Will studio flash fry a Minolta X-700?

[Ric Trexell]

I have a flash outfit for my medium format camera, and was wondering if I could use it with a Minolta X-700, or will that fry the electronics? I know you are not supposed to with a digital camera as they will be toast if you do, but I was wondering about that camera. The X-700 comes with a regular PC flash socket so they must figure you would use one. Mine is a low power rig (Promaster) that is usually sold to beginners. It comes with two umbrellas. Anybody have any advice? Thanks. Ric.

 

[Steve Smith]

Probably not a problem. Most of the scaremongering with digital is a load of nonesense too.

The only way to be sure is to measure the voltage on the flash sync lead (whilst un-plugged from the camera) and see what the manual says about the cameras voltage rating.

When the X-700 was being made, cameras were designed to work with flashes and flashes were designed to work with cameras so I don't think there will be a problem.


Steve.

 

[brucemuir]

It's always good to test the sync voltage and know what your camera is rated for.

I did have an old Vivitar 283 that was in the 200v (have read reports of some in the 700v range, never seen one though) range but even my "Widowmakers" (Norman 900 series packs) sync at around 34v so I would test with a multi meter to be safe.

 

[CGW]

There always these Wein products:

http://www.weinproducts.com/safesyncs.htm

Shot lots with Nikon AF and F3&FE models on ProPhoto and Broncolor with no issues. You might be able to get a cheapie radio slave kit like a Yongnuo for less than the Wein thingies. Wireless is the way to go.

 

[brucemuir]

The problem with wireless is some flash units can fry the wireless receiver.
I use Elinchrome Skyports and they are rated for 100v.

You still need a safesync if your flash is putting out higher than your camera or wireless receiver can handle.

Don't know what PocketWizard can handle.

 

[Ian Grant]

Camera's like the X700 were designed to be used with studio flash units, it was never an issue with older cameras and really only became a problem with some down market SLR's with no proper flash sync (other than a hot shoe) and more recently with some heavily electronic autofocus cameras film and mainly digital.

Ian

 

[CGW]

The problem with wireless is some flash units can fry the wireless receiver.
I use Elinchrome Skyports and they are rated for 100v.

You still need a safesync if your flash is putting out higher than your camera or wireless receiver can handle.

Don't know what PocketWizard can handle.

Usually only a problem with old flash units like ancient Vivitar 283s, et al. that had lethal trigger voltages. Nikon and Canon speedlights aren't a problem. Trigger voltages on studio systems usually aren't hard to peg.

 

[fstop]

Biggest problem with studio flash is sync cords may or may not be compatible, don't force the plug into the socket. I know of one X700 that had to have the circuit board replaced because the plug was jammed in the socket and when pulled out, pulled the center post right out of the socket.

 

[2F/2F]

The X-700 is electronic. Looking at a few ratings for the case in hand is always a good idea in that case. I have also read that the X-700 behaves much like a modern electronic camera when it comes to the trigger voltages that it can handle.

Here is a list of many trigger voltages for various flashes: http://www.botzilla.com/photo/strobeVolts.html. Though the safe or unsafe call applies specifically to EOS cameras, the voltages are listed in the right column. So if you find your flash on that list, all you need to do is find the ratings for the flash circuitry of the X-700.

Check out this link as well: http://www.greenspun.com/bboard/q-and-a-fetch-msg.tcl?msg_id=003RBn. A poster claims that the X-700's flash circuitry is rated at only 4-6V, and that early XG cameras can be fried by 24V trigger voltages.

 

[CGW]

Biggest problem with studio flash is sync cords may or may not be compatible, don't force the plug into the socket. I know of one X700 that had to have the circuit board replaced because the plug was jammed in the socket and when pulled out, pulled the center post right out of the socket.

A PC type plug is all that fits an X700 or any other camera with a PC connection. If the male plug collar is squashed, then forcing it is the user's problem--not the connector's fault. No other type would fit anyway, regardless of how hard you hammered it.

 

[hoffy]

OK, sorry if I hijack this thread for a moment. How protected are the hot-shoes on these Minolta Camera's? I have been using an original (made in Japan) Vivitar 283 on the hot-shoe of my XE-1. I have measured the flash voltage and its nice 250V...... Am I waiting for disaster by continuing to use this flash? Or is it only the sync port that's the issue?

Cheers

 

[Ric Trexell]

One more option is to just use the slaves.

I think the best thing to do is for me to just use a Minolta flash in the hot shoe and use the studio lights as slaves. I can tape off the flash so that it is just enough to trip the slaves in the strobe(s) and that will be my fill and the strobes will be my main. They will never be hooked up directly to the camera. Sound ok? Thanks by the way for the help to all that gave me links and advice. You might have saved me from owning a Toast-o-matic 700.

 

[tkamiya]

Hoffy,

I've taken apart few cameras and all of them had center pin of the hot shoe connected in parallel to the center pin of the PC connector. That means no difference in protection or damage regardless of which port I'd use. I have no direct experience with X700 or anything Minolta.

 

[Steve Smith]

I have been using an original (made in Japan) Vivitar 283 on the hot-shoe of my XE-1.

I also have an XE-1 and some 283s and 285s and I wouldn't hesitate to connect them together. They were designed to be used together (not specifically, but generally). No one worried about this sort of thing when these products were new. If you had bought a new XE-1 in 1975 and you wanted a flash for it, it is very likely that you would have bought a 283 and just used it. It's just this recent digital paranoia which has got people worried for no reason.


Steve.

 

[hoffy]

Cheers guys,

The more I think of it, the more I realise that its just paranoia. The previous owner probably shot thousands of shots with it over the years without a hesitation....

Cheers

 

[Steve Smith]

The problem with wireless is some flash units can fry the wireless receiver.
I use Elinchrome Skyports and they are rated for 100v.

They are probably capable of working much higher than that. On another forum, someone was questioning the safe working voltage of the cheap Cactus triggers. I took mine apart and found that it used an opto-triac rated at 400 volts. It's very difficult, if not impossible, to find one of these components rated any lower. I suspect that these are used in most cameras now but manufacturers put a 250 volt maximum in their manuals to give a bit of a margin for error.


Steve.

 

[Wade D]

I have 2 X-700's that I bought new 25 years ago. Both have been used with a Vivitar 283 since then with no problems. Either in the hot shoe or from the PC terminal doesn't seem to matter. The only problem ever was the famous 'bad capacitor' issue on one body. It was an easy do-it-yourself fix.

 

[Steve Smith]

Although a lot of old flashes had high trigger voltages, the potential for damage is very small. Most trigger circuits consist of a very high value resistor (about 1M ohms) connected to the main high voltage source which is used to charge a small capacitor (about 10nF). When the flash is fired, this capacitor is discharged into the trigger transformer which produces a high voltage pulse which ionises the xenon gas in the tube causing it to conduct and therefore emit light.

Some people think that the camera contacts take the full current of the flash tube - this is not true. The camera contacts (or electronics) only takes the tiny charge in the small capacitor and applies it to the trigger transformer. Although this could be as high as the main high voltage supply, the source resistor is of such a high resistance that the current is limited to practically nothing.


Steve.

 

[Excalibur2]

I have a flash outfit for my medium format camera, and was wondering if I could use it with a Minolta X-700, or will that fry the electronics? I know you are not supposed to with a digital camera as they will be toast if you do, but I was wondering about that camera. The X-700 comes with a regular PC flash socket so they must figure you would use one. Mine is a low power rig (Promaster) that is usually sold to beginners. It comes with two umbrellas. Anybody have any advice? Thanks. Ric.

Just a thought if you want to use 35mm more:- you could still use your lenses on a SRT, these can be bought cheaply..I have this camera plus X-300 and X-700, and guess which one I would use.