What Would be Your Response (Or, Why I often shoot "off the beaten track")?

I once had an entire family walk around me and stand directly in front of my lens, all the while chatting about "the guy with the old fashioned camera" and never thinking for a moment that I might be serious about taking a photograph. When anyone takes interest I am thrilled. I don't like to be interrupted too much so generally answer their question briefly and then tell them that I really need to concentrate to keep from making mistakes. People always seem to respond properly.

eddie said:

I think you overreacted, and missed an opportunity to let a few people know film is alive, and there's a reason we choose it.

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+a lot.

dances_w_clouds said:

I find that a few minutes out of my busy schedule of shooting really does not make ANY difference. Not that you would have to explain the whole process of developing and printing the film of the shot to them but a bit of courtesy goes a long way in the world. Yes you over reacted for a simple explanation. I do not know you personally but from reading your posts you seem like a nice gentleman so the swearing sounds like you were just having a bad day. As for the sunrise @ Lake Louise it has been done by many many people in the past so what you were doing was just an interest not a competition issue. BTW The best shots I have found were the sunsets looking out across the lake. Hope you had good light the whole trip.

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I think, in retrospect "DWC," two separate "precursors" if you will, set me off (I am, by nature, tolerant and engaging, and, in the words of my eldest nephew " pedantically passionate" about sharing the joys of film photography). Firstly, this trip - 2500+km in two days - was a bit much to be restful (and yes I was jacked on coffee ((Two pots of Starbucks Guatemalan for breakfast and several Monsters as chasers))); and secondly, the "intrusions" if you will are just the latest in a long line I have dealt with this year (to wit: Polar bear Dip in Victoria (two women constantly following me around and shooting either beside me or over my shoulder; Victoria Highland Games in May (people following me and shooting beside me wherever I wandered; Calgary Stampede in July (setting up a "portrait studio" on the side of the stage, I had a woman wait until I had everything set up (about 12 different performers) and then shoot over my shoulder...and then smirking when I cut her with a look that would kill; and, most recently at the Jasper Rodeo in July, where suddenly the vantage point I had chosen - away from the other photogs there - seemed to collect a large contingent of the digital p&s (flash always on) crowd as the event unfolded.

BTW: This additional info was not intended as an apologia of sorts, but rather to make clear to some of the responses posted thus far that I am NOT by nature "a dick" "Boorish, etc." What transpired was a long time coming, and yes I do regret being uncivil....

I would say you were over reacting in both ocassion.
Incident 1: I would simply tell the person that " No, because it's a film camera there is simply no advantage having an LCD". I would reply more if the person would ask more. I would rather want to make friend to the person.
Incident 2: I would not do anything and feel good that someone was trying to copy my shot. Nevertherless I don't think anyone can copy my shot even if I tried to explain to them.

Hang a sign on your back: "DO NOT DISTURB. I GET NASTY."

That should keep 'em away.

I don't know! You're anoyyed that someone took a shot of your setup in public place. I thought part of the photographer's right is freedom to shoot anything on public place.

I must admit that I too would find it indescent if some uses a set-up I would have staged in public to use for their own by mimicking my point of view. Though I had no problem myself photographing such stage in a way that it is clear that it is a stage by someone else and I rather showing that being-photographed situation than mimicking the portrait as intended.

BradleyK, it does sound as if you are better off, as am I, doing our serious photography "off the beaten track."

There are those who, though they do get along well with others, prefer to be alone and will actually seek out solitude.

There are others who hate to be alone and will go to great lengths to be in social situations.

Neither group really understands the other.

The social ones will be appalled and will recommend that you need to spend lots of time talking to others about what you are doing. To them you missed out on a great chance to proselytize in the cause of film.

The solitude lovers may not say so but they are nodding their heads in private because they recognize your frustration and actually applaud your desire to be left alone.

But, since cursing others out is really not a good solution, you should probably use a less confrontational response when this happens again.

Good luck in your search for places that are "off the beaten track."

Others will obviously disagree, but i think this is hilarious. 'cretin' really? haha, but then again i myself can be an a**hole.

On the other hand, if it bothers you, then yeah, you probably over did it. none of us were there, but if someone got that close to my equipment, i would be kinda worried myself actually. Also, i don't know who is supposed to say hi to the other party, whoever was there first, or those who came afterwards... while other cultures seem less adept at personal space, i myself make sure to keep far enough from people so as not to intrude into theirs.

while the op didn't mention attempting to speak to the other parties, it seems that the other parties where more critical, than inquisitive, not my type of person to speak with either, so while i might say you over reacted, i don't blame you for reacting as you did.

Also i'd be so pissed off if someone tried to put their camera in the EXACT same spot i did, how annoying is that! but whatever.if anything the OP should have marked his territory .
Anyway, as others have mentioned maybe saying hi, and telling others that you take your photography AND PERSONAL SPACE seriously, will give you the space you need.

You were an asshole in both cases. They didn't do anything to prevent you from doing your work, as far as I can tell from the story. What does it hurt you to have somebody take a photograph like you did after you have left the scene? You are probably a better photographer than they, anyway. You don't own the land under your tripod. Lighten up.

BradleyK said:

...yes I do regret being uncivil....

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Live and learn Took some real courage to discuss this matter and by the statement above, I'm sure next time around you'll react different. I commend you for asking us to check your back. By the very fact that you even posted this for peer-review means you mean well, if you didn't you'd never have taken the time for a "check my back post".

Last, the below is one that keeps my head up after a bad decision/reaction (or two )
“Do the best you can until you know better. Then when you know better, do better.” ― Maya Angelou

You sound delusional to me. Seek help before you hurt yourself or others. Unless you own the land and they were trespassing on land that you own, you showed a total lack of manners or respect for others. Like some crazy driver thinking that some one did something deliberate to you rather than perhaps and error in their judgment. JMHO

I would add that those people have every right to stand behind you as you have to stand in front of them. You are too full of yourself. Get over yourself. You are nobody. We are all nobody. That realization is a better way to live than what you are doing.

pbromaghin said:

I would add that those people have every right to stand behind you as you have to stand in front of them. You are too full of yourself. Get over yourself. You are nobody. We are all nobody. That realization is a better way to live than what you are doing.

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IMHO This is a bit over the top in the other direction. I am indeed somebody and don't mind asserting myself when necessary. With that philosophy you would not have lasted long where I grew up!

The first incident, yeah...not good, it actually made me quite sad to read it.
I only run into this kind of thing if I am in a popular spot like over the weekend at the Maroon Bells. I had some 8x10 silver prints in my film holder case in order to share why I am shooting film.

But the second one, I'm behind you 100% because I make my living at this, I never let anyone copy my shot, ever and I am REALLY quite bothered by some of the rude responses you have gotten here. Yes, I will sound off by asking them to please not copy my vision if it clearly looks like that is what they are about to do, but I usually employ more clever tactics before it ever comes to that.

If it is a scene that is not using complex layers of cool secondary or primary subject matter and perhaps only has interesting light, I will wait it out until the light is gone effectively preventing the invader from ever copying it. I routinely make a note of what azimuth number my camera is pointing on the tripod and point at a decoy shot until the potential copycats are gone. Most of the time, I can fake out the perp by doing something to distract them, I had to really start doing this about 10 years ago due to the digital and Internet age.

There is NO reason to copy someone else's photo, period! I find it to be rude as hell and truly disgusting behavior and I will stop at nothing to get in the way of who would think to do it. Public place or not my vision is my vision and my livelyhood depends on it. Thankfully it almost never comes to verbal engagement since I have developed lots of strategies to prevent it.

Yes you did overreact, but I can totally understand why you were p!@#%* off. Maybe next time just bore them into oblivion with pixels or something ?..... Or just work on looking meaner!

or work on being more polite, amenable, patient, humble, thoughtful, generous, open-minded ...

"I don't crop" as a photographic dogma is almost as offensive to me. That statement seems equally instructive about your personality in addition to the confession of foul and demeaning language to a curious stranger.

I have to admit though, it is a beautiful part of the world which I saw for the first time last year. Part of the trip was on a bus with a bunch of boorish, racist, ignorant, cashed-up bogan Australians. I doubt you would have lasted 30 minutes before lashing out and shouting "fucking moron" at some of them. I thought it many times but had the good grace to keep the peace and not say it to their face. Yes, I know I'm a snob, but I try my best not to let it show

Really? All the Australians I've met have been laid back genuine nice people. And that's more than a few. Right now I'm actually considering taking a position and moving to Tasmania.

I haven't been that lucky.

Get yourself a view camera and when the "cretins" come, hide under the dark cloth. That's what I do.

PKM-25 said:

...and I am REALLY quite bothered by some of the rude responses you have gotten here.

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Very good point. I notice some responses that feel he was overly rude seem quite rude themselves. If we feel he could have handled it in a less "rude" manner, we could also be less rude in telling him.

Agree^

The irony here is palpable. We could make our own Iron Blue Toner with this thread's irony

Ah hell, we all over-react now and again. At least next time you'll be better prepared with how to respond. And it WILL happen again! Forget about it and move on.

Truzi said:

Very good point. I notice some responses that feel he was overly rude seem quite rude themselves. If we feel he could have handled it in a less "rude" manner, we could also be less rude in telling him.

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Unlike many of my fellow carbon-based bipeds, I am not thin-skinned: I never take insults to heart. Having realized I overstepped the bounds of propriety (the tirade, as I stated in a follow-up post, was a long time coming, the end result of a host of like-experiences which occurred in fairly quick succession, over a relatively short period of time), I will, in the future, adhere to the sage advice of DanB: occupy your space until the light or composition changes. As I also noted in my follow-up post, it is more my nature to engage folks on the virtues of photography and, especially, the medium of film. To that end, I have photographed for others - using a greater variety of cameras than most of the folks who post here have ever seen - in cities all over: tourists in the French Quarter, Down-town Atlanta, Portland, Ottawa, Toronto, Vancouver, Victoria, BC and Alberta's National Parks, Calgary. It is not my nature to be surly; judging by the number of times I have provided free photographic services to others, folks generally seen to view me as approachable.

That said, one thing about the incidents I have mentioned still resonates: when someone is working, I simply do not see it as acceptable to disturb them (unless, of course, a large bear, bull elk, or similar creature is on a collision course with said individual). When I see someone with a camera on a tripod, my operative assumption is that that person is either a serious amateur or a professional. As such, I will not engage said individual until he, or she, seems to be finished whatever he, or she, happened to have been shooting. My "intrusion" does not extend beyond a quick smile or nod until such time. To repeatedly rush up to someone - without an express invite - to attempt to see what they are doing is, at best, simple rudeness; and to attempt to replicate the work of another is dishonest and betrays a lack of one's own imagination and initiative. When the frontage viewing area is in excess of 300m in length, and there are only a dozen folks the entire length, is it really necessary to park right beside someone?

Concluding, the one remark here that really did piss me off was the one about the fact that I don't crop. You, Sir, are confusing a statement of personal preference/practice with what you seem to choose to interpret as dogma. I don't crop my 35mm work because I absolutely love the dynamism of the 24x36 format; I always have. The fact that I don't crop when shooting this format also ensures a measure of self discipline. Insofar as the square format goes, I simply prefer the challenge of filling a square. To those who crop, crop away! Do what works for you!