Who hasn't recieved their TMY from JandC

deisenlord · Aug 13, 2007

I've kept quiet about this but I really need to speak my mind. I never recieved my TMY from JandC in the orginal order, $350 dollars worth. I've been trying to contact John via a couple of very helpful members on this list to no avail. He has chosen to not even acknowledge the situation via a return email. I'm curious, anybody else in this situation?

Dave Eisenlord

chip · Aug 13, 2007

TMY from J and C

I am also waiting for my original order of 8" x16" TMY,approximately $930.00 worth. I keep hearing that the order was being filled,then I read a refund check was coming at the end of July. Since neither has happened,I can only assume that my order is a total loss. I find it disturbing that everyone feels badly for John(me too),yet he can't or won't respond to numerous times I have e-mailed and asked for info on this forum and others.I just want the film.If anyone can shed some light on this situation,I'd appreciate an answer.

Sal Santamaura · Aug 13, 2007

I'm into this for much less cash, but nonetheless have not received a refund for the five boxes of 6.5x8.5-inch TMY ordered in January, 2006. I even sent an email message providing the new expiration date for my credit card account, since that had changed since the order was placed. Checking on the card issuer's automated system moments ago revealed no credit has yet been posted to the account. I've not received an email reply either.

George Losse · Aug 13, 2007

Dave,

I recieved my 8x20 I ordered, and purchased more after my first order.

What size film were you ordering? Not all the sizes were cut at the same time.

I hate to say it but money talks with special orders. The sizes with smaller number of orders would naturally be cut last. This is out of J&C's control since Kodak was cutting the film in the order they chose.

Keep trying to reach J&C they have been great, there has been numerous posts about the issues they have gone through. There could be a large number of reasons why they did not get back to you. But from my experience with them, I would doubt thaat they are ducking your emails.

Keep trying. Also remember email systems are not without trouble. My email from my domain stopped being forwarded to my home accout. No trouble with my domain but my local provider has chosen to block the email since they think its spam.

My point is there are lots of reasons that an email might go unanswered. Don't assume the worst.

pauliej · Aug 13, 2007

If you ordered with a credit card, work with them to get the charge reversed. That will get their attention on the other end.

Hope this helps.

PJ

deisenlord · Aug 13, 2007

Sorry George, with all due respect. I have emailed John via two different email accounts at two different address personally at least 6 times. Two members of this list who are in evidently in personal contact with him relayed my messages as well. There is no excuse for a lack of response; ABSOLUTELY NONE. If he's clean let him respond here and clear things up.
Dave

waynecrider · Aug 13, 2007

I got a rebate on my small order early on, but I thought that the entire order had to be paid for before the roll was run. Is it possible to check with Kodak and ask if there was a quantity un-shipped or un-cut? I know that John was in alot of grief over the fact that Kodak was dragging their heels on the cutting and he was trying to get a commitment out of them to answer us. Even Thalmann was bitching about it a year later; I wonder if he got his 4x10? If the roll was paid for then it's John's more or less. Of course John's medical problems were no help.But wasn't there a co-sponser on this? There was another person involved who was playing middle-man from what I remember.

aldevo · Aug 13, 2007

If you go out to the largeformatphotography.info site and do a search, you'll find that John's health has again begun to deteriorate.

I'm not sure if this is the cause of the delays, but it may explain why your attempts to contact him are not receiving replies.

waynecrider · Aug 13, 2007

Just read an update here. 4th page by Michael.

Michael Kadillak · Aug 13, 2007

aldevo said:
If you go out to the largeformatphotography.info site and do a search, you'll find that John's health has again begun to deteriorate.

I'm not sure if this is the cause of the delays, but it may explain why your attempts to contact him are not receiving replies.

Health issues are sensitive matters and I appreciate any information from reliable sources along these lines as I have been waiting for John to contact me for about a week. I was not able to find the referenced post.

Let's hope that this is untrue.

Cheers!

deisenlord · Aug 14, 2007

As I cross-posted on the Large Format Forum, if he is well enough to be cutting a new deal with Kodak, he's well enough to send me some 8x10 TMY in exchange or have someone communicate to me how he intends to resolve the issue. All I have ever asked for is acknowledgement, seems pretty simple no?

Zebra · Aug 14, 2007

I too am cross referencing this so that a more complete picture can be had by those that have an interest in this thread. At this point I truly have no animosity towards the situatioon just confusion and hope I guess that the trust placed in making the order was well placed.

Facts:

I have 2,300 dollars of 20 x 24 TMY under the old order that has not been delivered.

I requested a refund at the beginning of June of this year. On June 5th I received a response from John saying that he could no longer reverse charges to the credit card i purchased with but that he would instruct his accountant to cut a check early the following week.

Numerous emails have gone unanswered since then, and obviously still no check.

I will refrain from getting involved in a public setting with the emotions that go with those facts except to say that I remain hopeful and optimistic that the right thing will eventually be done and as Michael so eloquently said, 'we can all get back to taking pictures'. I hope that will be the case very soon.

Respectfully,

Monty McCutchen

ReallyBigCameras · Aug 14, 2007

waynecrider said:
Even Thalmann was bitching about it a year later; I wonder if he got his 4x10?

Wayne,

We must have a different definition of "bitching". Here's (there was a url link here which no longer exists) back in January, 2007 in response to a posting on the J&C web site that Kodak would soon be cutting the remaining sizes.

kthalmann said:
This is great news. I'm a pretty optimistic guy, but after almost a year, I'd given up hope of ever getting my 4x10 TMax 400 and expected to get a refund. I'd much rather have the film than my money back. So, I was pleasantly surprised by this latest development.

There's more from me in that thread, but nothing that seems like "bitching" to me.

To answer your question... No, I never received the TMY 4x10 I ordered from J&C in January 2006. After the above referenced post, I did exchange additional PMs with John about the status of my 4x10 TMY order. At one pont, John offered to send me the equivalent amount of 8x10 TMY (which I declined as I really wanted pre-cut 4x10 film).

In March of this year, I received a message from John and he was confident that the cutting of the additional sizes would be happening very soon. And then when that didn't happen, on April 18, 2007 I was given a complete refund, via PayPal (I'd originally paid by credit card), for my unfulfilled order.

I don't know if this will help anyone who is having trouble getting an email response from John on this matter, but the email address used to send the PayPal refund was:

info@t3pllc.com

I have no idea if that is a currently valid email address. I'm just passing it along in the hope that it may help some of you who are still without film and without a refund. I'm not taking any sides in this issue. I would have loved to have gotten my 4x10 TMY (always my first choice), but I didn't and have moved on. I'm expecting my order of 4x10 FP4+ any day now. When one door closes, another opens.

Best of luck to those still awaiting film/refunds. I really hope you get your film. TMY is a great ULF film. I'm glad I got my 7x17 when I did and hope I'll be able to get more (and some 14x17, too) in the future. I remain optimistic that things will go more smoothly if there are additional TMY ULF production runs in the future.

Kerry

waynecrider · Aug 14, 2007

Sorry Kerry, I don't mean to portray you in a negative light. Obviously you were only concerned and wanted your product. If I complain about something I consider it bitching, and not a hissy fit type. Just complaining. I think it stems from my years hearing people say, he/she's bitching about this, that and another thing. Please forgive me.

ReallyBigCameras · Aug 14, 2007

Wayne,

No problem. I just wanted to set the record straight. In my younger days I was more likely to bitch when things didn't go the way I wanted. I guess I've mellowed with age, because these days I rarely get upset about anything and tend to take a calmer approach to addressing these sort of issues. I have I have found this approach much less stressful and in the longer run equally effective.

Kerry

ReallyBigCameras · Aug 14, 2007

kthalmann said:
I would have loved to have gotten my 4x10 TMY (always my first choice), but I didn't and have moved on. I'm expecting my order of 4x10 FP4+ any day now. When one door closes, another opens.

Not really related to the unfulfilled TMY orders, but I thought I post this here in case anyone does a search of 4x10 FP4+ and stumbles upon this thread.

I just got an email from Fred Newman at the View Camera Store that the 4x10 FP4+ is in and ready to ship. So, where Kodak failed to deliver, Ilford has come through. I like having the extra speed of TMY in the ULF formats, but for 4x10 where I'm used to shooting Velvia, FP4+ will seems plenty fast by comparison.

Kerry

kiku · Aug 14, 2007

kthalmann said:
... So, where Kodak failed to deliver....
Kerry

Hi
Was it Kodak who failed or was it J & C who dropped the ball?
Cordially, Howard Tanger

ReallyBigCameras · Aug 14, 2007

kiku said:
Hi
Was it Kodak who failed or was it J & C who dropped the ball?
Cordially, Howard Tanger

Ultimately, J&C failed to deliver the product. However, they couldn't ship what Kodak wouldn't cut.

Kerry

Sal Santamaura · Aug 15, 2007

kthalmann said:
Ultimately, J&C failed to deliver the product. However, they couldn't ship what Kodak wouldn't cut.

I was told by someone via PM a while ago that J&C received orders which, when combined, represented a bit more than one master roll. Not being willing to purchase the second master roll for such a small amount of film, J&C allegedly then decided on its own which small-volume sizes to "leave for the next order," but didn't mention that in public. If true, this would place blame squarely on J&C's shoulders; Kodak could not be faulted.

I don't know this with absolute certainty, but the person who provided me the information is well known and widely respected in the LF community (it's not Kerry).

david b · Aug 15, 2007

Over at the LFF, Michael Kadillak wrote on Aug 13 2007 :

"He started a new consulting job and it does not allow him to carry a Blackberry so he is not as responsive as he would like to be."

So John is well enough to start a new job that his health is not an issue.

aldevo · Aug 20, 2007

aldevo said:
If you go out to the largeformatphotography.info site and do a search, you'll find that John's health has again begun to deteriorate.

I'm not sure if this is the cause of the delays, but it may explain why your attempts to contact him are not receiving replies.

I did some hunting around on the largeformatphotography.info site for the posting I alluded to above.

I have not been able to find it. Whether that's because I misinterpreted an old response concerning John's health (ULF threads can last for years) or whether the moderator removed the thread because of its personal nature (it happens every once in a while), or I'm simply losing my marbles - I do not know.

But out of fairness to everybody and an inability to confirm what I thought was my source - I'm retracting the above statement concerning the status of John's health. I've no news to report.

Sorry for the confusion and I hope the matter of the purchase gets resolved to everybody's satisfaction.

deisenlord · Aug 20, 2007

Unfortunately what I've just heard from sources that knew John and respected him is that our only recourse at this time is legal. Not what I had hoped for when I opened this thread.
Dave

copake_ham · Aug 20, 2007

deisenlord said:
Unfortunately what I've just heard from sources that knew John and respected him is that our only recourse at this time is legal. Not what I had hoped for when I opened this thread.
Dave

Many "entrepreneurs" start out on the Web thinking it's a relatively low-overhead endeavor. Just find a niche and a source of providing supply to meet advertised demand and collect the middleman rewards.

Alas, too often the business model is not fully thought out. Unexpected costs arise; eagerness to meet rising customer requests etc. overwhelms ability/capacity to provide products etc.

My only dealings with the guy was during his "sell out" sale last Autumn. I got the few rolls of 35mm I ordered so have no complaints.

Who hasn't recieved their TMY from JandC

deisenlord

chip

Sal Santamaura

George Losse

pauliej

deisenlord

waynecrider

aldevo

waynecrider

Michael Kadillak

deisenlord

Zebra

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waynecrider

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kiku

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Sal Santamaura

david b

aldevo

deisenlord

copake_ham

Who hasn't recieved their TMY from JandC

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