When is Metol an advantage in film developers (compared to Phenidone)?

[Tom Kershaw]

The preamble to this question is that I've started using the DS series of ascorbic acid based developers from Ryuji Suzuki. DS-10 (Phenidone) works well in a similar fashion to XTOL with good results (T-Max 400). However DS-2 / DS-12 use Metol as the developing agent, are designed with slow to medium speed films in mind, and work very well with the films I've tried so far, T-Max 100, Delta 100, Acros, and Pan F Plus.

The advantages of Phenidone are often discussed, in terms of lower cost, and suitability for replenished systems, but I've not come across much on the topic of any potential advantages of Metol.

 

[john_s]

Edge effects in negatives have been reported as an advantage of metol over phenidone. Even if the effects are subtle they can improve the appearance of a print.

 

[alanrockwood]

What about fog? I could be wrong, but isn't phenidone more prone to giving higher fog levels?

 

[Tom Kershaw]

The other side of this question is that I've read comments from people here and in other places that they've completely abandoned Metol, but I'm happy to use a range of developing agents.

 

[Alan Johnson]

See the chapter in The Film Developing Cookbook on Document Films.
In many cases phenidone can produce unevenness and metol does not., I have found this with CMS-20 where I had to use the metol based TDLC-103 and also with Rollei Retro 400s where Diafine substitute formula with phenidone produced unevenness but the metol version did not.

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

In many cases phenidone can produce unevenness and metol does not., I have found this with CMS-20 where I had to use the metol based TDLC-103

What speed do you get with this developer for CMS20?

 

[Pioneer]

I am with michael_r on this one. I always use the Adotech developer for CMS20. Works great.

 

[Alan Johnson]

What speed do you get with this developer for CMS20?

Please see post 53 here:
Adox CMS20 developer | Page 3 | Photrio.com Photography Forums
But from what others say it appears that the later versions of Adotech do not have any problem with uneveness.

 

[relistan]

What speed do you get with this developer for CMS20?

At the risk of running completely off the rails here.... Different developer, but this brought to mind that Rüdiger Hartung has done really nice work at EI12 in POTA. e.g. https://www.flickr.com/photos/53687643@N04/31263008207/

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

Rüdiger Hartung has done really nice work at EI12 in POTA. e.g. https://www.flickr.com/photos/53687643@N04/31263008207/

+1

 

[Raghu Kuvempunagar]

None of those dilute metol etc. developers really work well when it comes to extending the exposure scale of document/copy films. Phenidones are necessary for this.

@fs999 has got excellent results at EI:20 using Caffenol. More info is available here.

 

[Juan Valdenebro]

Metol is an advantage, compared to phenidone, when the best image structure is the first priority. MQ developers and speed enhancing developers give more speed, but both resolve less detail than metol only developers. It's also the best type of developer for small sharp grain, when diluted.
Personally, I find Perceptol the best developer for tripod work.

 

[Alan Johnson]

Ryuji may have used metol in DS-12 at least partly because it is more resistant to slow hydrolysis than phenidone but easier to obtain than dimezone-s, if the solution is made up as a concentrate.