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What has become of us all?

koraks said:
Of course, of course, sure.

You read what I wrote, it's there for a reason; see if the shoe fits. If so, try it on sometime.
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Oh dear. I failed to have the "correct" opinion so you decided to engage in verbal warfare to make it seem like I think my views are "superior". I do not. I think they are self evident. Could it be that perhaps you feel yours are inferior?

I stand by what I wrote without apology. Popularity is not a measure of artistic value and a great deal of what is spewed forth from the modern arts academy and arts business is dreck. One absolutely does not need a "superior" view to see this. One need only a reasonably average understanding of beauty and artistic merit.

As just one example (of many). The Beatles were wildly successful. Their output is loved by millions. But their compositions are musically trivial (with the exception of a few Harrison tunes) the lyrics vary between silly to banal. OK that's my option. But guess what? They're already elevator music. Even in the lifetime of the members of this group, they're losing influence and importance in the arts. The most important measure of the goodness of art isn't popularity, it's durability and their work is already fading. Rinse repeat for most of the so-called "great" modern artists in any medium who have a shorter and shorter relevance half life.

I have to go make my superior contact sheets now so I can lord them over everyone ...
 
I have no problem acknowledging my views are superior.

The influence of The Beatles will be felt on popular music long after people stop listening directly to them. Influence feeds into what others do.

Popularity does not measure merit. But it also does not invalidate it. Are you going to admire something until the swarming masses decide it's good? Will you then discard it? It appeals to the plebs, it must be pap!
 

At best, and I mean the very best, popularity is only a very indirect measure of merit. It's certainly a measure of influence as you note, but that doesn't make it good.

Once of the real sinkholes of public fora like this is people presuming the motives and intent of complete strangers, mostly because because someone hurt their tender feels or skewered one of their sacred cows. A conversation about ideas gets turned into one about the individuals discussing it. I think it was Eleanor Roosevelt that said ""Great minds discuss ideas; average minds discuss events; small minds discuss people". I prefer ideas.
 
Pieter12 said:
I would distinguish the narcissistic nature of a selfie from a self portrait. Every photograph is a self portrait.
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I wouldn’t. I do not wish to create that distinction between the two. Selfies are self portraits. They are not formal self portraits. They are not introspective self portraits. But self portraits nevertheless.

They are just the snapshots of self-portrait photography. I find the group-selfie to a class of its own!
 
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chuckroast said:
At best, and I mean the very best, popularity is only a very indirect measure of merit.
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I don't even think that. Popularity can be a measure of success - particularly for commercial success. But it really doesn't mean something is good. It doesn't mean something is bad. It just means people like it. And lots of things that people like are actually good, in whatever the most objective sense you can come up with. But it's correlation, not causation.
 
This may be the most dystopian image I've seen. Reminds me of Simon Stalenhag's work. https://www.simonstalenhag.se/es.html

koraks said:
History is written by the victors.
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I've always found an issue with this quote. It's less so that history is written by the victors, but it is preserved by those who can read and write and have the foresight to archive and protect their writing. But that is neither here nor there.

As for the New Yorker video, it reminded me of a recent experience at Horseshoe Bend. People were literally walking over signs that read roughly 'do not leave the trails' in order to get a 'better' photograph. It felt like it was easier to view the bend from the rails than elsewhere along the cliff. Not to mention the garbage left behind.


- Bill
 
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