- Joined
- Apr 27, 2008
- Messages
- 27
- Format
- Multi Format
Sorry but it seems you're opinions are based on profound ignorance of computers, imaginging sofware, and technology in general. No offense intended, so please don't take it.
Yea, sure, printing with an inkjet with the best inks and best paper is going to cost you pennies per 4" x 6"...lots and lots of money.
Right.
Another false economy, to be sure. ;-)
As I said before, if you can't make money with either film or digital, then you just can't make money.
If we just lookat this commercially - do you think the customer expects photoshop and the latest greatest hardwear - or free software running on an old $50 pentium 4? Which service would your $$ buy?
I don't think they care about the nuts and bolts of how it gets done so much as whether or not the finished product looks like what they expect and is delivered in a format that they expect.
and your here to save all us heathens eh???
No, It comes as an ex digital pro (working for pantone, scitex and heidelberg among others) who decided after working with Photoshop day in day out for ten years that it was all lies! damn lies! and came back to the light! (for want of a more fitting metaphor). To add to that, Im Apple certified for final cut, and teach digital video, Special effects for moving image, interactive media and graphic design for a living. I know the digital process like the back of my hand, thats why I can reject it.
You can keep your $150 DSLR and your $50 printer, its the domain of the amateur, Ill shoot film and well see who still has an archive of usable images in ten years!
You seem to feel the need to justify your use of the digital process, as you steer every topic back to the same debate. I think we should get back on topic here, rather than engage in another film vs digital debate...
Actually, I keep coming back to the theme that film and digital are both fantastic mediums to make awesome pictures. It is people like you that trash one or the other that I find amazing. ;-) I also realize that those that shoot large formats are most often better off with film, for the best quality. However for medium format and smaller, digital has caught up to film, but not in a way to replace film, but as an alternative medium for making a picture. As to making prints, regardless of capture method (film or digital) I think a wet print makes the best print, and a wet print is so "filmish", to be sure.
Funny you bring up film vs. digital. If you look at all my posts, I actually don't do the "film vs. digital" thing. I do the "film and digital are both great" thing. I shoot both and will not trash either, however I have no problem admitting the strengths and weaknesses of each, unlike others. ;-)
I would invite you to continue to shoot film, and I think that is great, and frankly, I will join you in shooting film too, and the next ten plus years. However I will shoot digital too, and for applications that it can benefit my vision.
Oh, give it up. No one is making any money here on this forum, nor is anyone convincing anyone else of anything. As I said before, if you can't make money with either film or digital, then you just can't make money.
Just to clarify, I meant that nobody is making any money by arguing the point here on the forum, not that nobody on this forum is making money.......
This is a very annoying thread. Why are we wasting our time and energy arguing the merits of which technology is better or cheaper? Didn't the art world have heartburn when photography first came out calling it "non-art"? PLEASE! Lets move on and talk about how we can improve our picture taking abilities versus which freaking technology is better.
Thats fine, I have no problem with you using digital, I have no problem with the obvious benefits such as wedding photography, in which the client wants instant reults from 100+ images. Cost however, is not one of them... as J Brunner has so elequently put it, he uses both, he has the book-keeping to show it, he knows!!
This discussion was suppposed to be about the business sense in shooting film... your arguments about the way in which DSLR markets work (initial investment and then little running cost) prove that for businesses supplying the photography market, film is a better model to weather the financhial crisis we are in. A slow burn, rather than an instant hit.
Film users contribute small amounts over a longer period, no bang and bust scenario. I hope that this makes the industry pay a little bit more attention to this market in the future.
First off, using digital for weddings is never about instant results. I shoot raw digital and raw is never about instant results. Every single keeper has to be mastered in the dry darkroom, and that takes time.
What works for Jason does not necessarily work for a wedding photographer. I shoot 20 weddings/year and I TOO have the bookkeeping to show that using mostly digital is a lot cheaper then using film.
And your blanket statement that film is a better business model is laughable, to be sure. Perhaps this is the case for Jason, his large format fine art pictures, but not necessarily for other genres, other markets. In the wedding genre, for example, film is exceedingly more costly then digital. And I know, I shoot both.
I love and use both, but I find it sad that digital is trashed for reasons that are highly exaggerated, or plain out false. Lets stop the bashing of either to make the other look better, because doing this means untruths and exaggerations get introduced, as is the case with most religions, and issues of emotion.
This thread is high on emotion, religion, and very low on truth, business sense, and objectivity. Lots of myths, and urban ledgend going on here.
Why are you so bothered by this thread? It's just a lively discussion, of the type we had back in college, and even now when we brainstorm here at Apple Computer. It's about discourse, the exchange of ideas, being tolerant. Don't take things so hard ;-)
Ok, ok, already! I get that you like digital, that fine, its totally fine with me! but lets just agree to differ, or everyone else on the forum will start to get real pissed with us!
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It was not a thread about film as opposed to digital.
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Shhesh!! The forum is about analog photography right? That is what I joined to discuss... Ill try to avoid these silly digital topics in the future.
I shoot 20 weddings/year and I TOO have the bookkeeping to show that using mostly digital is a lot cheaper then using film.
So over the next year, the users on this site have the opportunity to demonstrate to the major brands that film makes business sense...so just like I intend to, make a New Year resolution to work out what you can afford and give your favourite brands a big order for 2009, and remind them that we are out here if they need us, because we definitely need them.
Good photography and good business skills make business sense. Everything else is secondary.
I'm not sure Cheryl Jacobs has weighed in here, but she does weddings on film exclusively and makes money with it. She's gotten into a few arguments about this on photo.net, actually. Some digital photogs refuse to believe this is actually viable
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