Would you buy a 100mm LCD shutter for $400?

polyglot · Apr 25, 2012

Hypothetically I can build 100mm LCD shutters (for barrel lenses) and sell them for about $400. They'd do 1/500 up to hours of exposure, plus intervalometer and x-sync. Optionally radio remote controllable for extra cost.

So, is there a market here? Your affirmative reply will not be taken as an undertaking to purchase!

Edit: I could do 150x150 for the same price if I got 15-20 orders with 50% deposit.

Any other comments welcome too...

(crossposted from LFPF)

trotkiller · Apr 25, 2012

Could you explain what a LCD shutter is and/or how it will work?

daveandiputra · Apr 25, 2012

http://www.liquidcrystaltechnologies.com/products/LCDShutters.htm I wonder if it's something similar like this is what polyglot means?

polyglot · Apr 25, 2012

That's exactly what I mean, daveandiputra. Just waiting to hear back from the manufacturer what the Dmax is. The idea is that I would buy LCDs from them, put them in a flange-mount and supply a controller box.

John Austin · Apr 25, 2012

First good electronic idea I have seen in ages - A big one mounted between bellows and front standard would be perfectest

Reminds me of the Alpa XS, but that was a 1st April Joke in 1969ish - The clue was in the "XS"

Anyone know how much a Sinar Shutter is worth these days?

John

LJH · Apr 25, 2012

Are these like the glass used in modern welding shields?

I love the Sinar shutters, especially their long (8 second) exposures.

But an accurate, minutes long shutter would be the duck's guts. Accurate, reciprocity-included long exposures? Yes, please!

I'd like it to be smaller and lighter than the Sinar, with a 125mm aperture for BIG brass would make me happy.

David A. Goldfarb · Apr 25, 2012

I suppose I'd pay $400 for an LCD shutter that was practical and that worked, but I have my doubts that it could be opaque enough when closed or transparent enough when open.

This FAQ from an LCD manufacturer isn't encouraging: http://www.liquidcrystaltechnologies.com/tech_support/LCDShutterConsiderations.htm

Of course, if it did work, it would be really cool if it could be connected to an iPhone by Bluetooth, with an app that would let you put in the film speed and aperture, filter factor, and bellows factor, tap once for Zone III, tap twice for Zone VIII, and it fires the shutter, records the exposure and a snapshot with the desired N+/- development time for your records.

polyglot · Apr 25, 2012

Note that that FAQ applies to TN crystals, not pi-cells.

Steve Smith · Apr 25, 2012

David A. Goldfarb said:
I have my doubts that it could be opaque enough when closed or transparent enough when open.

It will probably not be fully opaque when closed but it might be opaque enough as it only needs to be opaque for the time the dark slide is removed (other than the actual exposure).

For a camera with the film permanently exposed to the lens, it would probably not be dense enough.

Steve.

David A. Goldfarb · Apr 25, 2012

Info on the contrast ratio of pi-cells here:

http://www.liquidcrystaltechnologies.com/tech_support/Pi_Cell.htm

But even if you can improve the contrast ratio, it would seem that that would only make the opaque state darker--possibly dark enough for typical large format use, and not the open state clearer, which raises two questions:

How much light loss, transmissive and reflective, in the open state?

How neutral is the shutter optically? Will it introduce diffusion?

Shootar401 · Apr 25, 2012

David A. Goldfarb said:
Of course, if it did work, it would be really cool if it could be connected to an iPhone by Bluetooth, with an app that would let you put in the film speed and aperture, filter factor, and bellows factor, tap once for Zone III, tap twice for Zone VIII, and it fires the shutter, records the exposure and a snapshot with the desired N+/- development time for your records.

What he said

Steve Smith · Apr 25, 2012

David A. Goldfarb said:
Of course, if it did work, it would be really cool if it could be connected to an iPhone by Bluetooth, with an app that would let you put in the film speed and aperture, filter factor, and bellows factor, tap once for Zone III, tap twice for Zone VIII, and it fires the shutter, records the exposure and a snapshot with the desired N+/- development time for your records.

Then you could mount the camera on the GPS equipped walking tripod I'm working on and send it out on its own whilst you stay at home!

Steve.

E. von Hoegh · Apr 25, 2012

There will be the inevitable smartphone app.........

Brian C. Miller · Apr 25, 2012

And thus what was predicted in the late 1800s will come to pass, that the photographer shall stay at home whilst the camera walks by itself down the river bank, making pleasant and scenic photographs.

E. von Hoegh · Apr 25, 2012

Brian C. Miller said:
And thus what was predicted in the late 1800s will come to pass, that the photographer shall stay at home whilst the camera walks by itself down the river bank, making pleasant and scenic photographs.

This happens a lot in the digital world.

TheFlyingCamera · Apr 25, 2012

My big concern is the optical quality of the glass in the LCD, and the light loss when open, as David mentioned. Does the LCD material have any spectral absorption/diffraction qualities that might interfere with color accuracy projected on to film?

David A. Goldfarb · Apr 25, 2012

I rather prefer to do the walking down the river bank myself, whether I'm carrying a camera or not.

mark · Apr 25, 2012

Interesting idea but I too wonder about the optical quality of the glass.

Vaughn · Apr 25, 2012

No. KISS factor does the idea in for me.

polyglot · Apr 25, 2012

For those still interested, I can't get a straight answer from the manufacturers wrt contrast, so I'll probably just buy a small sample myself and do some testing.

polyglot · Apr 25, 2012

Brian C. Miller said:
And thus what was predicted in the late 1800s will come to pass, that the photographer shall stay at home whilst the camera walks by itself down the river bank, making pleasant and scenic photographs.

Google Streetview... note the number of people hunting down their cars and posing in order to create a meaningful image without cooperation from the photographer.

removed account4 · Apr 25, 2012

Vaughn said:
No. KISS factor does the idea in for me.

yup, me too

johnielvis · Apr 25, 2012

IF it works at sealing out the light and the glass/crystal doesn't have any "haze" to it when opened, sure I'd go for it....in orhter words--it has to really work with no caveats like any other shutter

Discoman · Apr 27, 2012

Maybe. There are too many variables and unknowns. For now, I will stick with my mechanical shutter, and maybe pick up a big 5FS for a large electronic shutter. But I do love the idea-a shutter with no moving parts, just simple electronics. Set a speed, the shutter gets a voltage pulse and goes transparent or opaque.
Didn't the old rapatronic cameras use some sort of electronic shutter that did this? LCDs were not invented yet, but I believe they used a similar idea.
That might be worth looking into.

polyglot · Apr 27, 2012

Rapatronic shutters are a Kerr cell. Same optical principle (polarisation rotation under external control) as an LCD except they're solid-state and triggered by a magnetic field instead of an electric field. That approach is much less feasible (you need huge electrical power) and probably optically not as clean as a modern LCD pi-cell.

Would you buy a 100mm LCD shutter for $400?

Would you pay $400 for a 100mm LCD shutter?

Yes, probably

Only if it were cheaper

No

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Would you buy a 100mm LCD shutter for $400?

Would you pay $400 for a 100mm LCD shutter?

Yes, probably

Only if it were cheaper

No

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