Why is there so much velvia100f in sheets?

StoneNYC · Nov 15, 2013

Alan Klein said:
I think you are right because the shadow areas show more detail in the wide angle shot. So the details had to be there in the original. I probably added more contrast and saturation to the zoomed in picture. Of course this raises a point. If you not printing chemically, and why would you nother using chromes in that case, then the opriginal colors can change anyway once you scan and adjust. So what matter which Velvia version you select?

Thnaks Stone for your comments too. Alan.

Hey Alan,

I think it's because I like to have some sort of truth in my image, I don't use Photoshop, and I don't understand how to manipulate images in that way, I do know that I like the image to appear the way it is on film on the screen, with chrome's I can look at the image and make sure that the scan matches the actual chrome on a lightboard that's in front of me. Also there's sort of this I don't know how to explain it but it's a look, I can usually spot a chrome over some other version of an image simply because of the special look, I think it's the way the black drops off in the shadows and gives a sort of definitive line to areas of the image almost like a drawing when the artist from say a comic book, has to outline things with a black ink first.

I also like the saturation, I tend to personally do a lot of long exposure work with my chrome's, and in that situation I have not found a way to duplicate the kind of saturation that I get with a chrome in digital form without it looking really poor.

I also certainly can't get the same look with C-41 film, not even EKTAR100 will match my chrome images, and I've only seen one image made by Polyglot on Ektar100 that ever matched the kind of look I enjoy with film.

Because I don't print optically, at least not yet, I enjoy shooting the crumbs and then scanning them much better than I do shooting color negative film and then scanning that.

Perhaps someday when I start to print optically, I'll regret not having the originals on a different type of film, but I just love the results I get, and the power of looking at the images on a light box.

I started to consider maybe switching some of my smaller format onto C-41 but still shooting the large-format chromes, there's nothing like seeing a 4 x 5 color chrome on the lightbox is just so amazingly powerful!

Poisson Du Jour · Nov 15, 2013

Velvia 100F is difficult to scan because of its quirky red and yellow-green channels that are almost always overcooked when picked up by scanners. The palette must be stripped and virtually rebuilt to get the right look, then the printing difficulties too. Really, too much trouble for what it's worth. 100F was never popular, almost thought of as an experiment that had gone badly wrong for Fuji, and they know it. Velvia 100 is essentially the same as 50: a boost to the speed but with a lower clipping point; it is known for its very pure whites but it can look way too red/purplish when scanned. Like 100F, its greens are nowhere near as triumphant as 50. The majority of photographers will always gravitate back to RVP 50 after disappointing themselves (or having a disaster) using either/both of 100 or 100F. I finished using 100F around 4 years ago after scrutining a lot of work done on it in rainforests (heaps of green), afterglow (after sunset — purple, pink and blue) and was reasonably happy with the last category but never with rainforest imaging: it just was not right under polarisation and the greens were lily-livered and lacking in delivery. As for 100, very easily blowing out highlights and blocking up shadows — akin to a slap in the face and a sock in the eye, was enough to throw out the other 3 rolls. If photographers want to use 100 I recommend very careful metering and err on the side of underexposure (e.g. –0.3). If anything blows (e.g. mild spectrals in water, on trees etc.) it will be unrecoverable.

StoneNYC · Nov 15, 2013

Poisson Du Jour said:
Velvia 100F is difficult to scan because of its quirky red and yellow-green channels that are almost always overcooked when picked up by scanners. The palette must be stripped and virtually rebuilt to get the right look, then the printing difficulties too. Really, too much trouble for what it's worth. 100F was never popular, almost thought of as an experiment that had gone badly wrong for Fuji, and they know it. Velvia 100 is essentially the same as 50: a boost to the speed but with a lower clipping point; it is known for its very pure whites but it can look way too red/purplish when scanned. Like 100F, its greens are nowhere near as triumphant as 50. The majority of photographers will always gravitate back to RVP 50 after disappointing themselves (or having a disaster) using either/both of 100 or 100F. I finished using 100F around 4 years ago after scrutining a lot of work done on it in rainforests (heaps of green), afterglow (after sunset — purple, pink and blue) and was reasonably happy with the last category but never with rainforest imaging: it just was not right under polarisation and the greens were lily-livered and lacking in delivery. As for 100, very easily blowing out highlights and blocking up shadows — akin to a slap in the face and a sock in the eye, was enough to throw out the other 3 rolls. If photographers want to use 100 I recommend very careful metering and err on the side of underexposure (e.g. –0.3). If anything blows (e.g. mild spectrals in water, on trees etc.) it will be unrecoverable.

Good to know this is great info, thanks, I've heard before people say that you should underexposed it and read it at 80 or something like that, so that makes sense. What I want to know is where to get one of these special color filters for long exposure, that are mentioned in the data sheets I need a 77mm if possible.

DREW WILEY · Nov 15, 2013

One man's medicine is another man's poison. I thought 100F was the pick of the litter. But any Velvia will be hard to actually print, and needs
very careful metering. I only used it for low-contrast scenes which needed a deliberate boost. Alas, the selection of slide films in general is
rapidly collapsing.

Poisson Du Jour · Nov 15, 2013

I probably referred to it as the "pick of the litter", or words to that effect, years and years ago working solely in 35mm (the hardest format to get right with Velvia). The results printed to Ilfochrome, frankly, looked bloody awful.. RVP 50 is quite easy to print in the hybridised (A->D) process, no problems there and it really does come up beautifully, but like everything else, the end result depends on how well you have exposed the scene. The low-contrast scenes you speak of are the target use of RVP 50. It's not unheard of for any Velvia to be used in weddings and commercial jobbing, though I cringe at the thought of a bride with rosy cheeks coming up ... bolder than roses, so to speak.

StoneNYC · Nov 15, 2013

Poisson Du Jour said:
I probably referred to it as the "pick of the litter", or words to that effect, years and years ago working solely in 35mm (the hardest format to get right with Velvia). The results printed to Ilfochrome, frankly, looked bloody awful.. RVP 50 is quite easy to print in the hybridised (A->D) process, no problems there and it really does come up beautifully, but like everything else, the end result depends on how well you have exposed the scene. The low-contrast scenes you speak of are the target use of RVP 50. It's not unheard of for any Velvia to be used in weddings and commercial jobbing, though I cringe at the thought of a bride with rosy cheeks coming up ... bolder than roses, so to speak.

What is the A->D process?

wildbill · Nov 16, 2013

StoneNYC said:
What is the A->D process?

analog to digihell

StoneNYC · Nov 16, 2013

wildbill said:
analog to digihell

OH, yea I'm not wealthy enough for ILFOCHROME

Poisson Du Jour · Nov 16, 2013

StoneNYC said:
What is the A->D process?

Analogue to digital hybridised colourimetric print production.

Beats the shit out of Ilfochrome.

StoneNYC · Nov 16, 2013

Poisson Du Jour said:
Analogue to digital hybridised colourimetric print production.

Beats the shit out of Ilfochrome.

In what way?

biedron1 · Nov 16, 2013

StoneNYC said:
I do know that I like the image to appear the way it is on film on the screen, with chrome's I can look at the image and make sure that the scan matches the actual chrome on a lightboard that's in front of me.

.

there's nothing like seeing a 4 x 5 color chrome on the lightbox is just so amazingly powerful!

Exactly!!!

Poisson Du Jour · Nov 16, 2013

biedron1 said:
Exactly!!!

Yes, chromes illuminated on a lightbox do grab attention. I've had my fair share of interruptions this week with people looking over my back...

But there's just one thing wrong with the statement: a scan from a chrome is always, always, an approximation, it can never be the same as the chrome you are looking at on the lightbox, in the same way that a darkroom print may not look the same in nuances as the negative what can you do with a negative? How long is a piece of string? What can you do with a chrome? Same question! That is because film has infinite permutations of colour; the scan is RGB, although the gammut is expanded and contracted during work to the point where it can virtually equal the film colour space a very vast improvement over 20 years ago when film looked bloody terrible from even high end scanners.

Hatchetman · Nov 16, 2013

Any recommendations for where to send 4x5 slide film to get processed and decent scans?

StoneNYC · Nov 16, 2013

Hatchetman said:
Any recommendations for where to send 4x5 slide film to get processed and decent scans?

Yeah this question two for me ^^^

Although I think I may be getting a processor soon, and so I'll be doing my own processing, and so then I will probably be doing my own scanning, but I do have a backlog of 4 x 5 color transparencies, at least 25 and I need to send them somewhere, I found a few places that do them, but I don't know if ones better than the other, and I was surprised to find out that Dwayne's photo does not to do 4x5's I was disappointed because I would prefer they do it I know they're very good with their chemistry even if they're scanning sucks

wblynch · Nov 18, 2013

But it and Use it or soon you will Lose it.

StoneNYC · Nov 18, 2013

wblynch said:
But it and Use it or soon you will Lose it.

Huh? Why will I lose it?

Even if I don't shoot it for five or 10 years, I could still use it and it would still be good because it's frozen, and also I will of course be able to make a batches of chemistry from scratch if I needed to... It's just much easier to send it off to someone to have it processed because four by fives are more difficult, but soon I will have a processor and then it should be easy in theory

wblynch · Nov 18, 2013

If no one buys the current stock they won't order new stock and Fuji will kill it all off due to no demand.

Then you will be crying, wishing you could at least buy Velvia 100F in 4x5. But no luck. It will be gone. All gone.

Ilford and Kodak won't be there to help you. You've got basically one game for 4x5 color transparencies.

StoneNYC · Nov 18, 2013

wblynch said:
If no one buys the current stock they won't order new stock and Fuji will kill it all off due to no demand.

Then you will be crying, wishing you could at least buy Velvia 100F in 4x5. But no luck. It will be gone. All gone.

Ilford and Kodak won't be there to help you. You've got basically one game for 4x5 color transparencies.

Well Ferrania will be making some soon (supposedly) but it's the Velvia100 I'm after, and I just bought a box now. I was more just annoyed that B&H didn't understand that they were two different films, and that they wouldn't purchase the other type since they had so much stock of the 100 F, which is really stupid. I couldn't explain to them that the two films are very different films even though they have a similar name, the guy just didn't get it.

wblynch · Nov 18, 2013

I really, really want Ferrania to succeed.

StoneNYC · Dec 9, 2013

Hey guys, bringing up this thread because I need a little assistance.

I just noticed that Velvia 100 F is no longer available at B&H either, and so I called them to ask.

It seems the buyer was under the impression that the entire Velvia family was discontinued including the 100, and that he is unable to get it.

I remember that somebody actually contacted Fuji recently, to ask which films were still available in the US, and the list included Velvia 100 only, so the buyer asked me if I could figure out whom at Fuji said that because he would like to buy some, but is unable to do so because he doesn't know who to contact.

I've done a search here, and I found a bunch of threads, but I couldn't find the one where the email reply was actually listed. With a name of a Fuji representative.

Thanks.

Trail Images · Dec 13, 2013

StoneNYC said:
Hey guys, bringing up this thread because I need a little assistance.

I just noticed that Velvia 100 F is no longer available at B&H either, and so I called them to ask.

It seems the buyer was under the impression that the entire Velvia family was discontinued including the 100, and that he is unable to get it.

I remember that somebody actually contacted Fuji recently, to ask which films were still available in the US, and the list included Velvia 100 only, so the buyer asked me if I could figure out whom at Fuji said that because he would like to buy some, but is unable to do so because he doesn't know who to contact.

I've done a search here, and I found a bunch of threads, but I couldn't find the one where the email reply was actually listed. With a name of a Fuji representative.

Thanks.

I replied to this the other day but apparently I did something wrong for it not to post. Anyway, I worked with B&H at least 6 months ago on this issue. At the time they only showed Provia and had dropped all Velvia in sheets after the last demise of the 50. This was after me going back and forth with Fuji Japan and Fuji USA on the issue of all Velvia sheets. In communications with Fuji Japan and USA the answers vary. In fact, if you look at Pro films listed on the USA site today they still show 50 being available in 4x5. And of course this was long after the petition & lost effort to keep 50 going here in the USA and other locales such as the UK, etc.

After a period of time B&H brought back the 100 & 100f. So, it's anyone's guess as to what chromes they are going to keep going in sheet. My take is Provia seems to be they're apparent choice, that being Fuji, not the public. Kind of sad when V-50 was their real claim to fame all these years. Once my 200 sheets of 50 are gone I'll use Provia and lots of warming applications as needed.

StoneNYC · Dec 13, 2013

Trail Images said:
I replied to this the other day but apparently I did something wrong for it not to post. Anyway, I worked with B&H at least 6 months ago on this issue. At the time they only showed Provia and had dropped all Velvia in sheets after the last demise of the 50. This was after me going back and forth with Fuji Japan and Fuji USA on the issue of all Velvia sheets. In communications with Fuji Japan and USA the answers vary. In fact, if you look at Pro films listed on the USA site today they still show 50 being available in 4x5. And of course this was long after the petition & lost effort to keep 50 going here in the USA and other locales such as the UK, etc.

After a period of time B&H brought back the 100 & 100f. So, it's anyone's guess as to what chromes they are going to keep going in sheet. My take is Provia seems to be they're apparent choice, that being Fuji, not the public. Kind of sad when V-50 was their real claim to fame all these years. Once my 200 sheets of 50 are gone I'll use Provia and lots of warming applications as needed.

I haven't seen any announcement stating that they are getting rid of Velvia 100 in 4x5 though... Just Velvia100f (a while ago) and Velvia50 recently... But 100 was still supposed to be available.

It's still available at adorama, I just bought a box, but I wanted to buy it from B&H just because I tend to like their system better and I order from them often so I could order a bunch of stuff at once. I don't have the kind of money to buy a stock in it, just one or two boxes at a time I have enough transparencies to last me the entire year I believe, but then again I don't shoot transparencies very often, only when I'm going to a specific place.

I know that Provia100f is the most versatile it's the only one that can handle people, but Velvia is just so great for landscapes and skyline images of sunrise and sunset, I hate to lose it when I'm just getting started in LF... I know I can still use it for panoramics with my 6x12 back in 120 (for now running through my Velvia50 stash) but still ...

Gah! It's so frustrating...

Trail Images · Dec 13, 2013

I totally agree, Stone. Frustration is the name of the film situation as we know it these days. We just make do with what is available and hope for the best long term. Hope you can connect on more 100 going forward. Although like you I also buy tons of stuff from B&H for the same reasons you've mentioned, however, they seem much less tuned into LF needs then Badger Graphics.
Good luck.

StoneNYC · Dec 13, 2013

Trail Images said:
I totally agree, Stone. Frustration is the name of the film situation as we know it these days. We just make do with what is available and hope for the best long term. Hope you can connect on more 100 going forward. Although like you I also buy tons of stuff from B&H for the same reasons you've mentioned, however, they seem much less tuned into LF needs then Badger Graphics.
Good luck.

Does badger graphics have an app? And the same pricing as B&H?? That's the main draw for me hah!

Trail Images · Dec 13, 2013

Pricing is comparable between B&H and Badger on LF film. Not sure about the app though....

Why is there so much velvia100f in sheets?

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