When did the Rollei C-41 kits start using BLIX?

lensman_nh · Feb 24, 2019

I've been out of the color darkroom for a while and focusing on B&W.

I recently got back into C-41 and RA-4 printing and discovered the Rollei C-41 have gone to Blix, from separate bleach and fixer. I'm a but miffed by this, and I can't find any reasonably sized C-41 kits that use separate bleach and fix.

Freestyle sells a 5L Fuji kit, but unless it has the keeping properties of a mummified Pharaoh then it's just too big.

Any suggestions?

J.

Anon Ymous · Feb 24, 2019

Rollei sells two different C41 kits. One is the Digibase C41 kit that uses separate bleach and fixer and the other the Colorchem kit that uses blix. Local availability is another issue...

lensman_nh · Feb 24, 2019

Interesting. Freestyle says Digibase is no longer manufactured, but it still appears to be on sale in Europe.

https://www.freestylephoto.biz/66014-Rollei-Compard-Digibase-C-41-Mini-Color-Processing-Kit-10-roll

https://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/rollei-digibase-c-41-lt20-midi-kit-1l/p3337

Local availability certainly does seem to be the issue, thanks.

J.

j-stewart · Feb 24, 2019

Kodak offers c41 developer "kit" and separate bleach and fixer and stabilizer.
The C41 kit contains Parts A, B, & C. Just alloquote what you need from each component for the volume you're making.
Same with Bleach and Fixer, ordered separately. Then use the solutions to develop, bleach, fix, stabilize.
Fixer: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/prod...C62RJ63lAnqSHRoCSlYQAvD_BwE&lsft=BI:514&smp=Y

Bleach: https://www.bhphotovideo.com/c/product/27627-REG/Kodak_8255549_Flexicolor_RA_C_41RA_Bleach.html

Developer: https://www.uniquephoto.com/product...evr-rplr-3667805/_/searchString/c41 developer

lensman_nh · Feb 24, 2019

The issue with the lab size supplies is that I don't have anything like the capacity to make it worthwhile. Getting This is essentially what the Fuji kit freestyle sells - a 5 liter kit. It's just too big for what I am going to use before it goes off. I doubt it will keep for 2 years...

pentaxuser · Feb 24, 2019

lensman_nh said:
Interesting. Freestyle says Digibase is no longer manufactured, but it still appears to be on sale in Europe.

https://www.freestylephoto.biz/66014-Rollei-Compard-Digibase-C-41-Mini-Color-Processing-Kit-10-roll

https://www.firstcall-photographic.co.uk/rollei-digibase-c-41-lt20-midi-kit-1l/p3337

Local availability certainly does seem to be the issue, thanks.

J.

If there are still two kits but one is no longer exported to the U.S. or Freestyle have decided against importing them then you'd hope that Freestyle would tell you that as opposed to saying that the Digibase kit is no longer manufactured.

"My dog doesn't eat meat" is a true but wholly misleading statement unless I add "it's because I don't give him any"

pentaxuser

Anon Ymous · Feb 24, 2019

The funny thing is, I just checked macodirect.de and the digibase kits are available, as oposed to the cholorchem (blix) kits, which are sold out.

Rudeofus · Feb 24, 2019

It appears that the general trend goes towards simpler and easier to use kits. When I asked a friend of mine who runs a retailer here, he told me "we could sell a lot more kits if people didn't have to mix color developer from three concentrates". People are deadly afraid of the complexity of color processing!

If you want a small kit, yet use separate bleach and fixer, and are not afraid of a tiny bit of self mixing, you could follow my procedure to turn a BLIX kit into one with separate bleach and fixer.

lantau · Feb 25, 2019

Rudeofus said:
It appears that the general trend goes towards simpler and easier to use kits. When I asked a friend of mine who runs a retailer here, he told me "we could sell a lot more kits if people didn't have to mix color developer from three concentrates". People are deadly afraid of the complexity of color processing!

Then they should sell the Compard Digibase (3x) 500ml kit. Ready to use solutions in flexible pouches. Use and fill it back into the pouch with a funnel. That was my first kit with which I tried C41.

It's bleach and seperate fixer. And the manufacturer claims the working solutions are are so dilute that no haz mat regulations apply.

I heard that Digibase is repackaged Fuji. The concentrates require starter.

trendland · Feb 25, 2019

lensman_nh said:
I've been out of the color darkroom for a while and focusing on B&W.

I recently got back into C-41 and RA-4 printing and discovered the Rollei C-41 have gone to Blix, from separate bleach and fixer. I'm a but miffed by this, and I can't find any reasonably sized C-41 kits that use separate bleach and fix.

Freestyle sells a 5L Fuji kit, but unless it has the keeping properties of a mummified Pharaoh then it's just too big.

Any suggestions?

J.

Your question should be answered. But (perhaps) it is from further interis to ASK :

When did manufacturers start with blix?
From my point it began with liquit kits.....!

with regards

PS : The "last" avaiability of c41 powder developer I remember was around 2002!!

Before that Tetenal decided to kits (they named it "tabs") to come to more confortable dosage!

Rudeofus · Feb 25, 2019

trendland said:
PS : The "last" avaiability of c41 powder developer I remember was around 2002!!

You can still buy powder C-41 kits today, and guess what: they're BLIX kits!

mshchem · Feb 25, 2019

Unique photo sells Flexicolor C 41 RA Bleach and Fixer if you run a water wash, you can use the Flexicolor "final rinse " no stabilizer. You can get 5 liters of everything you will need for around 125 bucks including ground UPS. The bleach is 56 dollars for 5 liters. You can replenish the bleach, a few mL per 135-36. The fixer is 12 bucks, Developer is 14 bucks . In practice I buy developer and fixer. The bleach is eternal. I use the developer 1 shot, it's cheaper than Rodinal, HC-110 etc.

Alaris makes this stuff in their own plant in China, it's good stuff. The RA C41 saves time the bleach and fixer times are on the order of 1 minute each. This is what the fast minilabs use. You can use longer bleach times doesn't hurt.

I love processing film. I still prefer the Kodak and Fuji chemistry if I can get it. (Tetenal has given me good results. If you don't over use it)

trendland · Feb 26, 2019

Rudeofus said:
You can still buy powder C-41 kits today, and guess what: they're BLIX kits!

Aha - well - I never noticed the availability of it since ~ 1,5 decades. The last I saw (the remaining from a discontinued Tetenal batch) was at ~ 6,50 USD /liter. But no problem to make it from raw chemicals.
With regards

lensman_nh · Feb 26, 2019

mshchem said:
Unique photo sells Flexicolor C 41 RA Bleach and Fixer if you run a water wash, you can use the Flexicolor "final rinse " no stabilizer. You can get 5 liters of everything you will need for around 125 bucks including ground UPS. The bleach is 56 dollars for 5 liters. You can replenish the bleach, a few mL per 135-36. The fixer is 12 bucks, Developer is 14 bucks . In practice I buy developer and fixer. The bleach is eternal. I use the developer 1 shot, it's cheaper than Rodinal, HC-110 etc.

Alaris makes this stuff in their own plant in China, it's good stuff. The RA C41 saves time the bleach and fixer times are on the order of 1 minute each. This is what the fast minilabs use. You can use longer bleach times doesn't hurt.

I love processing film. I still prefer the Kodak and Fuji chemistry if I can get it. (Tetenal has given me good results. If you don't over use it)

That is an interesting take, using it one shot. I'm going to run the numbers on that. If the developer is 15 bucks then even if it goes off before I use it all it's still worth it. Any clues on how long the developer lasts, timewise (week/months)?

J.

mshchem · Feb 26, 2019

lensman_nh said:
That is an interesting take, using it one shot. I'm going to run the numbers on that. If the developer is 15 bucks then even if it goes off before I use it all it's still worth it. Any clues on how long the developer lasts, timewise (week/months)?

J.

If you keep it in full bottles the working solution lasts a couple months . Full meaning no air space. I split the concentrates, top off with butane. The concentrates keep well. As cheap as it is I keep a couple of the Developer kits on the shelf so when in doubt I start with fresh. You do need a starter with the developer, it's super cheap something like 8 bucks and will keep forever and make up a lot of working solution.

mshchem · Feb 26, 2019

LU developer REPLENISHER (I believe LU stands for low use) 5L of replenisher ,which makes more than 5L of working (tank solution ) $13.95

https://www.uniquephoto.com/product...p1-832-0608-8231672/_/searchString/flexicolor

Flexicolor Developer starter $14.00 for 1.2 L bottle. Used to make working tank solution of C41 developer. To make 1L of developer you use 800mL of REPLENISHER, 25mL of STARTER, and 175mL of WATER.
https://www.uniquephoto.com/product...r-lorr-1-2l-6601074/_/searchString/flexicolor

So the 5L of developer REPLENISHER will make 6.25 L of working tank solution of C41 developer. The 1.2 L STARTER will make 48 L of working tank solution of C41 developer .

The cost per L would be 13.95/6.25=$2.23 (replenisher) + $14.00/48=$0.29 (starter) -> $2.52/L C41 DEVELOPER.

If you are using a Jobo one shot, the volume of developer works out perfectly. If I was using a Paterson tank I would (example 120 uses 500mL) I would consider traditional replenishment IF I had the volume to justify. The other option for using a small inversion tank would be to use half new developer and half once used developer. This was how Cibachrome kits worked.

Whew, this is more math than I'm used to. I hope I got it right
Best Regards Mike

lensman_nh · Feb 26, 2019

Thank you very much for that information. I think I have a way forward.

J.

RPC · Feb 26, 2019

lensman_nh said:
Any clues on how long the developer lasts, timewise (week/months)?

J.

I store Kodak C-41 and RA-4 mixed (working solution) developers in tightly sealed, filled, glass jars and have had them last years and still give excellent results; in fact they hardly change color. It is all a matter of preventing oxidation. I have always mixed a whole kit.

mshchem · Feb 26, 2019

RPC said:
I store Kodak C-41 and RA-4 mixed (working solution) developers in tightly sealed, filled, glass jars and have had them last years and still give excellent results; in fact they hardly change color. It is all a matter of preventing oxidation. I have always mixed a whole kit.

I kept a bottle of XTOL stock solution in a PET soda bottle with all the air squeezed out.

I found the bottle in a closet, it got misplaced during a move IT WAS 11 YEARS OLD. Looked like light beer. I used it on a test roll, it worked fine. I couldn't believe it. Glass bottles with a poly seal cone lid will keep solutions for years when stored at around 68°F.

RPC has got the results. I suspect splitting concentrates may not be the best way. Hermetically sealed glass bottles stored in a cool, dimly lit environment may be the best way.

AgX · Feb 26, 2019

Anon Ymous said:
The funny thing is, I just checked macodirect.de and the digibase kits are available, as oposed to the cholorchem (blix) kits, which are sold out.

"Sold out" but they offer to notify you when available again, thus seemingly not cancelled.

mshchem · Feb 27, 2019

mshchem said:
I kept a bottle of XTOL stock solution in a PET soda bottle with all the air squeezed out.

I found the bottle in a closet, it got misplaced during a move IT WAS 11 YEARS OLD. Looked like light beer. I used it on a test roll, it worked fine. I couldn't believe it. Glass bottles with a poly seal cone lid will keep solutions for years when stored at around 68°F.

RPC has got the results. I suspect splitting concentrates may not be the best way. Hermetically sealed glass bottles stored in a cool, dimly lit environment may be the best way.

This is a Poly Seal lid. Leak proof, air tight

Anon Ymous · Feb 27, 2019

AgX said:
"Sold out" but they offer to notify you when available again, thus seemingly not cancelled.

Hmmm, when Tetenal resumes operations?

halfaman · Feb 27, 2019

Anon Ymous said:
Hmmm, when Tetenal resumes operations?

April 1st but I think they are still producing today with reduced personnel. They have even backlog due to all chapter 11 issue, perhaps that is the problem behind the stocks break.

AgX · Feb 27, 2019

April 1st is the date for Tetenal to be dissolved, not the date to resume operations.
New Tetenal first must be established physically.

koraks · Feb 27, 2019

AgX said:
April 1st is the date for Tetenal to be dissolved, not the date to resume operations.
New Tetenal first must be established physically.

Same date. New Tetenal are planning to start production on 1 April as well.

When did the Rollei C-41 kits start using BLIX?

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