Zeiss Ikon... (6x9) need help with model

[KidA]

So I went to a camera show over the weekend and purchased a beautiful folding camera. I'd like to know the exact model name if you guys know. The closest I've come to conclude is 'Ikonta c mx', but I'm not 100% convinced. The details I can give you right now are:

-105mm f/3.5 lens (apparently coated)
-Says: 'Synchro Compur' on the front, not 'Zeiss Ikon' like many models I've seen online.
-I believe it's from the 50s

My apologies, I've never really not familiar with old folders. Any more details you need and I will answer.

Thanks!

 

[Helinophoto]

Post photos and also photos of details with any typing or numbers on them, and I am sure the guys here will find out quicker than you would imagine. =)

 

[Kyle M.]

I've owned a couple of 6x9 Ikonta's and on them the model number was embossed in the back covering, though I can't remember if it was on the hinge side or the latch side. The Synchro Compur shutter in most cases has a slightly higher shutter speed of 1/400sec or 1/500sec than the more often encountered Prontor and Prontor-S shutters with a top speed of 1/250sec or 1/300sec. If you have a Synchro-Compur shutter I'm guessing you have a Carl Zeiss lens as opposed to the cheaper Novar-Anastigmat but there are a lot of variations of shutter/lens combinations of Ikontas even with the same model number. Ikonta model numbers are usually if not always a 3 digit number followed by a slash and one number, such as a 521/2 for example.

 

[summicron1]

the model number should be embossed in the leather on the latch side of the back cover. If you post that, folks here can give you lots of details.

Is there a name also embossed in the leather on the front? Inside the back cover on the metal? What name is the lens?

All of these are identifiers.

 

[KidA]

Wow, I can't believe I missed that. It's a 'Super Ikonta 531/2'. It has a Zeiss Tessar lens. The shutter has top speed of 1/500.

 

[pbromaghin]

Top of the pre-war line, baby. 1937-38 or so. You bought it at a camera show last weekend... Are you in Denver?

 

[KidA]

Nope, it was in Toronto. Pre war?! Really? We're these lenses coated, then?

 

[Ian Grant]

Nope, it was in Toronto. Pre war?! Really? We're these lenses coated, then?

The first coated lenses from Zeiss were 1937/8 however your model Super Ikonta 531/2 camera was made from 1936 to 1953 so is most probably post WWII, you can check the Tessar's serial number and the one on the Compur, there's lists of dates for both.

Ian

 

[anfenglin]

I don't think there's been a prewar Synchro-Compur, they started making these in the 50s, before it was just Compur. The synchro means that it was synchronised for using a flash, the ones without flash synchronsation were called Compur Rapid (up to 1/500). Also your shutter says "mx"? That's a clue to a post war shutter, "mx" is both for flash sync, m and x mode.
I'd pay attention to the inscription on the lens, does it say "Carl Zeiss Jena Tessar" or something else without "Jena"? If the former is the case it's a prewar lens because Jena is in Thuringia which used to be East Germany, The Super Ikontas came from West Germany. The eastern part also built Ikontas (no Super Ikontas) and whatnot, but never ones with a rangefinder arm. The Top of the line Ikontas (east) were the Ercona and Ercona II. Great cameras!

 

[Ian Grant]

I don't think there's been a prewar Synchro-Compur, they started making these in the 50s, before it was just Compur. The synchro means that it was synchronised for using a flash, the ones without flash synchronsation were called Compur Rapid (up to 1/500). Also your shutter says "mx"? That's a clue to a post war shutter, "mx" is both for flash sync, m and x mode.
I'd pay attention to the inscription on the lens, does it say "Carl Zeiss Jena Tessar" or something else without "Jena"? If the former is the case it's a prewar lens because Jena is in Thuringia which used to be East Germany, The Super Ikontas came from West Germany. The eastern part also built Ikontas (no Super Ikontas) and whatnot, but never ones with a rangefinder arm. The Top of the line Ikontas (east) were the Ercona and Ercona II. Great cameras!

The Compur Rapid was used before the Synchro Compur and you're right flash sync wasn't added until after the war.

Ian

 

[AgX]

I don't think there's been a prewar Synchro-Compur, they started making these in the 50s.

In 1951 to be precise.

 

[anfenglin]

cool, thanks guys!

 

[Bill Burk]

For fun you can see what the camera can do... in my galleries look at the Russian River shots, Old Faithful, Dangerous Treehouse and Walnut Orchard - all taken with Super Ikonta 531/2 Zeiss-Opton Tessar 105/3.5

Old Faithful shows the wonders of a pinhole in the bellows. Others either don't show the pinhole, or are after I fixed that. There's a good deal of flare in my shots taken with sun shining into the lens. It's a look I enjoy but I have to be in the mood to accept that.

My lens is coated but the inside back lens has cleaning marks or fungus that adds to the flare. You might get better results from yours.

 

[KidA]

Not sure if I should start another thread but I have a question about the viewfinder. How the hell do you know where you're shooting?! All it is I are two pieces of glass that shows a much wider angle than what's actually included in the neg. The main thing, however is not so much the angle of view, but the actual aiming. How can I know what will be in the frame and also where it will be? Is it really a matter of trail and error? Is is safe to assume the the rangefinder is pointing right to the centre of the frame? I guess that would help.

 

[pbromaghin]

Adjust your eye distance so the 2 rectangles appear to be the same size and line them up.

 

[Andy38]

Hello,

This model is fitted with the Albada type finder.
You see on the rear of your camera what it is on the pic.
When you see in the viewfinder, the field covered is indicated by a white transparent boundary line ; it's this field which is included on the negative. The outside greater rectangle is for 6x9 cm pic ; the inside smaller is for 4,5x6 cm.
IMHO, it's not the best viewfinder...

 

[pbromaghin]

Forgot about the albada. Mine just has the cheap little squares.

 

[anfenglin]

Then just align the inner border of the two frames and you have a rough estimate. Nothing more. Those things were designed to be compact and non-obtrusive in a pocket or the leather pouch you used for carrying the camera around. You'll get used to it and with a little excercise you'll get better at judging how much of what you see in the finder will be in the shot.

 

[Andy38]

Forgot about the albada. Mine just has the cheap little squares.

Sorry, finder of your Super Ikonta is not complete (modified ?) : all 531/2 but the one with Novar lens have Albada.

 

[pbromaghin]

Oh, I just have 2 regular Ikontas with novars, a 521/16 and the much better 523/16. I have drooled over Super Ikontas for several years.

 

[Andy38]

Here are pics (second & third, rear & front) of the finder of the Super Ikonta 531/2 with Novar. It has a simple window because the camera has only one format, 6 x 9 cm.
The first pic is from the front of an Albada finder of a 531/2. Yours should be like this.