Zeiss Planar 1:2,8 80mm leaf shutter stuck, Hasselblad does not even fire

[Love2Live]

HI there. What can l do about my Zeiss Planar 1:2,8 80mm chrome lens?

- The leaf shutter is closed, permanently
- When l mount it on my Hasselblad 500 EL/M, the Hasselblad shutter button presses but the shutter sequence with the mirror up/down mechanism doesn't engage, even though when l re-mount my Sonnar 1:4 150mm lens, it works just fine, same settings, just the lens has changed.
- What gives? Anybody recommend opening the lens up? If so, how do l do it? Remove the rear lens mount? What is likely to do wrong? (Please no sarcasm, l want real solutions).

Am considering converting this into a torture / murder theme park for ants, l lure them in with sugar then torture them with magnifying glasses and crushing pressure and the aperture blades finish them off. Hehe. Advice on how best to go about this also appreciated.



- Also could somebody explain in a nutshell the selling point of a planar lens apart from a near symmetrical layout in the elements? I'm guessing it doesn't give so much distortion when photographic tall objects from the ground?

 

[Kino]

 

[Love2Live]

Hi there, thanks for that fascinating (and terrifying) tear-down. It's not actually the same as my problem, which is: the leaf shutter is jammed, and l'm testing using the 500 EL/M, so the handle-turning is alien to me. As you can see, right from the start, the guy was able to open the leaf shutter. Mine is jammed.

Except, it's no longer jammed as l found a solution: turn the screw on the rear lens mount.

However, l now have a new problem: l turned the screw on another Hasselblad lens that also had a stuck leaf shutter, and l believe l have now dislodged the tiny pin adjacent to it. This means l am now in pretty serious trouble and have quite prossibly put the lens beyond repair.

Anybody got advice for attacking the Hasselblad V-series bayonet mount directly, i.e. from the rear?

A teardown where the lens mounting surface is removed would be super helpful, l don't mind which specific lens is used, as long as it's a Zeiss with a Hasselblad V-series bayonet mount.

 

[Theo Sulphate]

At this point, maybe consider sending the lens(es) to David Odess for repair and CLA. That way, when you get it back, you'll know you have something that's operating properly and that will last for a long time.

 

[Love2Live]

At this point, maybe consider sending the lens(es) to David Odess for repair and CLA. That way, when you get it back, you'll know you have something that's operating properly and that will last for a long time.

Boooo.
What kind of prices are we talking?

 

[Kino]

Sorry, Perhaps you can contact mikeno62 Youtube video for advice.

 

[Love2Live]

Sorry, Perhaps you can contact mikeno62 Youtube video for advice.

Thanks, l may do. I may just put my arm a little bit further down the crocodile's mouth first, before getting an expert to bail me out though.

What sort of prices are we looking at for a fix? I'm guessing the prices will be roughly the same, as there's a limited amount of things a lens can do anyway.

 

[BrianShaw]

Can you manually cock or release the lens off the camera?

Was/is the self-timer jammed?

 

[Theo Sulphate]

Boooo.
What kind of prices are we talking?

Sorry. Didn't see you were in UK because my phone browser doesn't show full-site web page unless I expand things.

Even so, consider professional repair.

 

[Love2Live]

Can you manually cock or release the lens off the camera?

Was/is the self-timer jammed?

Hi there, the self timer doesn't trigger anything, just wheezes for a bit then silence. I guess it's jammed. I'm not an actual medium format guy, l just acquired some bric-a-brac. I guess there's a reason it was discarded!

 

[Kino]

Slow speed escapement is dirty. That is what the video is cleaning. Sorry man, it takes some effort to DIY...

 

[btaylor]

Sorry, I just don’t get it. You have a top of the line professional tool. Why would you not have it repaired and serviced properly? Yes, decades old quality mechanical devices need to be serviced periodically and then they will provide years of reliable service. There have been many times I have paid more than the price I paid for older equipment to have it serviced so I could use it reliably. It’s just part of the cost of getting to use this great old stuff. Good luck.

 

[Love2Live]

Sorry, I just don’t get it. You have a top of the line professional tool. Why would you not have it repaired and serviced properly? Yes, decades old quality mechanical devices need to be serviced periodically and then they will provide years of reliable service. There have been many times I have paid more than the price I paid for older equipment to have it serviced so I could use it reliably. It’s just part of the cost of getting to use this great old stuff. Good luck.

Ok let me make this clear.

I want to know how to repair it.

I don't want to know what other things l can do other than repair it. Even if it is better (in your mind) to do this or that alternative thing.

[However, l have already been told about the cost of repair (by somebody that actually cared to give a quote of the likely cost).]

Slow speed escapement is dirty. That is what the video is cleaning. Sorry man, it takes some effort to DIY...

I don't know what you are saying or why you are apologising. Sorry. I think you are talking about the speed of the leaf shutter?

Let me repeat: i don't think this is the same case scenario as mine. I cannot state it better than that. It's just not the same problem.

My leaf shutter is just closed, period. Doesn't open, and mounting it on 'Blad doesn't change this, but in that video you posted, it does, so l don't think it's the same problem.

 

[BrianShaw]

Good luck... you need lots of it.

 

[removed account4]

hi OP
go to you toobe and search the name of your lens and "repair" or googgles and do the same thing.
you might also look for joe lippencot's book on repairing classic cameras or something similiar if you don't have the copper
https://www.amazon.com/Classic-Phot...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01N7M5CEI
me personally? i don't really see the point in damaging a shutter anymore than it is already damaged. so probably instead of 100-125$ it might end up costing 2x that, who knows...
and one feels like a real dolt when they bring a box of lens and shutter parts to a repair guy/gal and asks them to fix/reassemble it like some sort of puzzle.
have fun with your shutter ! ( and good luck )

 

[bdial]

Hopefully you are aware that the lens's shutter must be cocked to mount it on the camera. The body must be wound too, on an EL model, that's automatic if the battery is good, otherwise on a manual body, you turn the advance knob.
You can cock the shutter manually by turning the slotted shaft at the back of the lens with a coin or small small screwdriver until it latches. The small pin next to the shaft unlocks the latching mechanism so that the body can fire the shutter and partially regulate the rotation of the shaft. Sometimes a dodgy lens will operate correctly if it's on an extension tube, since the tubes also contain a latching mechanism on their wind shaft.

First off, does the wind shaft on the lens stay in the cocked position or does it rotate back when you release pressure when manually winding the lens?
When the shutter is cocked, pressing on the little pin should release the shutter, the operation is very fast when it's off the body, but you should see the shutter open, then close after whatever shutter speed is selected elapses.

If either of these things don't work, the lens needs some sort of service, if it's the first case, then the cause may be limited to the winding shaft and the latching mechanism. Otherwise your problem is probably in the shutter itself.

There are some very old threads in here that detail exactly how the lens and body interact that might be helpful to understand the goings-on. There are probably some youtube videos too, but I've never had a reason to seek those out.

 

[guangong]

For any used equipment that I buy, I assume it requires repair, and therefore include total cost into any purchase.
As for Hasselblad, doesn’t repair often require specialized Hasselblad tools?
Rather than botching up a piece of equipment, I let the experts deal with it.

 

[Love2Live]

hi OP
go to you toobe and search the name of your lens and "repair" or googgles and do the same thing.
you might also look for joe lippencot's book on repairing classic cameras or something similiar if you don't have the copper
https://www.amazon.com/Classic-Phot...=2025&creative=165953&creativeASIN=B01N7M5CEI
me personally? i don't really see the point in damaging a shutter anymore than it is already damaged. so probably instead of 100-125$ it might end up costing 2x that, who knows...
and one feels like a real dolt when they bring a box of lens and shutter parts to a repair guy/gal and asks them to fix/reassemble it like some sort of puzzle.
have fun with your shutter ! ( and good luck )

Hi thanks again for your practical advice, please may l ask: do you know any renowned repair guys in the UK?

By the way, l actually checked out your book link. O ... M .... G ... the price LOL! I don't think l've ever seen a book so expensive on Amazon! Would really like a flick through it though. We should have a group buy. Pass it around. The printing would probably become extinct by the end of it from blod sweat and tears hehe.


@btaylor
@Kino

Thank you for all your practical advice by the way. Sorry if l sounded upset, it's just that some people were not getting that l want repair advice even if it's a bad idea, l at least want a concept of the idea in order to call it a bad idea, you know?

The teardown video was a real eye opener. I'm only brave enough to take on a Hanimex and even then l think twice. This Zeiss medium format stuff is all new to me, never knew a manual lens could have so much gear inside, especially one so old.

 

[removed account4]

Sorry I am not in the UK so I can not help you, I am sure there are others here on this site that know exactly who to send it to.

 

[Love2Live]

Do you think a bricks and mortar photographic shop could do it justice?

 

[BrianShaw]

http://www.gres.co.uk/gres.htm

https://apertureuk.com/camera-repairs-london/

And if your near the great country of Scotland...

https://www.cameratiks.co.uk/repairs

 

[Love2Live]

Thank you squire. Re: Scotland being called a country - spot on, l had to Google it.

 

[BrianShaw]

Thank you sir. Re: Scotland being called a country - spot on, l had to Google it.

Ha ha ha. I got banned-for-life from an online forum many years ago for simply writing “Free Scotland”.

 

[Love2Live]

Ha ha ha. I got banned-for-life from an online forum many years ago for simply writing “Free Scotland”.

Well, l like the country, the accent and especially the Scottish Wildcat, which is a massive tabby, so l don't want them to leave the Union

Hopefully you are aware that the lens's shutter must be cocked to mount it on the camera. The body must be wound too, on an EL model, that's automatic if the battery is good, otherwise on a manual body, you turn the advance knob.
You can cock the shutter manually by turning the slotted shaft at the back of the lens with a coin or small small screwdriver until it latches. The small pin next to the shaft unlocks the latching mechanism so that the body can fire the shutter and partially regulate the rotation of the shaft. Sometimes a dodgy lens will operate correctly if it's on an extension tube, since the tubes also contain a latching mechanism on their wind shaft.

First off, does the wind shaft on the lens stay in the cocked position or does it rotate back when you release pressure when manually winding the lens?
When the shutter is cocked, pressing on the little pin should release the shutter, the operation is very fast when it's off the body, but you should see the shutter open, then close after whatever shutter speed is selected elapses.

If either of these things don't work, the lens needs some sort of service, if it's the first case, then the cause may be limited to the winding shaft and the latching mechanism. Otherwise your problem is probably in the shutter itself.

There are some very old threads in here that detail exactly how the lens and body interact that might be helpful to understand the goings-on. There are probably some youtube videos too, but I've never had a reason to seek those out.

@bdial my apologies l somehow missed you out. Your advice is absolute spot-on. That's how l managed to fix the lens in question (the one mentioned in the OP) ... but that is also how l managed to wreck another lens with the same issue a few minutes later hehe. BUT your advice has 2 rays of hope:

1. The small pin is key to it all. On my latest messed up lens, the small pin has disappeared, either snapped off or submerged. I may quickly remove the back to check, not necessarily fix.
2. I can use an extension tube. I'm guessing that would make it a crazy super macro lens. Shrugs, as long as that shutter is no longer jammed.


OK in answer to the rest of your post: In the latest fine mess of a lens, the wind shaft does not stay cocked, it rotates back, l believe doing two complete circles.

Guess it needs a service though according to your diagnosis, the fault may be limited to the windiing shaft and the latching mechanism.

Thank you sir, that helped a lot.

 

[Kino]

I don't know what you are saying or why you are apologising. Sorry. I think you are talking about the speed of the leaf shutter?

Let me repeat: i don't think this is the same case scenario as mine. I cannot state it better than that. It's just not the same problem.

My leaf shutter is just closed, period. Doesn't open, and mounting it on 'Blad doesn't change this, but in that video you posted, it does, so l don't think it's the same problem.

Leaf shutters most often do not jam; the leaves are most likely frozen shut by oil or grease on the surface. Now, that being said, they CAN jam physically, but 99% of all leaf shutter cameras I have worked on with a frozen shutter, sprang back to life after cleaning the blades free of oil. The mechanism will cycle, but the blades remain frozen; sound familiar?

The video I posted shows you how to get down to the shutter. Yes, the man is cleaning the slow speed escapement, not the shutter, but they probably BOTH should be cleaned.

However, even though I have cleaned many 35mm rangefinder shutters with Naphtha, I would would hesitate to take on this lens until I had done some major research, located parts diagrams, a repair manual and studied every video even tangentially related to repairing this particular lens and camera combo.