Why are those Fuji GW 690 so dirt cheap in Japan?

Odot · Oct 15, 2016

I see these auctions on Ebay and cant believe for how much less they are being sold compared to an auction from lets say a european country. What's the deal with that?

I`ve read in another forum that the counter of these appears to have been part of some Fuji sales scheme in Japan (where these cameras were used by bus tour operators rather than pro photographers, and where 500 rolls may have meant a fairly long time of relatively rough outdoor use).

Can anyone confirm this in any capacity?

Trask · Oct 15, 2016

From Camerapedia: "The immediate predecessors of these large rangefinder cameras had interchangeable lenses, and to those who like to think of them as "Texas Leicas", the change to a fixed lens may seem perverse. But people close to the development of the camera have explained. The main reason was simply that sales of the lenses of lengths other than 65mm and 100mm were very low.[2]Moreover, eliminating the lens mount would further reduce weight and increase reliability.[3]

The emphasis on reliability was determined by the unusual market for the cameras. As noted in the article on the G690 and the other interchangeable-lens models, the major use of these cameras was in the thriving if unglamorous business of photographing tour groups. Buses would disgorge their passengers at such places as the 1970 Osaka Expo, group photographs would be taken, and the prints could be ready later the same day. Mr Nakanishi (仲西史則), in charge of this work in one company, has recalled that one camera might go through 50 or 100 rolls of film per day (perhaps short rolls, designed for six 6×6 frames), and over thirty thousand exposures per year.[4]"

I have also heard that it is not that difficult to disconnect the counter, allowing a person so inclined to conceal the true number of exposures/rolls. Though that may have been about the interchangeable lens GL series -- not sure.

Odot · Oct 15, 2016

Trask said:
The emphasis on reliability was determined by the unusual market for the cameras. As noted in the article on the G690 and the other interchangeable-lens models, the major use of these cameras was in the thriving if unglamorous business of photographing tour groups. Buses would disgorge their passengers at such places as the 1970 Osaka Expo, group photographs would be taken, and the prints could be ready later the same day. Mr Nakanishi (仲西史則), in charge of this work in one company, has recalled that one camera might go through 50 or 100 rolls of film per day (perhaps short rolls, designed for six 6×6 frames), and over thirty thousand exposures per year.[4]"

I have also heard that it is not that difficult to disconnect the counter, allowing a person so inclined to conceal the true number of exposures/rolls. Though that may have been about the interchangeable lens GL series -- not sure.

Damn, this has exceeded my assumptions by far

So how do i determine the condition of these cameras then?

eddie · Oct 15, 2016

I bought both of mine from Japan (GW and GSW) on eBay. Both transactions went well, and I received cameras in excellent shape. Like any other eBay purchase I make, I followed the auctions for a few months. I noticed a few sellers who repeatedly sold them, at reasonable prices, with excellent feedback. I then kept an eye out for those sellers, and took my chances. Fortunately, it worked out just fine for me.

Dan Daniel · Oct 15, 2016

Resetting the counter is very easy. Don't rely on it. Look at wear and tear over the whole camera. Paint wear on edges, lens rings, etc. Wind knob wear. All in all, like any other camera.

And eddie's advise on ebay sellers is great.

mgb74 · Oct 15, 2016

I've also heard the story about them being used by tour operators. In my mind, that only makes sense if the resulting prints were contact sized. Otherwise it would be more economical to use a 35mm.

Back in the 80s and 90s, I was able to get contact roll prints (from 120 and 220 film) very cheap. One long roll of paper with contact sized prints. Could easily be cut into individual proofs.

Theo Sulphate · Oct 15, 2016

The counter shows the number of exposures times 10. If using 10-exposure rolls, then you get the roll count. Fuji recommends shutter service when the counter reads 500 (5000 exposures) and service when it rolls over to 000 (10,000 exposures).

The "x10" marking is inscribed on the bottom of my GW690III, where the counter now reads 050 (500 exposures), which I know is accurate.

Dan Daniel · Oct 15, 2016

mgb74 said:
I've also heard the story about them being used by tour operators. In my mind, that only makes sense if the resulting prints were contact sized. Otherwise it would be more economical to use a 35mm.

Back in the 80s and 90s, I was able to get contact roll prints (from 120 and 220 film) very cheap. One long roll of paper with contact sized prints. Could easily be cut into individual proofs.

Then again, if you are dealing with a large group portrait, blown up to 8x10 or more, then individual faces would still be recognizable?

4season · Oct 16, 2016

Yes, on more than a couple of occasions I've seen those Fujifilm cameras in use in Japan for tour group photos. I think this is why short (4-exposure) rolls of film were once sold on the JDM.

AgX · Oct 16, 2016

I'm not even sure the G690 was even offered in Europe.

Dan Fromm · Oct 16, 2016

AgX said:
I'm not even sure the G690 was even offered in Europe.

I saw one in a camera shop window in Zweibruecken/Pfalz in the spring of 1970.

Prest_400 · Oct 16, 2016

They are one of the biggest bang for the buck MF nowadays. Large 6x6+ format, rather modern RF. I got a GW690III for $375 a couple of years ago, which is quite a low price. Pentax 67 was waived as a good starting kit as well but I've never seen them equally low priced, taking into accound that an old 6x7 was priced similar to a rather new GW mkIII.

Seller told me mine served in a Photogaphic studio. I guess commercially 6x9 is not as attractive compared to 645 and 6x7 because of film usage. Looked some historical catalogs and in the US they cost about $1500 a decade ago IIRC.
They are not as hyped as the P67 (105mm), do not have the caché of Rolleis and Hassies, the critical sharpness of Mamiya 6/7... Just plain overlooked?

645 SLR systems of a certain vintage can be gotten really cheap (Bronica ETR, Pentax 645, Mamiya 645) and I've seen really cheap RB67 kits listed in ebay from Japan. Less than 300€!

CropDusterMan · Oct 16, 2016

The Fuji 6x9 was the perfect camera to use when the shot you were doing was planned for use as a "double-truck"
(double page spread) in a magazine...its proportions were perfect for this and the resulting neg with Fuji's
wonderful color rendition and sharpness was exceptional.

Huss · Oct 18, 2016

Careful though, I had to return two bought from different sellers from Japan as they had fungus in them, even though the ad said they were fungus free etc
It seems that these cameras were used hard and put away wet...

I bought a perfect one here locally for less money..

wailsound · Oct 20, 2016

They are one of the hidden gems out there. I remember seeing adds for them many years ago and lusting after one but never being able to afford it. A few years ago I got one in good condition from Japan, later on I did discover it had a minor issue with focus so this year I sent it off for a service. I had to send it to Japan and had the issue fixed and at the same time a new shutter installed while I could get one.At the moment parts for the gw690iii are still about but running out . I think that's why they are so cheap because servicing them isn't . It cost me about the same cost as what I paid for the camera but I think it was worth it . I basically got a new camera and I really love shooting it.

TSSPro · Dec 23, 2016

I'd love one of each of the Fuji 6x9s, they seem like fantastic cameras and I have my eye out for one...well, always...

KeithM · Dec 23, 2016

Bought my GW690II from Aperture (London) at the beginning of the year. Cosmetically it shows its age but the performance and results are excellent. Those 6x9 negs! Album on Flickr.

mgb74 · Dec 23, 2016

Dan Daniel said:
Then again, if you are dealing with a large group portrait, blown up to 8x10 or more, then individual faces would still be recognizable?

Good point.

I'd think a group of 30-40 would still be recognizable if shot with a decent prime lens on 35mm. But maybe not a larger group. And maybe not if trying to isolate an individual or couple.

None the less, the tour story appears true. Or a very widely held urban myth.

Kodachromeguy · Jan 3, 2017

Hi everyone. This is an old thread, but I want to put in another good word for the amazing optical quality of these 6x9 Fuji cameras. I have a GW690II model (90mm f/3.5 lens) that I bought new in 1992. It is a big bruiser, but easy to hold. At the prices being offered by the vendors in Japan, I don't know how you could get more photographic bang for the buck (or yen). My next purchase will be one of the wide models (GSW690II or GSW690III). Sure, I'd like a Hasselblad with the 38mm Biogon, but I can get by with a slightly wider field of view on 6x9. These are two examples of Fomapan 100 Classic film, developed in Xtol and scanned with a Minolta Scan Multi scanner with SilverFast software.

Why are those Fuji GW 690 so dirt cheap in Japan?

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