Wife's choice of LF camera

Ian Grant · Apr 21, 2014

Today at a Flea market my wife took a shine to an old roll0film folder, it's an "Alliance Roll-film Camera Co. Ltd" camera and took 110 size roll film. This size roll film was introduced in 1898 and the negative frame size is 5"x4"

The Beck lens is in excellent condition and the pneumatic shutter works perfectly at all speeds, even 1 second is smooth and accurate, the bellows like new, not bad for a camera made somewhere between 1898 and 1904 when the Company was wound up, it was connected to Houghtons (later Houghton Butcher, Ensign etc).

Only fly in the ointment is my wife would like me to use it Only person I know who would make and coat film this size is Denise Ross (TheLightFarm). backing paper might be an issue and I've only one spool at present. I guess I could slit some old Aerial film and make a new spool, I've no idea yet how long a roll of 110 film was.

Ian

Mustafa Umut Sarac · Apr 21, 2014

When my sister saw my Box Tengor 54/2 from 1928 , she said this camera was 10 000 years old with today standarts , with 30 years difference , your camera looks newer than mine also

Chris Lange · Apr 21, 2014

Hack together a spool and mask for the film gate that would allow you to shoot 6x9, perhaps?

gone · Apr 21, 2014

It sure is a beauty and has obviously been well cared for. I think Chris has a good idea. You wouldn't need to be limited to 6x9. You could always try to get the full 5" on the 120 negs w/ the right mask, although figuring out where to stop and start the next frame would be the harder part. If you want to enlarge the photos then obviously 6x9 is the better way to go.

How about using paper negs for 4x5? I'd love to see some shots from it.

snapguy · Apr 21, 2014

FANtastic...

...camera. It begs to be used. Can you "Mickey Mouse" it to use 4x5 (as we say in the States) inch single sheet film? Is it possible you can use 120 film in it? You would not get all of the field of view, of course. You must wear a red tie or ascot when you use the camera of course.

ntenny · Apr 21, 2014

That is indeed a lovely camera. I didn't know there was an earlier incarnation of the 110 designation---I remember the tiny little cartridges from the 1970s.

Where is the red window? I guess that would affect the feasibility of 120. Worst case, cover the window and use it as a 5x4 one-shot. (It's easy enough for you, but in the States we would have to get 4x5 film and turn it sideways.

-NT

BrianShaw · Apr 21, 2014

If you can't "Mickey Mouse" it to use 120 film, then maybe you can be "Macguiver" it for 120.

BrianShaw · Apr 21, 2014

... but whatever you do, please don't "Rube Goldberg" it!

ntenny · Apr 21, 2014

American-to-English Translation Service:

"Mickey Mouse" => "bodge"
"Macguiver" => "MacGyver"
"Rube Goldberg" => "Heath Robinson"

Bilingual since too long ago to want to reveal my age and decrepitude,

-NT

Ian Grant · Apr 21, 2014

Chris Lange said:
Hack together a spool and mask for the film gate that would allow you to shoot 6x9, perhaps?

6x12 maybe I do shoot 6x17 and that camera allows 6x12, and 6x15 as well.

snapguy said:
...camera. It begs to be used. Can you "Mickey Mouse" it to use 4x5 (as we say in the States) inch single sheet film? Is it possible you can use 120 film in it? You would not get all of the field of view, of course. You must wear a red tie or ascot when you use the camera of course.

If my wife didn't want to actually display the camera (in Turkey) I'd probably make a plate holder back for it or just use the lens.shutter on one of my LF cameras.

The 6x12 option would be most fun and relatively easy, but I do have some wide Aerial film on a roll so home made backing paper's needed. I could make my own film emulsion (I've a few years experience) if needed but that's long term.

Ian

Ian Grant · Apr 21, 2014

ntenny said:
That is indeed a lovely camera. I didn't know there was an earlier incarnation of the 110 designation---I remember the tiny little cartridges from the 1970s.

Where is the red window? I guess that would affect the feasibility of 120. Worst case, cover the window and use it as a 5x4 one-shot. (It's easy enough for you, but in the States we would have to get 4x5 film and turn it sideways.

-NT

There's a big red window on the back, it's central but would it work for say 6x12 I'd have to try it.

Joking apart the 5x4 or 4x5 issue affects some camera design, some shoot the 5" across the width, others over the length. 110 film shoots one way 109 the other and I've not had a chance to really look into it yet.

Whatever I do I won't compromise this camera by a bodged attempt at modification - Mickey Mouse/McGuiver/Rube Goldberg/Heath Robinson or whatever , I'm already about to build a 6x17/5x4 camera. Just be nice to use as it is.

Ian

summicron1 · Apr 21, 2014

tape off the red window and do one-offs with 4 by 5 sheet film. If you take a changing bag with you it would be very possible and not that complicated -- certainly less hassle than cobbing together a roll of film of some sort.

if you must, perhaps there are old stocks of aerial camera film around? Those things shot 4 by 5 on rolls, although I forget which way they ran so the 5 inch side may be on the wrong side.

AgX · Apr 21, 2014

The best way would be to use 5" aerial film and DIY it into rollfilm apt for that camera.

Xmas · Apr 21, 2014

HiIan
you need 30m of Hp5+ on this years ULF.
Noel

ntenny · Apr 21, 2014

The problem with rolls of aerial film is, how would he know how far to advance between frames? DIY backing paper would be possible but sounds like a big pain in the neck.

-NT

Two23 · Apr 21, 2014

You could make a practice roll from some other material, mark the back in 4.5 inch rectangles, and see how many times you have to wind it in the camera to advance far enough to avoid overlap. Keep a count of how many winds you have to make for each frame. This would be easier than going the backing paper route I would think.

Kent in SD

MattKing · Apr 21, 2014

If that is your wife's choice of camera ....

Clearly you made a good choice of wife

nosmok · Apr 21, 2014

Backing paper may not be that big of a deal-- just get TWO rolls of 616 or 116 film, and overlap the papers all along their length to the correct width, and tape together with the thinnest tape you can find. Then mark your home-made backing paper correctly for the red window on the camera and you are set. Because of the double thickness of backing paper you might lose a shot or two from what you'd get from a proper roll of 110, but so what? You've still got a 4x5 camera that fits in the map pocket of your motorcycle jacket, or the front pocket of your bib overalls. Way cool.

--nosmok

Xmas · Apr 22, 2014

a good craft shop or google should be able toget you a roll of paper you would need to make a splitter to get it to exact side or use scissors and ruler.
Paper is easier than film.
you would need paper as the film run probably would not have beed designed like a 220 cameras.
Ian also needs spools... wood dowelling cores etc.
a ULF run is the big problem or other large roll and splitter in dark room.
Or shelf queen.
Does his wife have sisters?

Cybertrash · Apr 22, 2014

It's a shame that these larger roll film formats went the way of the dodo, the cameras seem so much more compact compared to modern 5x4 cameras.

Ian Grant · Apr 22, 2014

I have a roll of aerial film, 8" wide, so it would be a case of slitting this and attaching to backing paper. I might use thin light proof cloth instead of backing paper I have plenty that I use for shutter restorations and it would be re-useable. Alternatively I might make my own backing paper, I have some ideas that should work.

Two23 said:
You could make a practice roll from some other material, mark the back in 4.5 inch rectangles, and see how many times you have to wind it in the camera to advance far enough to avoid overlap. Keep a count of how many winds you have to make for each frame. This would be easier than going the backing paper route I would think.

Kent in SD

I'll do much the same as you're suggesting to find where to mark a backing paper. Now I need to find some adverts etc for 110 cameras/film to see how many exposures were on a film, Houghtons films for similar formats seem to be 6 exposures. I guess it's what'll fit on a spool as well.

Ian

Steve Smith · Apr 22, 2014

Ian Grant said:
I'm already about to build a 6x17/5x4 camera. Just be nice to use as it is.

One of my unfinished projects is a horizontal only 5x7 or 6x17 camera. I had a spare set of bellows from my DeVere 54 enlarger which are rectangular and will clear a 5x7 negative.

Steve.

Wife's choice of LF camera

Moderator

Privacy & Transparency

Privacy & Transparency