What's the status of Rodinal?

Bruce Osgood · Jun 13, 2006

Has it made its' way back under a new name or is it gone forever?

thebanana · Jun 13, 2006

I believe it's still being produced. There's tons of it at my favourite shop in Winnipeg at least.

reellis67 · Jun 13, 2006

There are a number of posts on this, but it is back just as before and you can get it at Freestyle and other online shops. The images I've seen even show the same packaging as before.

- Randy

argus · Jun 13, 2006

There's a large stock in my darkroom.

On the real status of the production and/or sale of Rodinal, opinions differ.
I know I can buy it.

G

Bruce Osgood · Jun 13, 2006

Thanks, my two usual sources (Adorama and B&H) only list Photograpers Formulary kits. I'll look around in their stores tomorrow.

Tom Hoskinson · Jun 13, 2006

argus said:
There's a large stock in my darkroom.

On the real status of the production and/or sale of Rodinal, opinions differ.
I know I can buy it.

G

But... is it the REAL Rodinal? Is the Pixie Dust exactly the same?

Hans Borjes · Jun 13, 2006

If your shops run out of stock, why not asking them directly?

Dead Link Removed
Chemische Fabrik Vaihingen
Steinbeisstr. 49
D-71665 Vaihingen/Enz
Telefon: +49 (0) 7042.913-11
Telefax: +49 (0) 7042.913-18

This is where it is supposedly still being produced.

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

Bruce (Camclicker) said:
Thanks, my two usual sources (Adorama and B&H) only list Photograpers Formulary kits. I'll look around in their stores tomorrow.

Ask for the real Rodinal and tell them they can get it from the factory.

fhovie · Jun 13, 2006

There is an unlimited supply of FRESH rodinal - get a scale - a mixing bowl and p-aminophenol, sodium metabisultfite and potasium hyroxide. Easier than making cookies. All supplies are at the formulary. Or buy the kits. The shelf life of the chemicals unmixed and dry are very good.

Or try Pyrocat - P --- I think you might find that it satisfies your p-aminophenol itch and actually looks better. It is worth a try.

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

This is wrong. Making Rodinal is actually very difficult and the exact process is secret.

Paul Sorensen · Jun 13, 2006

I just ordered it from Freestyle. They ran out of it and I expected it to come back with A&O packaging or something, but what they have is Agfa, at least on their web site. It should arrive tomorrow, if it says anything new, I will let you know. The upshot is that I really don't know where it is coming from. When A&O bought Agfa's chemicals, did they buy the right to market them as Agfa as well?

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

A&O bought Agfa's liquid chemicals plant from AgfaPhoto and Agfa allows them to market the chemicals with the Agfa brand. So it's the same factory, the same staff, the same recipe, and the same brand name as always. They produce the full range of Agfa b/w and color chemicals, not just Rodinal. Note that only AgfaPhoto is currently under administration, not Agfa itself.

Gerald Koch · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
Making Rodinal is actually very difficult and the exact process is secret.

While the exact formula for Agfa Rodinal is a secret, there are dozens of formulas for Rodinal-type developers. These formulas are not difficult to make but as the Morgan & Morgan Darkroom Data Book states they do require "those that can follow directions accurately". Rodinal and similar developers are different in that you cannot just dump all the ingredients into a certain amount of water like you can with D-76 and other common developers.

Paul Sorensen · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
Note that only AgfaPhoto is currently under administration, not Agfa itself.

That is why I was wondering if they had the rights to the name Agfa. I am sure that Agfa wants to keep control of its name and that A&O would have to have made arrangements to use the name. I guess I was expecting a new label "A&O Rodinal" or something of the like. Do you know if there is any way that one can tell the difference between pre A&O and current Rodinal?

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

Making Rodinal substitutes may be difficult, but making Rodinal is even more difficult, and requires special equipment.

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

Paul Sorensen said:
Do you know if there is any way that one can tell the difference between pre A&O and current Rodinal?

There is no difference.

fhovie · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
This is wrong. Making Rodinal is actually very difficult and the exact process is secret.

It might be a little wrong. When I tortured the Agfa chemist, before he expired, he said it takes 2 mixing bowls and two mixtures have to be made and mixed together until a sediment forms and then disolves and repeated until both mixtures are one. And then there is the secret ingredient that is put in to correct for hard water but does not effect the image in any way. So - yes - my 10 year old could not do it. A google search on Rodinal formula yields pretty detailed instructions. It is not going to explode or release fatal doses of a colorless oderless gas. Of course, care should be taken with the hydroxide and you should not get anything on your skin or breathe vapors or dust. It is about as hazardous as fueling your car. I haven't bought packaged developers in 6 years. I have mixed a dozen different kinds of developer and I found out one thing:

They all work great and are easy to do. (Except a bad experience I had with Diafine - it worked bad.) And then there is that aweful smell of Microphen after it is six months old. I still have nightmares. I would never discourage someone from mixing their own chemistries. I was fearful at first but it has been a very rewarding aspect to the artistic process. So - jump in - the water is fine.

Tom Hoskinson · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
This is wrong. Making Rodinal is actually very difficult and the exact process is secret.

Actually, Frank Hovie is correct. Making a concentrated P-Aminophenol developer is very easy. The results I obtain with my home mix match the results I obtain with Agfa Rodinal (the version I purchased from Freestyle in 2004).

I don't add any Pixie Dust to my home mixed P-Aminophenol developer.

Paul Sorensen · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
There is no difference.

I was talking about labeling and packaging, not performance. It only matters to me in that I would love to know that the new stuff is indeed getting to the US and we can count on our supply being steady.

Tom Hoskinson · Jun 13, 2006

Paul Sorensen said:
I was talking about labeling and packaging, not performance. It only matters to me in that I would love to know that the new stuff is indeed getting to the US and we can count on our supply being steady.

I could care less about labeling and packaging. Developer performance is what I care about.

High quality P-aminophenol (Base) and P-aminophenol HCL are readily available from Photographers Formulary and other sources.

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

Paul Sorensen said:
I was talking about labeling and packaging, not performance. It only matters to me in that I would love to know that the new stuff is indeed getting to the US and we can count on our supply being steady.

I'll try to find out.

Petzi · Jun 13, 2006

Tom Hoskinson said:
Actually, Frank Hovie is correct. Making a concentrated P-Aminophenol developer is very easy. The results I obtain with my home mix match the results I obtain with Agfa Rodinal (the version I purchased from Freestyle in 2004).

I don't add any Pixie Dust to my home mixed P-Aminophenol developer.

I'm glad that you are happy with your home brew developer, and I don't mean to discourage skilled people from making their own developer. However, you can't make Rodinal at home. You don't have the equipment and the knowledge.

srs5694 · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
I'm glad that you are happy with your home brew developer, and I don't mean to discourage skilled people from making their own developer. However, you can't make Rodinal at home. You don't have the equipment and the knowledge.

IMHO, the two sides of this debate are talking at cross purposes. The Agfa Rodinal we know today (or from, say, a year ago, just to leave out any questions related to the recent business collapse) is actually just the latest incarnation in a line of "Rodinal" formulas going back to 1891. The commercial Agfa Rodinal has a proprietary formula that is (presumably) closely related to those that have been published, but AFAIK this proprietary formula has never been published. That being the case, I can't address the question of whether or not it could be made in a homebrew way, and presumably nobody else here can, unless that person has access to the proprietary Agfa/A&O formula.

That said, I've heard that the trademark on the name "Rodinal" lapsed some time ago, so from a legal point of view, anybody could call anything they want "Rodinal" and get away with it. (Somebody please correct me if I'm wrong on this score.) If I'm right, or even if I'm wrong, as a common usage, IMHO it's ridiculous to attack somebody for calling another derivative of the original 1891 formula "Rodinal."

Paul Sorensen · Jun 13, 2006

Tom Hoskinson said:
I could care less about labeling and packaging. Developer performance is what I care about.

High quality P-aminophenol (Base) and P-aminophenol HCL are readily available from Photographers Formulary and other sources.

I trust that the performance of the A&O is going to be the same, I am more concerned about the supply since I am not interested in making it myself.

Gerald Koch · Jun 13, 2006

Petzi said:
You don't have the equipment and the knowledge.

You have mentioned special equipment twice now, what special equipment is needed and what is the basis of your assertion?

What's the status of Rodinal?

Bruce Osgood

Membership Council

thebanana

reellis67

argus

Bruce Osgood

Membership Council

Tom Hoskinson

Hans Borjes

Petzi

fhovie

Petzi

Paul Sorensen

Petzi

Gerald Koch

Paul Sorensen

Petzi

Petzi

fhovie

Tom Hoskinson

Paul Sorensen

Tom Hoskinson

Petzi

Petzi

srs5694

Paul Sorensen

Gerald Koch

What's the status of Rodinal?

Membership Council

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