which 50mm?

pazifico · Dec 18, 2014

eheheh
thanks guys.
I' want to start with a not too expencive lens... and i'm going to see if the analog is for me...
Perhaps in future i'll think for an upgrade.
But now: hold myself back

mrred · Dec 18, 2014

I use the 50/d on my FM/FM2 all the time. It's a nice sharp effective lens.

Xmas · Dec 18, 2014

pazifico said:
eheheh
thanks guys.
I' want to start with a not too expencive lens... and i'm going to see if the analog is for me...
Perhaps in future i'll think for an upgrade.
But now: hold myself back

There are no detectable upgrades unless you use panf and heavy tripod and shoot resolution charts...
There are differences:

Bulk - hand size dependent & gadget bag
weight
close focus
focus rate
contrast
apertures in finder

If you have big hands you may be more comfortable with a 1.4, YMMV.
I also need to relub with a thick grease.

The early lenses are lower contrast which works well with mono and some E6.

I have both a FM and FM2n - prefer the FM...

pazifico · Dec 18, 2014

Xmas said:
There are no detectable upgrades unless you use panf and heavy tripod and shoot resolution charts...
There are differences:

Bulk - hand size dependent & gadget bag
weight
close focus
focus rate
contrast
apertures in finder

If you have big hands you may be more comfortable with a 1.4, YMMV.
I also need to relub with a thick grease.

The early lenses are lower contrast which works well with mono and some E6.

I have both a FM and FM2n - prefer the FM...

practically you say that the difference among all 50 isn't a lot... and it only see in a big print? right?
i shot a lot of my photo with tripod (and i think that with film i'll shot almost always with it).
Indead you suggested me to search the lens more confortable for my hand? (they're not very big... i think they're normal)
Why do you prefer fm?
only two question:
what's "panf"?
and "relub"? relubricante?
thanks

seba
p.s. sorry for my spaghetti-english

baachitraka · Dec 18, 2014

At the end of the day, you may never notice those differences on prints. You may get what is available or affordable and start taking photographs.

panf: ILFord PanF+ 50 is one good film.

pazifico · Dec 18, 2014

baachitraka said:
At the end of the day, you may never notice those differences on prints. You may get what is available or affordable and start taking photographs.

panf: ILFord PanF+ 50 is one good film.

thank you very much... you're wise...
perhaps now i'm too thinking... maybe it's better that i'm going to buy a camera film with a 50 (how you said: available and affordable) and start taking photo... the rest of the problems are for the future

seba
p.s. sorry for my spaghetti-english

flavio81 · Dec 18, 2014

pazifico said:
practically you say that the difference among all 50 isn't a lot... and it only see in a big print? right?
i shot a lot of my photo with tripod (and i think that with film i'll shot almost always with it).
Indead you suggested me to search the lens more confortable for my hand? (they're not very big... i think they're normal)
Why do you prefer fm?
only two question:
what's "panf"?
and "relub"? relubricante?
thanks

seba
p.s. sorry for my spaghetti-english

He (Xmas) is right. Regarding sharpness the difference is very small, all 50s are good. Now, in some cases there are differences in distortion - as a general rule the smaller aperture lenses ("slower" lenses) have no distortion. And sometimes in bokeh; sometimes the slower lenses, or the older lenses, have nicer out of focus rendition.

"Pan F" is Ilford Pan F, an ISO 50 film of very high image quality.

mrred · Dec 20, 2014

A 50mm lens is a perfect starter lens. You will find that what you see outside the camera is the same view inside the camera. It will help you "see" more pictures.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

andrew.roos · Dec 20, 2014

With an FM2, the best choice would be an AI or AIS lens. The pre-AI lenses won't mount (and will damage the aperture feeler if you force them), the AF-D lenses have poorer manual focus feel, and the G lenses won't work at all because they have no aperture ring. I would also avoid AI'd lenses (pre-Ai lenses converted to AI), as you don't know how well the conversion was done. The best choice is probably an AI lens, as they are generally cheaper than the AIS lenses, as well as being better made, and the FM2 does not benefit from the linear aperture stop-down that was the only functional change in the AIS.

Just a note that there are two different optical designs of the Nikkor 50mm f/1.8. The AI lens and the early AIS lens have 7 elements in 5 groups, and are generally regarded as excellent performers. They are sometimes called the "long nose" 50/1.8. The Series E and late AIS lenses have 6 elements in 5 groups, and are physically shorter, almost a pancake design. While nice and compact, the Series E / late AIS lenses are not regarded as quite as good optically, although they're certainly not poor. Whether that matters is up to you.

My personal choice would be a 50mm f/1.8 AI, like the one Dead Link Removed. I have one myself, they're very good lenses.

Your English is fine. It's much better than my Italian. You can stop apologizing for it

mrred · Dec 20, 2014

I've never seen such a dislike for the Ds. I use them on everything because they work on everything I have. I have never had issues with focus, or anything of that nature.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

cliveh · Dec 20, 2014

mrred said:
A 50mm lens is a perfect starter lens. You will find that what you see outside the camera is the same view inside the camera. It will help you "see" more pictures.

Sent from my Nexus 5 using Tapatalk

If you mean a 50mm lens as a starter will help you progress in photography by then using a greater variety of focal lengths, I would profoundly disagree.

Hatchetman · Dec 20, 2014

Pan F is a great film, but one of the hardest to use.

mrred · Dec 20, 2014

cliveh said:
If you mean a 50mm lens as a starter will help you progress in photography by then using a greater variety of focal lengths, I would profoundly disagree.

You are profoundly entitled to your opinion. I was taught to keep things simple, and this is one of the many things that started me in the right direction. Get good first....then expand.

John Koehrer · Dec 21, 2014

cliveh said:
If you mean a 50mm lens as a starter will help you progress in photography by then using a greater variety of focal lengths, I would profoundly disagree.

And while you're at it, use every type of film & developer available, in every combination possible.

In all seriousity though, limiting choice will allow you to learn what a particular lens can do.

flavio81 · Dec 22, 2014

cliveh said:
If you mean a 50mm lens as a starter will help you progress in photography by then using a greater variety of focal lengths, I would profoundly disagree.

I own several lenses from 19mm to 300mm, for 35mm and also for medium format; but when i review my prints, most of my shots were made with a 50mm lens.

This does not contradict with what you have said, but on the other hand I feel that if a photographer can get away with a 50mm lens in most occasions, using the other type of lenses is a piece of cake (except for fisheyes).

DREW WILEY · Dec 22, 2014

The manual 50/1.8 A1s is very sharp and compact. Maybe not the most solidly built housing, but good enough for most purposes, and is cheap enough that you're not going to cry if it gets damaged or stolen in travel. But for sheer optical performance, build, and versatility, I'd look at the 55 A1s macro. You can also find these at bargain prices.

Xmas · Dec 22, 2014

DREW WILEY said:
The manual 50/1.8 A1s is very sharp and compact. Maybe not the most solidly built housing, but good enough for most purposes, and is cheap enough that you're not going to cry if it gets damaged or stolen in travel. But for sheer optical performance, build, and versatility, I'd look at the 55 A1s macro. You can also find these at bargain prices.

I think you will find there were three AIs 50/1.8

a long nose (bulky) close focus about 0.5
a pancake light weight close focus 2 feet (no rabbits ears
a pancake light weight closer focus (Ja Only no rabbits ears)

as well as two E series (also AIs)

A macro is considerably dearer than the pancakes like x2, in my shops, YMMV.

I thought they were all expensive enough!

mr rusty · Dec 23, 2014

I have seen many threads that start "I'm looking for a first camera, I've chosen Nikon, what lenses should I buy". My question is why Nikon? Yes, undoubtedly excellent cameras and lenses, but because they get so many recommendations, prices are proportionally a bit higher. Fact is any mainstream 35mm SLR is capable of making excellent images and will perform similarly. My personal recommendation (because I have one) for a starter rig at low ££/$$/ is a Minolta X300/370/500/570 and the excellent Minolta/Rokkor 50mm 1.7 (but there are many other combinations from Olympus, Pentax, Canon etc.). Having recommended Minolta, my main system is Olympus - OM1n OM2n and lately OM40 (yes one of the last "consumer" models, which is supposedly "not as good" as the single digit models, if you believe everything you read, but I currently have a liking for its "ESP" metering combined with the standard 1.8 zuiko 50mm and fast film for low-light shots).
Buon Natale.

Xmas · Dec 23, 2014

mr rusty said:
I have seen many threads that start "I'm looking for a first camera, I've chosen Nikon, what lenses should I buy". My question is why Nikon? Yes, undoubtedly excellent cameras and lenses, but because they get so many recommendations, prices are proportionally a bit higher. Fact is any mainstream 35mm SLR is capable of making excellent images and will perform similarly. My personal recommendation (because I have one) for a starter rig at low ££/$$/ is a Minolta X300/370/500/570 and the excellent Minolta/Rokkor 50mm 1.7 (but there are many other combinations from Olympus, Pentax, Canon etc.). Having recommended Minolta, my main system is Olympus - OM1n OM2n and lately OM40 (yes one of the last "consumer" models, which is supposedly "not as good" as the single digit models, if you believe everything you read, but I currently have a liking for its "ESP" metering combined with the standard 1.8 zuiko 50mm and fast film for low-light shots).
Buon Natale.

Only the OM1/OM1n and similar mechanical models Nikon F2, FM, are easy to fix unless you consider life cycle costs, it is frequently cheaper to buy another body with an all mechanical camera, but more frequently necessary with a more 'complex' electronic camera.

Some of the lenses are similarly difficult to maintain.

So 'not as good' does not refer to the 16x20 mage quality with panF+ on a heavy tripod but maintenance, IMHO YMMV...

You can see this with the Pentax basic model the K1000 which is more expensive than its higher featured but still all mechanical brothers.

Buy the simplest camera that will take photos...

jfoote · Dec 23, 2014

If you are interested, you can pick up an N70, N90, N90s for peanuts. These are very capable film cameras that will last you long enough. KEH had and N90 (or N90s, I forget which) for $17 US with free shipping. I got an N70 with the kit lens for under $25. It looks like it hasn't had 10 rolls of film shot through it.

It will cost you more to buy and develop your first roll of b@w film!

There are similar savings on the Canon side of things.

You will need a lens and that's where the money goes. You can get the 50 1.8 for less than $100. It will work fine.

Ricardo Miranda · Dec 23, 2014

Off topic question for mr. rusty: how do you find the OM40 supposed large consumption of LR44 batteries?
I bought recently an OM-2SP that suffers from the same complaint and I'm monitoring its battery usage.
Thanks!

flavio81 · Dec 23, 2014

Xmas said:
Only the OM1/OM1n and similar mechanical models Nikon F2, FM, are easy to fix unless you consider life cycle costs, it is frequently cheaper to buy another body with an all mechanical camera, but more frequently necessary with a more 'complex' electronic camera.

Hi Noel!

But consider that when an electronic camera breaks down, it is often due to corrosion, bad contacts, or "cold solder joints". Problems that are easy to fix as well!!

Xmas · Dec 23, 2014

flavio81 said:
Hi Noel!

But consider that when an electronic camera breaks down, it is often due to corrosion, bad contacts, or "cold solder joints". Problems that are easy to fix as well!!

Such faults are typical of an OM1 meter the auto cameras also have electro magnet in shutters, flexi rigid circuit boards, surface mounted devices, LCDs, etc., ... Each inventions of devil.

film_man · Dec 24, 2014

You know I keep hearing about how mechanical cameras are more reliable or easier to fix and electronic ones are this and that.

I have a 15 year old Canon EOS 300, all electronic, plastic fantastic that has been dropped, kicked and whatnot yet it still works just fine.

I had a 10+ year old Canon EOS 3 that looked like it was driven over, still worked fine.

I had a pristine looking OM-1 that had a broken mirror-up switch and needed the foam replaced on the prism as it was eating the glass.

I had a Nikon FM2n that had slow speeds.

I had a Hasselblad ELX that went 3 times in for the same fault, eventually I got rid of it.

I had a Hasselblad 501CM that had a so much play with the back that if you advanced fast enough the back would jump and skip the frame.

So the only cameras that have been trouble free for me are the electronic ones and if I want to replace them it is £10 for a EOS 300 and £70-80 for the EOS 3, which is a lot less than the usual £100-150 of a service a 35mm camera needs or £200+ medium format gear servicing costs.

Just saying.

PS
Naturally saying all that now jinxed me and since I just acquired two Leica R8 bodies these will soon get electronic issues and won't be repairable.

mr rusty · Dec 24, 2014

Off topic question for mr. rusty: how do you find the OM40 supposed large consumption of LR44 batteries?
I bought recently an OM-2SP that suffers from the same complaint and I'm monitoring its battery usage.
Thanks!

I think the issue may be partly LR44 - their voltage drops differently to SR44 - I believe Lithoium drops voltage gradually with age, whereas silver holds up till near dead and then drops off a cliff. I bought this OM40 for the grand sum of £10, just to see what they are like, and I've been using it recently instead of my normal OM1. The SR44s have now been in for about 4 months, and I've been through half a dozen films with it. It only takes 2 batteries, so no big deal here. What I have noticed however is that the shutter only takes a very light press to light up the meter LEDs in the viewfinder. I suspect many stories of bad battery consumption are because the camera is in a bag/case with the shutter lightly pressed. Unlike my X300, there is no physical on/off switch, just an auto-off.

which 50mm?

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