(wide enlarging lens) fellow apugians, I need your help.

I've read the following threads which have delt with enlarging super 8:

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I am taking a murals class this semester at school and I am seeking to do the same thing. Enlarging super 8mm and 16mm film to make a print which is at least 30" on one side. I don't have a darkroom at my disposal so I'm looking for an enlarging lens which is WIDE (to accomodate the schools enlargers). I was wondering if there is anybody in the Toronto area who is willing to let me borrow there wide enlarging lens for the semester. You would be reimbursed in the form of prints if your interested! I have only read about such lenses... some 35mm lenses on ebay but are $$$$.

I've also been looking into projection lenses like: http://www.ebay.ca/itm/BOLEX-MULTIM...820?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item3cc1ae2394

also using leica thread mount lenses: I have the voigtlander 12mm

I assume these will work but I am unsure.... I just need some guidence

I know I could internegative or whatever but that is a last resort, I am assuming I will loose grain with the process. I am looking for the most grain possible. It also fits more into my philosophy by using the motion film strait up (I'm an artist [not really photographer] give me a break). I'm looking for guidance here also; will I end up with the same print using an internegative as using the film strait up? If not what will the differences be?

would you be able to rig a slide projector to do film stills ?
( or make a 8mm slide projector by replacing the original projection lens with your wide one
and masking your film stock when you project it )
if you could you would be able to project on the wall to
get your enlargements projected.
i have a tiny lens i use for enlarging 8mm with a enlarger ...
but since you don't have an enlarger at your disposal, a projector might work too.

i would have suggested a 8mm movie projector but the hot bulb might flash your film.

good luck with your project !
john

Well first, you probably need to do some math and determine exactly what focal length you're going to need. You'd hate to get something and find that it's not right.

If by LTM lenses, you mean 35mm lenses, I think you'll run into incredibly expensive optics. You only need something that covers 16mm at max, so looking at old projectors or 16mm camera lenses seems like the way to go. I'd bet that there are some old Bell & Howell lenses in the wide category that you could pick up cheap.

But that 20mm lens on eBay.. for 8mm or 16mm film, 20mm isn't all that wide. You need to project a 30" image from an 8mm film, in the short distance provided by your enlarger.

What kind of enlarger do you have access to? How high does it go and how large is the baseboard? I think if we know those things, we can easily calculate what focal length you need to shoot for.

Unless you are printing from super 8 negative film, you will want to make an internegative. If you make you internegative about the size of the largest film your enlargers handle (like 4x5in) you will be much better off than enlarging straight to 30" (because diffraction will kill you).

For example, get some orthochromatic negative film. Enlarge your 8mm positive onto that to a size of 4x5" like making a little 4x5" print. Process that in Dektol (or whatever print developer you have) under the safe light, just like making a print.

Now you have a 4x5" negative which you can now easily enlarge to 30" in a 4x5 enlarger. You don't need any special lenses for that. A 50mm lens should be able to make a 4x5" image from your super8 frame.

I have done some good single-stage Minox enlargements to 16x20 using a 25mm Schneider enlarging lens with an Omega 4x5 enlarger and XL column all the way to the top. The 8x11mm frame does not cover the whole paper but it is pretty good.

ic-racer,

How about trying to make a 56x80mm interpositive of a super8 frame on 2003 expired Fuji CDU 70mm duplicating film? How to successfully develop a piece of 70mm film? I have access to lab E6 chems, and I also have a Jobo 3010 as well as 3012 drum, but this film is much more flimsy than 4x5 sheet film and it seems to me it would stick to the walls of either drum. Those big 70mm reels and tanks are becoming somewhat hard to find, at least here in Europe. Any suggestions?

Thanks
d_rookie

darkroom_rookie said:

ic-racer,

How about trying to make a 56x80mm interpositive of a super8 frame on 2003 expired Fuji CDU 70mm duplicating film? How to successfully develop a piece of 70mm film? I have access to lab E6 chems, and I also have a Jobo 3010 as well as 3012 drum, but this film is much more flimsy than 4x5 sheet film and it seems to me it would stick to the walls of either drum. Those big 70mm reels and tanks are becoming somewhat hard to find, at least here in Europe. Any suggestions?

Thanks
d_rookie

Click to expand...

Well, if your super8 is a positive and your Fuji CDU 70mm is positive, you will still need to make an internegative. You can get Ortho film from Freestyle. If you enlargers go to 6x8cm then just make a 6x8cm negative on a 4x5in pice of film. You could use Efke PL 25 ORT Orthochromatic 4x5/25 ($37).

The only way I have found to hold 16mm, and Minox film flat for enlarging is with a glass carrier. So, if you can track one of those down you can make a perfectly grain-sharp internegative. If you don't have access to that , then just experiment.

ic-racer,

Sorry, should have mentioned that the super8 frame is also color - a color positive. Basically, I got some good results with this improvised reversal RA-4 technique, but the contrast goes way up very easily. I figured this film, low contrast by design, plus expiration, could help with the contrast issue. BTW, I can get anything Efke directly at the factory, though their minimal orders are increasing. I have a glass carrier with top AN glass.

Why not use a cine lens? something like ebay item# 300651428048
You will probably have to rig up a custom made lensboard for it.