what's a the ideal film for a newbie

BradS · Aug 13, 2009

keithwms said:
Isn't the Arista.EDU Ultra available in 4x5? I thought that was basically tri-x 400. Sorry if I am wrong, but that is my recollection.

well, yes and no. Arista edu ultra is available in 4x5 but, NO. it absolutely is not Tri-x...far far from it. It is Foma....Not a bad film but certainly not Tri-X.

psvensson · Aug 13, 2009

Delta 100 and 400. Can be exposed comfortably at box speed, have finer grain and higher accutance than Tri-X. They're also less sensitive to changes in developer and development process.

Thomas Bertilsson · Aug 13, 2009

Any of the above films is a good place to start. The importance lies in learning your materials. No film is really superior to another. Intimate knowledge of your film can be had by using it a lot and printing your negatives often, or else you will fail to understand how changes affect your results.

Pick something that is readily available. Kodak / Ilford / Fuji films and chemistry is a sure bet almost anywhere.

RobertV · Aug 13, 2009

It doesn't matter which film you're going to use unless for you it's available in your selected three formats.
35mm, 120 rollfilm and 4x5".

A good quality-price preformance has Foma from the Czech Republic and the film is available in your formats.
Fomapan 100 feels very well in Rodinal 1+50 so this prevents you for searching for some different developers. Rodinal 1+50 is cheap in use, very reliable and almost fool proof.

Rate the Fomapan 100/Arista EDU Ultra 100 for iso 80 in Rodinal and your results will be great.
Especially in the beginning when you're unexperienced the dumping of a roll or sheet of film is not very dramatic with these prices.

clayne · Aug 13, 2009

Tri-X w/ D-76. This by far is the most stable and versatile combo out there. In addition, A LOT of people have experience with it and can help you troubleshoot errors/questions.

brofkand · Aug 13, 2009

For 35mm, I'd recommend buying from Freestyle and getting Arista Premium films. The 100 speed film is Plus-X, which is simply an amazing film. The 400 speed is Tri-X, which is also very highly regarded.

For 120, Plus-X and Tri-X are also good choices.

In those formats, all the brands are pretty much around the same price (Ilford and Kodak, that is).

For 4x5 and larger, Kodak gets kind of expensive and I don't really feel it's worth the extra money they charge. For 4x5, either go with Ilford FP4 or HP5 (their kinda-sorta Plus-X and Tri-X "equivalents), or Arista EDU Ultra film, which is very cheap. I am not a fan at all of EDU Ultra. Others love it, but I don't like the way it behaves.

As for developer, I'd recommend D-76 or Ilford's ID-11 equivalent.

In short, you simply go wrong with Plus-X or Tri-X (depending on the speed you need, 125 or 400), in D-76.

As you grow in your craft, try Rodinal or other developers. Once you master Tri-X in Rodinal, switch it up. Like JBrunner says, the key is to change one thing at a time.

markbarendt · Aug 14, 2009

jaimeb82 said:
To be honest, to my eyes all this films look good, so I guess I could just flip a coin and go for one or the other and start taking pictures. I just wanted to know if someone has any recommendations for a beginner.

Thanks.

Yes, flip a coin, buy some film and start taking and printing pictures.

When you define a real problem ask how to solve it.

Nothing else matters at the beginning.

clayne · Aug 14, 2009

markbarendt said:
Yes, flip a coin, buy some film and start taking and printing pictures.

When you define a real problem ask how to solve it.

Nothing else matters at the beginning.

Actually, a good control DOES matter at the beginning otherwise you don't know what the heck you're doing wrong. At the beginning, plenty of things will go wrong - in fact one is better off with things going wrong as they can learn from it rather than lucking out.

The good control is Tri-X in D-76 as almost everyone here is familiar with it and can offer honest and useful advice.

One should keep it simple, consistent, and predictable at the beginning.

Curt · Aug 14, 2009

Tri-X and D76, 4x5 sheet film, view camera, any model like the inexpensive Calumet, Toyo etc., and a 210mm lens. Get the New Zone System manual by Minor White or Zone VI Workshop book by Fred Picker or look for the Nine Negative test. Find your personal film speed and Normal development time then move on to Normal Minus and Normal Plus development times. Master this and you will be able to move to any format, film, and lens combination. After you have the personal EI and development time you can work with bellows extension compensation and go on to camera movements.

Best,
Curt

markbarendt · Aug 14, 2009

clayne,

While this is good, no great, advice.
-------------------------

clayne said:
One should keep it simple, consistent, and predictable at the beginning.

-------------------------

The following is simply your preference and conjecture.
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clayne said:
The good control is Tri-X in D-76 as almost everyone here is familiar with it and can offer honest and useful advice.

-------------------------

Do you have data to back up your "almost everyone" statement?

Have I used Tri-X and D-76? Yes.

Does my lifetime total of 12 sheets of 4x5 Tri-X 320 and 3 rolls of 135-400 in D76 qualify me as "familiar"? No.

Is there no one on APUG that uses Delta with Xtol or TMax with HC-110?

My point is simply that given the OP's question about choosing between Tmax, Tri-X, or Delta there is no way to make a bad decision and that experience will teach him the rest.

jaimeb82 · Aug 14, 2009

Thanks for the advice. This is what came out of it. I decided to go with Arista Premium 100 and 400, price and quality were the winners. I am heading to Spain for the next two weeks so I realized the Freestyle order will not get here on time before my trip. Then I decided to go with Tri-x 100 and 400, got to the shop and the seller tells me there is not TX 100. He says that the TX 100 is called TMax100. I am like "Wait a minute?" Those are two different films. I got kind of confuse so I made what I am not sure it was the best decision.

Delta 100(10 films of 36 exp.) $52.90 Auch!!
Delta 400(5 films 36 exp.) $25.95 Auch!!
Xtol Developer A+B = 5 liters
Ilford Rapid Fixer 500ml - 2.5 liters(1+4) or 5 liters(1+9)
Kodak Indicator Stop Bath
Kodak Photo-Flo
One metal tank and two 35mm reels.

I am now worried that I didn't go with Kodak TX, what it seems a more forgiving film for starters. Ilford seems to be more for the experienced photographer. Was that an error? I am putting all that into my bag tonight and heading to Spain. I will be taking pictures there and developing on my own.

All the answers helped me a lot in any case.

Cheers!

WolfTales · Aug 14, 2009

Tri-X + D76;

or

HP5 + Ilfosol.

Yep - TMax aint so forgiving but you should get ok/printable results as long as you stay near exposure and development limits.

markbarendt · Aug 14, 2009

jaimeb82 said:
Thanks for the advice. This is what came out of it. I decided to go with Arista Premium 100 and 400, price and quality were the winners. I am heading to Spain for the next two weeks so I realized the Freestyle order will not get here on time before my trip. Then I decided to go with Tri-x 100 and 400, got to the shop and the seller tells me there is not TX 100. He says that the TX 100 is called TMax100. I am like "Wait a minute?" Those are two different films. I got kind of confuse so I made what I am not sure it was the best decision.

Delta 100(10 films of 36 exp.) $52.90 Auch!!
Delta 400(5 films 36 exp.) $25.95 Auch!!
Xtol Developer A+B = 5 liters
Ilford Rapid Fixer 500ml - 2.5 liters(1+4) or 5 liters(1+9)
Kodak Indicator Stop Bath
Kodak Photo-Flo
One metal tank and two 35mm reels.

I am now worried that I didn't go with Kodak TX, what it seems a more forgiving film for starters. Ilford seems to be more for the experienced photographer. Was that an error? I am putting all that into my bag tonight and heading to Spain. I will be taking pictures there and developing on my own.

All the answers helped me a lot in any case.

Cheers!

Do not worry, have fun in Spain.

The Deltas are gorgeous films and develop nicely and have been plenty forgiving for me. Xtol is a great choice too.

As clayne suggests, be consistent, use the standard times from each chemical's instruction sheet as a start. Vary only when you have a real reason to do so.

No Ilford is not necessarily for more experienced users, each film simply has it's own artistic "personality". Once you have printed from the Deltas define what you do and don't like and ask how to fix that.

On your trip you will probably get a good feel for whether you like shooting with a 100 or 400 speed film better, that preference will apply across the board to any film. When you print you'll get a feel for whether you prefer 100 or 400 for the print.

Beyond that just have fun.

what's a the ideal film for a newbie

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