Which has better lenses for landscape shooting?

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

I'm mostly going to be shooting handheld because of the locations I want to shoot at but between the Mamiya RZ67 and Mamiya 7 which has better quality lenses for landscape shooting? I really like the 65mm focal length on 6x7 format.

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

Also like to add that I plan to drum scan my negs and print 20x24in to 30x40in

Xmas · Jul 28, 2015

The 65mm C is multi coated and has a floating group.

It's precursor is single coated.

It depends what sort landscape shots you want...

You probably need the lens hood and French flag.

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

I plan on doing images like this

This was shot on a Mamiya 7II w/ 65mm lens but doesn't look all that great blown up to 20x24 to 30x40

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

What about the Mamiya 65mm Sekor Z? (that's the lens I currently own)

Xmas · Jul 28, 2015

Add skylight filter, tripod and pola filter then... Lock up mirror it is not inconvenient.
If you are only interested in technical detail the 65mm C is better, than its precursor, if you remember to set its floating ring at the distance you want best detail.

devaljoshi · Jul 28, 2015

I have both. It is not possible to shoot the rz 67 reliably handheld. I have shot it handheld one trip.... Not without a tripod again. When they say it's a tank, it's true. As far as lenses, your resolution will meet the limit for most color film. With landscape I usually use slower film like iso 50-100 so the mamiya 7 will need a tripod as well. If you added a tripod to the equation the only advantage to the rz 67 is ground glass and changing backs mid roll. The weight of the r67 is the same as my 4x5 so I reserve landscape mostly to 4x5 if I am dragging around the weight. Now I will tell you that I think the rz67 is the best portrait camera in the world.. It's perfect in that situation whether on location or in studio.

Sent from my SCH-I545 using Tapatalk

Alan Gales · Jul 28, 2015

deardork said:
I'm mostly going to be shooting handheld because of the locations I want to shoot at but between the Mamiya RZ67 and Mamiya 7 which has better quality lenses for landscape shooting? I really like the 65mm focal length on 6x7 format.

I've owned an RZ but never a Mamiya 7. Everyone says that if you want sharper than a Mamiya 7 you need to buy a 4x5 with sharp lenses. The RZ was meant as a studio camera and is bulky and heavy for shooting hand held. It can be done, especially with the "L" grip attached but the 7 was designed for travel and should be perfect for what you want to do. They aren't cheap though!

brian steinberger · Jul 28, 2015

I think you're question should be which camera would be easier to shoot handheld? The Mamiya RFs are fantastic cameras. I have the Mamiya 6 and love it. They offer the sharpest lenses in MF. If your shot above doesn't look great blown up know that no other 6x7 camera system is going to be better (in terms on sharpness). Maybe the Mamiya 7 you used was not aligned properly?

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

When I last had the chance to shoot at that location my camera settings were ISO 160 f/22 1/125 shutter speed. But that was with the Mamiya 7 so no doubt it's probably easier to handhold. I understand the reason for a tripod but I am not sure it would have helped much in that situation? Plus I wasn't really allowed to shoot there because I was considered a distraction to their business, so I had to shoot guerrilla style (it's why I was using the Mamiya 7) but if I were allowed to use a tripod and take my time I would definitely be using a 4x5 or 8x10 camera.

I was just asking to compare the RZ with the Mamiya 7 because I always seem to see the best portrait work with the RZ series (in terms of depth and sharpness) and didn't think it would be too far of a stretch to see how it would do on landscapes compared to the Mamiya 7 I've used. I do believe the Mamiya 7 I was using might not have been aligned properly because in my opinion the whole image looks just the smallest tad out of focus when blown up. Still useable but doesn't seem that I nailed focus even though I aligned the rangefinder properly when focusing...too bad I sold it shortly after otherwise I'd get it fixed or looked at now.

Rick A · Jul 28, 2015

Either one would be capable of what the OP seeks. Now the caveat, to get the ultimate best possible image for printing to the sizes desired, hand held is NOT the way to go. A rock steady tripod, or at the very least a good mono pod to hold the camera as steady as possible is required. Any amount of camera shake, even at higher shutter speeds will be amplified when enlarging, and appear as out of focus or blurred.

Sirius Glass · Jul 28, 2015

The choice of lens for landscape in MF depends on how I want to frame the subject and the perspective. I use 38mm, 50mm, 80mm, 150mm or 250mm lenses for the landscape photographs.

MattKing · Jul 28, 2015

The lenses for each camera are of high quality. In most cases, sample variation would be more important than design variation.

If you are shooting hand-held, in high light level daylight, neither camera will give you results superior to 35mm on a tripod.

If you are shooting hand held in marginal light, some photographers will achieve better results with one, while others will achieve better results with the other.

For lenses wider than the 65mm, there is a definite technical benefit to a rangefinder vs. an SLR, due to not having to have the short focal length lens avoid contacting a mirror.

Looking at your example photo, it appears to me that you might benefit from being able to precisely control framing, so the RZ67 would be superior.

Dan Fromm · Jul 28, 2015

deardork said:
I'm mostly going to be shooting handheld because of the locations I want to shoot at but between the Mamiya RZ67 and Mamiya 7 which has better quality lenses for landscape shooting? I really like the 65mm focal length on 6x7 format.

Also like to add that I plan to drum scan my negs and print 20x24in to 30x40in

Dear Dork,

You can't get there from here. More precisely, printing 20 x 24 from a 6x7 neg (56 mm x 68 mm) requires around 9x enlargement. That's near the limit of what color film can give with impeccable technique. Shooting handheld isn't good enough.

30 x 40 needs around 13x. You really need at least a 4x5 camera and impeccable technique to get prints that large that will bear close scrutiny.

Y'r only other option is to shoot only subjects with no fine detail.

Sorry

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

I understand. I wasn't sure or not if I was pushing the limit of the negative trying to print that size... now I know. Next time I get a chance to shoot at that location again I'll see if I can sneak in a monopod or tripod and see how much of an improvement I can get on the next batch of film.

EdSawyer · Jul 28, 2015

I have both the RZ and the Mamiya 7. Both 65mm lenses are great, the latest version of the RZ lens is the Sekor Z 65mm f/4 M-L/A. You can easily shoot handheld, get plenty sharp pictures, and easily print to 20x24 or larger from either of these rigs. Don't listen to the naysayers. ;-) F/22 is going to be past the diffraction limit of either of these though, you really want to shoot at f/8 - f/11 for optimal sharpness on both these systems. That said, the Mamiya 7 lens is likely a bit better than the RZ lens, but it's so close, really comes down to other conveniences/features/etc.

DREW WILEY · Jul 28, 2015

It's easier to engineer precise wide-angle lenses without worrying about retrofocus issues due to a mirror in the path. So the M7 lenses would hold the edge. But rangefinder cameras are quite limited at the other end, longer lenses. And you're talking totally different ergonomics here,
one camera being quite petite and the other a bit of a tank. Realistically, big prints require a tripod, and nothing as small as 6x7 will deliver
truly sharp prints on 30x40 scale. A few films in an M7 can give decent 20x24 results at optimal f-stops.

RobC · Jul 28, 2015

you will need at least 1/125 and preferably 1/250 shutter speed if you are doing hand held otherwise you have no chance of a sharp 30x40.

have you considered a monopod if you don't want to use a tripod. It would help a lot.

M Carter · Jul 28, 2015

I like shooting landscapes (well, ruined buildings and old bridges) with my RB. I've shot fashion handheld with it, but it's really a tripod system (I know some disagree). The handholding bracket works well, but since the RB is a 2-crank setup, it's a pain. RZ and motor drive might be a little slicker.

Hunt up the RB bellows lens hood though - really slick piece of gear, and it has a gel filter slot. All over eBay and KEH for $40 or so, and you can use it on many of your other cameras with step rings. It can be used with about a 30mm or longer lens on 35mm without vignetting (the 35 frame is much wider than the 6x7 frame, so you'll black out the left and right sides of a 35mm frame at 28mm or wider, depending on other factors like filter stacks, etc). One of my favorite little gear finds.

axs810 · Jul 28, 2015

Does the Mamiya G2 bellows lens hood work fine with a 65mm lens on 6x7?

Alan Gales · Jul 28, 2015

deardork said:
When I last had the chance to shoot at that location my camera settings were ISO 160 f/22 1/125 shutter speed. But that was with the Mamiya 7 so no doubt it's probably easier to handhold. I understand the reason for a tripod but I am not sure it would have helped much in that situation? Plus I wasn't really allowed to shoot there because I was considered a distraction to their business, so I had to shoot guerrilla style (it's why I was using the Mamiya 7) but if I were allowed to use a tripod and take my time I would definitely be using a 4x5 or 8x10 camera.

I was just asking to compare the RZ with the Mamiya 7 because I always seem to see the best portrait work with the RZ series (in terms of depth and sharpness) and didn't think it would be too far of a stretch to see how it would do on landscapes compared to the Mamiya 7 I've used. I do believe the Mamiya 7 I was using might not have been aligned properly because in my opinion the whole image looks just the smallest tad out of focus when blown up. Still useable but doesn't seem that I nailed focus even though I aligned the rangefinder properly when focusing...too bad I sold it shortly after otherwise I'd get it fixed or looked at now.

I missed how large you are printing. That's large format territory. Blowing up anything that large you should have your camera on a tripod.

The RZ is a fantastic portrait camera. It focusses close with it's bellows focussing. There are also two extension tubes made for it. Both waist level and eye level finders are available. Besides the 180mm lens there is a soft focus 180mm available too.

The Mamiya 7 was designed as a travel camera instead of a portrait camera. From my understanding the lenses do not focus very close.

I keep hearing that the wide angle lenses on the 7 are a little sharper than the RZ due to there being no mirror to design around.

Alan Klein · Jul 28, 2015

M Carter said:
I like shooting landscapes (well, ruined buildings and old bridges) with my RB. I've shot fashion handheld with it, but it's really a tripod system (I know some disagree). The handholding bracket works well, but since the RB is a 2-crank setup, it's a pain. RZ and motor drive might be a little slicker.

Hunt up the RB bellows lens hood though - really slick piece of gear, and it has a gel filter slot. All over eBay and KEH for $40 or so, and you can use it on many of your other cameras with step rings. It can be used with about a 30mm or longer lens on 35mm without vignetting (the 35 frame is much wider than the 6x7 frame, so you'll black out the left and right sides of a 35mm frame at 28mm or wider, depending on other factors like filter stacks, etc). One of my favorite little gear finds.

What gels can you use in the bellow lens hood slot? Polarizing? GND filter? Whose make?

John Koehrer · Jul 29, 2015

The frame for the hood uses 3" square gels.
Not plastic, not glass, the slot's not wide enough.

Which has better lenses for landscape shooting?

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