Which focal length enlarging lens for 6x7 negatives?

I am trying to get my Beseler 23c enlarger setup for 6x7 medium format negatives. It is currently setup for 35mm with a 50mm lens. From what I have read this is too short of a focal length for 6x7 and a 90mm focal length would be optimum, especially if printing large. The problem I am running into is the lack of quality (Rodenstock/El Nikkor) 90mm lenses available for sale. Very few on Ebay and I have found no used 90mm on retail sites. I have found several quality lenses in 105mm focal length.

Given that I mostly print 8x10 and 11x14, would a 105mm enlarger lens on my beseler 23c work for my intended application?

It is not a question of focal length so much as the coverage that the lens gives. The Rodenstock 60 mm f4 wide angle for example, would probably cover the negative size. But normally something longer is required. http://www.photocornucopia.com/1061.html Take your pick from any covering 6x7. Choose one with 5+ elements and you can't go far wrong.

A good quality 100mm or 105mm would be just fine, and there are a lot around used so you won't have to mortgage your house to get one

Johnkpap

A 105mm on your Beseler 23C will be fine for 6x7, and pretty much any 105 will cover the format. If your darkroom has a low ceiling and you might want to print bigger than 11x14 some day, you may be better off with one of the 80s specifically designed to cover the format. These include the 80mm Rodagon-WA, 80mm Apo Rodagon N, and 80mm El-Nikkor, all of which are top-quality lenses. Schneider also offered 80mm lenses, I think the top might have been Componon-S but I'm not sure about their lens line nomenclature. The 80mm Rodagon-WA will also cover 6x9 should you ever decide to work with that format. The 60mm Rodagon-WA is specified as covering 6x6 so it may or may not work depending on how much edge cropping you do, but I really wouldn't count on it for general-purpose 6x7 use.

The most readily available and reasonably priced 90mm is probably the Fujinon-EX, of which several examples are almost always on eBay. There are also the Schneider Apo-Componon-HM and Rodenstock Apo-Rodagon-N in this focal length; both are uncommon and expensive. Avoid the 90mm Apo Rodagon (non-N version) as it doesn't really cover 6x7 according to the gentleman who was Rodenstock's US representative for many years.

A further note on Rodenstock lenses: they offered several lens familes in each focal length at different price points. From low to high they were Rogonar, Rogonar-S, Rodagon, Rodagon-N, and Apo-Rodagon-N. At today's depressed market prices I'd urge you to go for the best lens you can afford, so if you want Rodenstock glass that'd be the Apo-Rodagon-N line. The Rodagon-WA is almost as good (only exceeded optically by the Apo-Rodagon-N line per the rep) and offers more coverage. The Rodagon-G is for making huge enlargements, not for general-purpose use; it's rare and commands a high price. The Apo-Rodagon-D line (only offered in 75mm and 120mm to my knowledge) is a very specialized lens for use around 1:1 only and would be a bad choice as an enlarging lens.

The 80mm Componon S will cover 6x7, 105mm lenses are really for 6x9.

Ian

Thank you all for the feedback.
I had a weak moment in my frustration and almost bought a monthly photoshop subscription. Close call!!! After reading your replies I just snatched up a mint condition El-Nikkor 105mm f4.5. Now I need to find a negative carrier and I'm back in business.

I have a 90mm Beseler Pro lens that performs very well. In addition, I am happy with how my late version "plain" Rodagon 80mm f/4 deals with 6x7 negatives. Both give me the potential for larger enlargements than my 105mm lens offers, assuming convenient operation.
It is worthwhile keeping your eyes open for compatible shorter focal length lenses, for those times when it will make a difference to you.

MattKing said:

I have a 90mm Beseler Pro lens that performs very well. In addition, I am happy with how my late version "plain" Rodagon 80mm f/4 deals with 6x7 negatives. Both give me the potential for larger enlargements than my 105mm lens offers, assuming convenient operation.
It is worthwhile keeping your eyes open for compatible shorter focal length lenses, for those times when it will make a difference to you.

Click to expand...

How large can you print with the 105mm? What enlarger are you using?

WILL WORK FOR FILM said:

How large can you print with the 105mm? What enlarger are you using?

Click to expand...

I have an Omega D6 - that means an extended column which can put the negative stage as much as 50 inches above the baseboard and, if necessary, can be rotated for floor projection.
Which means I can print really large with the 105mm lens.
The enlarger stands on a rolling cart which is 20 inches high. Mostly I print on a raised platform which sits 13 inches above the baseboard. That permits me to have the negative stage up to 37 inches above the easel.
If I have the enlarger set up that way, the short edge of the image is about 19 inches long, so I can just about print a bordered 20"x24" print with a 6x7 negative and the 105mm lens. If I put the easel on the baseboard, I expect I can print 30"x40" prints (but never have).
I don't know how high you can set your Beseler 23C series enlarger head.
Hope this helps.

The 105mm will give you more space under the enlarger for any given print size and the coverage means you will be using the best part of the lens, the center. You should be happy with the Nikkor. I have a bunch of enlarging lenses and have used the Nikkor 105 quite a bit. It isn't my favorite lens, but it is excellent.

You can also use the 105 to make small prints from 35mm. You'll find it more convenient to have the head farther away from the baseboard. When I make 5x7s on my Saunders 4x5 I use a 100/105.

You'll get more even illumination on 6x7 with a 105, especially and wider apertures, and likely better resolution toward the corners of the field too. Plus it has enough coverage to do 6x9 well too. But I also like my 105 Apo Rodagon N for 35mm because, unlike medium and large format negs, I tend to print 35mm images small only, generally cropped inside 8x10 paper. So a 105 gives me a comfortable amount of working room between the enlarger head and the baseboard. I do own 80 and 50 mm lenses as well for 35mm printing, but seldom use them.

The following link gives the standard-column-length Beseler 23C manual. See the magnification chart at the top of page 7. It specifies a maximum magnification of 5.75X with a 105 mm lens with the paper lying on the baseboard—no easel. With the paper on an easel, there’s about 1” or 25 mm less projection distance, so the magnification would be slightly less than 5.75X.

For a typical 6 x 7 cm negative and assuming that the entire image area recorded on the negative (as is the case with a glass negative carrier) can be seen by the lens, we can use the dimensions of the Mamiya RZ67, 56 mm x 69.5 mm, to find the dimensions of the projection (no easel).

The projection is 322 mm x 400 mm = 12.7” x 15.7”.

http://www.jollinger.com/photo/cam-coll/manuals/enlargers/beseler/Beseler_23C(newer).pdf

This enlarger allows horizontal projection for making larger prints, so that’s an option when a print larger than the vertical projection allows is wanted.

Consider the glass carrier. 120 film is pretty thin and having a large area spanning the opening leaves the film open to micro movements as it heats. I used to pre-heat the negatives with the lenscap on but would only do that now for test prints. Not until I compared some prints side-by-side with the glass carrier did I see the subtle blurred areas in big prints.

Ian C said:

The following link gives the standard-column-length Beseler 23C manual. See the magnification chart at the top of page 7. It specifies a maximum magnification of 5.75X with a 105 mm lens with the paper lying on the baseboard—no easel. With the paper on an easel, there’s about 1” or 25 mm less projection distance, so the magnification would be slightly less than 5.75X.

For a typical 6 x 7 cm negative and assuming that the entire image area recorded on the negative (as is the case with a glass negative carrier) can be seen by the lens, we can use the dimensions of the Mamiya RZ67, 56 mm x 69.5 mm, to find the dimensions of the projection (no easel).

The projection is 322 mm x 400 mm = 12.7” x 15.7”.

http://www.jollinger.com/photo/cam-coll/manuals/enlargers/beseler/Beseler_23C(newer).pdf

This enlarger allows horizontal projection for making larger prints, so that’s an option when a print larger than the vertical projection allows is wanted.

Click to expand...

That is exactly the information I was looking for.

Thank you.

Although I used El-Nikkors for years, I'll second the recommendation of the Fujinon-EX 90mm. It's the only lens I now use for my 6x7 negatives - just exceptional quality. (There are both consumer and professional grades of Fuji enlarging lenses, as with most manufacturers. Be very careful to select the correct model.) Nikon makes an 80mm, which is too short for 6x7 IMO (and I hate my copy). Their next step up is a 105mm, which is too long and limits the size available for enlargement.

I use a 100mm Schneider Componon-S for 6x6 and 6x7 on a Beseler 45MX.