Which courtain of my Canon Ftb needs tension? 1/1000 speed issue

Neofito · Jul 31, 2023

So, I know there are manuals that just by the "draw" of what can you perceive with the back open, you know which courtain is too slow, but I can not find that information for this model. Here there is a drawing of while holding the camera from behind, without lens and with the back open, I can see firing at 1/1000. Sometimes I see the full frame, so works fine, but if I repeat it soon or later I see at 1/1000 that they dont sincronize properly.

I hope you understood my explanation, ahahah.

Sometimes I can only see around 20% of the right side. Anyway the inclination of the perceived blurry shutter is alwas the same.

Also, when I cock the shutter, the last half of the moment has a strong squeak sound. Any idea which part of the mechanism should I regrease? or should I just open it and find it by observing?

Thank you in advance.

ic-racer · Jul 31, 2023

The first curtain travel time should be 14.0-15.5 msec, then adjust the second curtain to the same transit time. Then you may need to adjust the eccentric at the back of the camera (figure 3 in the manual) to achieve 1/1000. It is also possible to adjust the rotational position of the second curtain release cam to alter the slit width.

wiltw · Jul 31, 2023

Shutter speed is the combination of the travel time of the slit across the focal plane, and the width of the curtain slit. Lots of things can be wrong, including excessive friction in the travel of a curtain.

4season · Jul 31, 2023

Neither curtain: It sounds as if your camera needs a CLA. Chances are that the shutter will operate correctly without further adjustment once this is has been accomplished. It has taken me many hours of practice to become somewhat comfortable with disassembling 35 mm SLRs enough to do this. Had I attempted it as a beginner, I probably would have wrecked the camera.

Nicholas Lindan · Jul 31, 2023

4season said:
Had I attempted it as a beginner, I probably would have wrecked the camera.

You always wreck the first (and sometimes the second and third) camera learning how to take it all apart, clean it off, and get it working again.

Buy a few basket cases of your model from ebay to learn on - you might find that they suddenly work again...

Camera repair manuals are available from https://learncamerarepair.com/ I haven't looked, but there may be repair videos for your model on youtube.

Neofito · Jul 31, 2023

4season said:
Neither curtain: It sounds as if your camera needs a CLA. Chances are that the shutter will operate correctly without further adjustment once this is has been accomplished. It has taken me many hours of practice to become somewhat comfortable with disassembling 35 mm SLRs enough to do this. Had I attempted it as a beginner, I probably would have wrecked the camera.

Well, I guess there is always a first camera to try... Anyway I have to dissasembly the top for the diode modification, but for the proper CLA I have to fully dissasembly it. So in your experience, is better not to touch yet any of the screws adjusting the tension of the courtains?

ic-racer said:
The first curtain travel time should be 14.0-15.5 msec, then adjust the second curtain to the same transit time. Then you may need to adjust the eccentric at the back of the camera (figure 3 in the manual) to achieve 1/1000. It is also possible to adjust the rotational position of the second curtain release cam to alter the slit width.

But the travel time can only be measured with tools I don't have. I know thats the theory of the problem, but i know that just for what I see testing the shutter someone experienced (or with the proper manual) can already tell which courtain has problems and the problem itself.

Nicholas Lindan said:
You always wreck the first (and sometimes the second and third) camera learning how to take it all apart, clean it off, and get it working again.

Buy a few basket cases of your model from ebay to learn on - you might find that they suddenly work again...

Camera repair manuals are available from https://learncamerarepair.com/ I haven't looked, but there may be repair videos for your model on youtube.

for my problem on youtube people directly adjust the screws for the tension and call it a day, ahahah. Ironically is easier than cleaning and lubricating the whole camera. I have all the manuals for this model from learncamerarepair already, but thank you! Also, I should start their course from the beggining.

awty · Aug 1, 2023

This might be helpful.

How To: Adjusting Shutter Speeds/Repairing Light Leaks on Canon FTb and FT QL Cameras

I like the Canon FT QL and FTb cameras, but many suffer from light leaks and shutter capping. The seals on the back are the usual culprits on the light leaks. If the back needs seals, this is easy to fix w/ some felt at the hinge joint on the side, and some crochet yarn laid into the channels of...

www.photrio.com

A lot of SLR shutters become sticky from sitting around a long time. Sometimes they will fix themselves with a bit of use, most of the time they don't.

Neofito · Aug 1, 2023

awty said:
This might be helpful.

How To: Adjusting Shutter Speeds/Repairing Light Leaks on Canon FTb and FT QL Cameras

I like the Canon FT QL and FTb cameras, but many suffer from light leaks and shutter capping. The seals on the back are the usual culprits on the light leaks. If the back needs seals, this is easy to fix w/ some felt at the hinge joint on the side, and some crochet yarn laid into the channels of...

www.photrio.com

A lot of SLR shutters become sticky from sitting around a long time. Sometimes they will fix themselves with a bit of use, most of the time they don't.

yes, very usefull. For what I am reading and observing, is probably the 1st courtain that is sometimes a bit slow and the 2nd catchs up. So is likely it needs a bit more tension, but also since it squeake while cocking the shutter, for sure needs lubrication.

4season · Aug 1, 2023

Neofito said:
So in your experience, is better not to touch yet any of the screws adjusting the tension of the courtains?

Correct.

By the way, some shutter problems can be diagnosed using a high-speed video app on a mobile device: Much better than wasting film!

awty · Aug 2, 2023

Neofito said:
yes, very usefull. For what I am reading and observing, is probably the 1st courtain that is sometimes a bit slow and the 2nd catchs up. So is likely it needs a bit more tension, but also since it squeake while cocking the shutter, for sure needs lubrication.

I've fixed shutter capping on range finder curtains by adding a bit of tension. Not a hard job to do. The older metal mechanical cameras are usually easy to work on, just take lots of photos, so you know what order to put it back together and try not to lose any screws.

ic-racer · Aug 2, 2023

The camera needs service. Twiddling with the curtains tension settings will make it worse.
Increasing first curtain tension will make the right hand portion of your drawing even more overexposed and cause the escapement for the lower speeds to run too fast.

awty · Aug 2, 2023

Its his camera if he wants to tinker with it then all power to him.
There are enough useless people in the world who cant do anything for themselves we dont need any more.
I usually only buy things that need repair, fixing them is half the fun, maybe even more fun. I dont get any sense of accomplishment by paying someone to do something I could do myself.
There are failures, if your not failing your not pushing yourself hard enough.
You can also pay a professionals to take photos for you, they will do a better job to, but there's no sense of accomplishment in that.

Neofito · Aug 3, 2023

awty said:
Its his camera if he wants to tinker with it then all power to him.
There are enough useless people in the world who cant do anything for themselves we dont need any more.
I usually only buy things that need repair, fixing them is half the fun, maybe even more fun. I dont get any sense of accomplishment by paying someone to do something I could do myself.
There are failures, if your not failing your not pushing yourself hard enough.
You can also pay a professionals to take photos for you, they will do a better job to, but there's no sense of accomplishment in that.

exactly, that's why i want to fix it myself. I will try after my holidays to open it up, clean and add a very little touch of grease and oil where need it and if the problem persists then add some tension on the first courtain.

You know, I started fixing computers when I was a kid, and for sure i broke a couple of times the thing I was trying to fix, but the general balance is way more positive. I also have some experience on electronic projects, so I think the logical thing to do is to use that interest and skills into my passion and profession that is photography. Is both fun and meditative to fix something, specially an old mechanical artifact like a canon Ftb.

I will post here if it is a succesfull attempent or not.

ic-racer · Aug 3, 2023

My experience is a ‘professional’ would not do a better job on my camera than myself.

In fact I have posted numerous threads on shutter repair and shutter measurements, however, never has any of it included recommendations to blindly tamper singularly with shutter tension

Tel · Aug 3, 2023

ic-racer said:
My experience is a ‘professional’ would not do a better job on my camera than myself.

In fact I have posted numerous threads on shutter repair and shutter measurements, however, never has any of it included recommendations to blindly tamper singularly with shutter tension

Amen to that. In this case, the shutter tension isn't likely the problem--whatever is causing that squeaking sound likely is.

awty · Aug 3, 2023

ic-racer said:
My experience is a ‘professional’ would not do a better job on my camera than myself.

That's a heavy burden you must carry.

OAPOli · Aug 4, 2023

I don't quite understand your experiment. What's the diagnosis? Have you tested the camera with film? I would suggest filming the shutter with a phone at 120fps or more (Although 16ms travel time means only 2 frames at 120fps)

Which courtain of my Canon Ftb needs tension? 1/1000 speed issue

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