace the front standard on my Intrepid 8x10 first edition so I can use independent, common axis front rise and tilt. The original uses a single clamp screw on each side for the two movements. The prototype seems to be working, but I plan to tweak the design a bit. This is one case where engineering in flex resistance is important. All the common materials tend to be flexible, so it is necessary to design in the right number of layers in the right orientation to get enough stiffness.

 

[Donald Qualls]

One thing that 3D printing has done for me, is put some projects within reach that I could not do otherwise, or not easily.

Exactly this. I haven't powered up my Ender 3 in more than a year, but I've been getting the itch to make a half-frame 127 "telescoping" camera -- nearly as compact as a bellows folder (like the Nagel/Kodak Vollenda or Baby Ikonta), and all 3D printable, plus adjustable for various 50 mm lens/shutter combinations (easily obtained from otherwise damaged 35 mm folders), With the frame gate narrowed a couple millimeters, the half frame format would work better with recut 120 and still be compatible with purchased 127, and I'd get 24 frames (about the same size as 828) on a roll cut from 120 -- plus two "load carefully" 18-20 frame rolls of 16 mm to fit my Minolta 16 format cameras.